Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Medium Drink Of Water]

I was a tibia-lengthening patient at the Beijing Institute of External Fixation for five months in 2007.  I went back and had my internal nails removed in late 2008.  I'm done with LL but wanted to come back and share my knowledge with current and future LLers.

I'm currently working on a diary about my LL experience called "Fear and Lengthening in Beijing" that you can find in the Diaries section.  But if you have any questions, go ahead and ask them here.  Unlike the people on that old forum, I'm happy to answer anything here even if it's been mentioned in my diary, just in case you don't feel like reading the whole thing.

More about me:
Race/sex: White, Male
My age when I had LL: 25
Starting height and weight: 5'7" 138 lbs.
Current height and weight: 5"10" 138 lbs.

[Sweden]

How long did it take until you could run, not walk, down stairs?

Can you sprint?(like Usain Bolt on 100 meters, but not equal fast...)

Do you feel any strain or tightness in any part of your body?

Would you dare to jump down from 1-2 meters up?

[TomD]

Question I have is, you are 3 inches taller but weigh the same? I would imagine you would weigh a little more right?

[LiveLife]

1. What is your wingspan?
2. What do you think of your proportions?  Have your thoughts changed over time?
3. Any regrets?

Very nice of you to be available to us.  Thank you.

[Medium Drink Of Water]

How long did it take until you could run, not walk, down stairs?

Can you sprint?(like Usain Bolt on 100 meters, but not equal fast...)

Do you feel any strain or tightness in any part of your body?

Would you dare to jump down from 1-2 meters up?

I could run down stairs and sprint as soon as I'd healed up from the IM nail removal surgery.  I was really careful with my legs while the nails were in, so I never tried doing either of those things until they were removed.  I used a leg press machine at a gym and ran short distances but that was the most I did while I had the IM nails.  I think most IM nail issues are caused by slow bone consolidation and/or too much physical activity.

When I squat, I feel some pressure in my knees.  The knees are also sensitive when I kneel on hard surfaces.  They're also a little stiff but they do have a full range of motion; if they were made of metal I'd think they were a tiny bit rusty.  This stiffness goes away if I do kickboxing exercises but comes back in a few hours.  I think all of these knee issues could've been avoided by doing external-only.  Cutting open the knees twice, once to put the IM nails in and then again to pull them back out was a lot of knee surgery.  I'm fine with my 5'10 height, but if I wasn't I still might not do femurs due to fear of developing hip issues similar to what's happening in my knees.

I don't have any ankle or foot issues.  My hamstring flexibility is as good as it was before LL, but my quadriceps flexibility is a little bit worse (just a tiny bit) but I have no idea why.

I would jump down from one meter, sure.  I've done that quite a few times.  I'd jump down two meters if I had to and I doubt my legs would break like Sid Eudy's (Google "Sid Vicious WCW leg break" if you're not squeamish).  I'd be mostly worried about what would happen to my knees from that two meter drop.  The tibiae themselves are really solid.

Question I have is, you are 3 inches taller but weigh the same? I would imagine you would weigh a little more right?

When I got out of the hospital I weighed about 130.  Almost everyone there lost weight; some people lost significantly more than my 8 pounds.  I weighed as much as 160 a year ago but I was eating a lot and not exercising very often.  Now I'm eating less and exercising more than ever.  But yeah, it's surprising how little 6 inches of human leg (3" on each side) actually weighs.

1. What is your wingspan?
2. What do you think of your proportions?  Have your thoughts changed over time?
3. Any regrets?

Very nice of you to be available to us.  Thank you.

1. 5'10" so it's equal to my height now.
2. I think my proportions are fine.  Nobody's ever mentioned anything about my legs looking strange.
3. I regret not being able to be happy with myself when I was 5'7".  Lots of people shorter than that manage to be happy.  Why couldn't I?  Also I regret having the IM nails put in for the reasons explained above, although I can't be 100% certain I wouldn't be having those issues if I'd done external-only.

[Sweden]

I can relate to the knee issues and I'm afraid to take out the nail in India. I hope I can do that here in Sweden. The fact that you don't feel anything when you're doing kickboxing is bc you have such greater blood flow in your knees.

I'm still going to do my femurs. The great issue there is that EVERYONE will get it and I'm passing my wingspan with 6cm. But my shins are too long with +7cm. I don't recommend doing more than 5cm - for several reasons.

I am 180cm now but I still feel short. ALL of my friends are either equal or taller.

[somecm]

Your issues on your knees in my opnion aren't because you opened your knee two times. For me it is because you did 3 inches on tibias, what makes your knee work harder. 7.5 cm on tibias is almost the same of doing 10 on femurs. This problem on your knees would be reduced if you did some cm on your femur to balance. I had titanium inside my femurs after lengthening with internals and i removed them, so I had to open my hips 4 times, and I actually don't feel anything on it. I think this issue you said has more to do with the amount you lengthen. For me ideal is 5 cm on tibias or 7 cm on femurs or both. However,  I am sure you can "survive" very well with this knee issues.

[Medium Drink Of Water]

I can relate to the knee issues and I'm afraid to take out the nail in India. I hope I can do that here in Sweden. The fact that you don't feel anything when you're doing kickboxing is bc you have such greater blood flow in your knees.

I'm still going to do my femurs. The great issue there is that EVERYONE will get it and I'm passing my wingspan with 6cm. But my shins are too long with +7cm. I don't recommend doing more than 5cm - for several reasons.

I am 180cm now but I still feel short. ALL of my friends are either equal or taller.

Hehe yeah, I can relate to still feeling short at 5'10 in some countries.  I went to the Netherlands and it seemed like almost all the men were taller than me.  Even when I thought I saw a short guy from far away, he ended up being about my height when he got closer.

Your issues on your knees in my opnion aren't because you opened your knee two times. For me it is because you did 3 inches on tibias, what makes your knee work harder. 7.5 cm on tibias is almost the same of doing 10 on femurs. This problem on your knees would be reduced if you did some cm on your femur to balance. I had titanium inside my femurs after lengthening with internals and i removed them, so I had to open my hips 4 times, and I actually don't feel anything on it. I think this issue you said has more to do with the amount you lengthen. For me ideal is 5 cm on tibias or 7 cm on femurs or both. However,  I am sure you can "survive" very well with this knee issues.

I was having knee stiffness/inflammation problems almost the entire time I was in Beijing, so I don't think it was caused by too much lengthening.  I was at less than 2cm when these problems started.  Some other patients told me I should just stop lengthening, but I didn't listen to them.  The problems were a few inches above where the lengthening was taking place, and I wasn't going to spend $25000 and not get my height.

I think my joints/tendons are just more sensitive than average.

Nobody should read this discussion and decide not to get IM nails, and nobody should read this discussion and decide to get 5cm if they really wanted 7.5.  Each LL case is unique, so your results can and will vary.

[KiloKAHN]

What was the feeling in your legs like doing leg workouts on the weight machines while the rods were inside?

[Medium Drink Of Water]

I barely felt the IM nails at all on the machine.  I was surprised at how quickly I was able to regain the strength in my legs.  It only took a few months before I was leg pressing at my pre-LL level.  Those IM nails can support a lot of weight if you're doing something smoothly and with correct form; it was forceful/jarring impacts that caused me to feel like there was some foreign object in my leg.

[KiloKAHN]

I barely felt the IM nails at all on the machine.  I was surprised at how quickly I was able to regain the strength in my legs.  It only took a few months before I was leg pressing at my pre-LL level.  Those IM nails can support a lot of weight if you're doing something smoothly and with correct form; it was forceful/jarring impacts that caused me to feel like there was some foreign object in my leg.

That's reassuring information.. I was hoping it wouldn't be too uncomfortable using weights while the rods were still in.

[Orlando]

Did you had any physical preparation before LL and how was your fitness level heading into the surgery?

What's your observations about how physical fitness affect the patient's outcome? 

Cheers

[Medium Drink Of Water]

I worked out regularly anyway, so I didn't need to do any special preparation.  My fitness level was quite good going in to LL.

Physical fitness didn't seem to matter that much during the lengthening phase, when the fixators were on.  In general the fitter people had an easier time of it, but not that much easier.

The biggest differences I observed were related to the consolidation/recovery phase with the IM nails.  The less fit people took longer to recover and get their IM nails out, and were more prone to IM nail problems while they were in.

[VegasLights]

Do you play any contact sports now? E.g. football (soccer).

Curious to know how this may have impacted your abilities.

Regarding your knee problems, is this a common thing with internals? I've always read that internals is a "better" method and less risky than external, but the knee problem is pretty worrisome. I can only imagine it'd get worse with old age, unfortunately.

Did you have physiotherapy lessons when you returned home? Do you occasionally still have them at all?

[Medium Drink Of Water]

Do you play any contact sports now? E.g. football (soccer).

Curious to know how this may have impacted your abilities.

Regarding your knee problems, is this a common thing with internals? I've always read that internals is a "better" method and less risky than external, but the knee problem is pretty worrisome. I can only imagine it'd get worse with old age, unfortunately.

Did you have physiotherapy lessons when you returned home? Do you occasionally still have them at all?

I've never played contact sports.  I'm a little slower, a little less agile, and have less endurance in my legs.  That would certainly negatively affect performance, but I'm not sure by how much.  My muscles just never grew big/strong enough to match the new bone length, although my flexibility is excellent.  The bone is as strong as natural bone now, so my risk of breaking my legs isn't any higher than it would have been without LL.

When I look at pictures of knee anatomy, it appears that the issue is with my patellar tendon.  That's where the stiffness and sensitivity are.  I know that they split that tendon vertically and stretch it apart to create an opening to insert/remove IM nails.  This is the standard way of doing it everywhere, not just a Beijing technique.  I don't know how common it is, but it's worth mentioning that I've had an issue with inflammation in my wrists/hands before when I was working with computers all day, so I might be more prone to this type of problem than others.

I did go to an American physiotherapist when I got home.  I think I made about six visits.  It didn't need to be an ongoing thing.  She showed me exercises and stretches, all of which could be done on my own once I'd learned to do them properly.

[VegasLights]

Very interesting!

Have you spoken to Doctors etc to discuss whether there's anything they're able to do to help, or is it something you wouldn't be able to fix?

You said earlier that you regret the operation, which is much of the reason I don't want to take the plunge, yet.

[Medium Drink Of Water]

Just to clarify, what I regret is not being able to be happy with myself at my previous height.  Most likely that would never have happened though, so I don't regret having the surgery.  It changed my life for the better, much for the better.  My self-confidence skyrocketed after I got home from Beijing, and I had a completely different outlook on life.  LL is better than any antidepressant.  It's a treatment for mental illness or dwarfism.  No mentally stable 5'7" person needs LL.

I saw a doctor about my knees but all he did was give me some Prednisone which didn't help any.  Cortisone injections make it all better but those aren't a long-term treatment option.

[Russianblues]

Did you ever experience bitterness or disillusionment towards society for treating you differently due to a change in such a superficial factor that has little bearing on who you are as a person?

Can you elaborate on what you mean by "had a completely different outlook on life".


Thanks for doing this.

[Medium Drink Of Water]

Did you ever experience bitterness or disillusionment towards society for treating you differently due to a change in such a superficial factor that has little bearing on who you are as a person?

Can you elaborate on what you mean by "had a completely different outlook on life".


Thanks for doing this.

No, I wasn't bitter toward society.  The person who judged me the harshest was always me.  I was and still am one of society's worst offenders when it comes to being superficial, so that'd be kind of hypocritical anyway. 

Before LL, I knew what it would take for me to be happy - become rich and famous.  Movie Star and Rock Star were my only choices.  I'd get famous or keep trying no matter what, even if I was writing songs in the gutter between acting auditions.  No matter how unlikely, I had to go for it because there was no other life I could see myself living.  There never really was a plan B, just some vague idea that I might quit and figure something else out if I hadn't made it big by the time I was old.

When I came back from Beijing, I started to think that having a regular job and a wife was an acceptable life.  The Napoleon complex was gone.  It was okay for me to have a normal life and be an average person.  Four years later I had a bachelor's degree.

[BilateralDamage]

What did you tell people when they asked about your height increase?

Do you think you should have opted for 2 different surgeries with lower height increases on each?

[Medium Drink Of Water]

What did you tell people when they asked about your height increase?

Do you think you should have opted for 2 different surgeries with lower height increases on each?

My mother was kind enough to tell everyone with ears that I was getting the surgery.  I couldn't believe her lack of discretion.  Guess I should've said DO NOT TELL ANYONE I AM GETTING LEG LENGTHENING.  But oh well, that ship sailed before I knew it had pulled up anchor.  Some people we don't see very often believed me when I told them I grew.

I'm not sure about the two surgeries instead of one.  I can see the advantage in theory of not stretching out one bone segment so much, but that's a lot of cutting and reaming and money to do two operations.  And I don't know which problems I'd still have and which ones I wouldn't.  Someday some identical twins are going to have to settle the issue once and for all. 

[Russianblues]

If possible can you compare the benefits of going from 5'7 --> 5'10 and going from 5'10--> 6'1. I can't find where you said what country you are from?
'

[Sweden]

If possible can you compare the benefits of going from 5'7 --> 5'10 and going from 5'10--> 6'1. I can't find where you said what country you are from?
'

I went from 5'8 to 5'11 and I'm not really sure how that have impacted on my life yet.
Actually so far it's been mostly embarrassing and I had to hide it.

There is no really benefit that I know of. I noticed some girls were looking at me at the gym the other day but they've done that lots of times before too.

Maybe I should try dating to see if there's any difference 

[Medium Drink Of Water]

If possible can you compare the benefits of going from 5'7 --> 5'10 and going from 5'10--> 6'1. I can't find where you said what country you are from?
'

I think the most benefit from LL is going from short to average.  In my opinion average height should be the goal of every LLer.  It doesn't seem worth it to go from average to tall.

Being short has drawbacks, being tall has benefits.  Getting rid of those drawbacks will change your life way more than gaining the benefits of being tall.

[BilateralDamage]

I think the most benefit from LL is going from short to average.  In my opinion average height should be the goal of every LLer.  It doesn't seem worth it to go from average to tall.

Being short has drawbacks, being tall has benefits.  Getting rid of those drawbacks will change your life way more than gaining the benefits of being tall.

For me, when I go from 5' 5.75" (where the average is around 5' 10" in the US) lengthening all the way to a little over 5' 10", it will change my life drastically.  I've always been short, and have received discrimination from not even just women, but from men who like to make me feel inferior just because I'm short.  I'm not wanting to do this for the women, I'm doing this for the respect that I can't otherwise have just because I'm physically short.

[Russianblues]

I went from 5'8 to 5'11 and I'm not really sure how that have impacted on my life yet.
Actually so far it's been mostly embarrassing and I had to hide it.

There is no really benefit that I know of. I noticed some girls were looking at me at the gym the other day but they've done that lots of times before too.

Maybe I should try dating to see if there's any difference 

I don't understand? I always thought your situation was rather strange as you have already got a wife, good job and a hobby that relies on being agile. But, this just confirms that LL has little to offer you. What confuses me further is you want to go back for a second surgery!? What do you think you have to gain from this? Just curious

[Sweden]

I want to gain height.
I imagine people will stop looking at me like I was a child.
Maybe it'll benefit me in my work, making me boss or something.

Lets see, it was too tempting NOT to do it. AND, I decided already when I was 14 yo that it was something I was going to do.

[VegasLights]

Do you feel the way you walk/run/otherwise use your legs has changed since the operation and 'recovery'?

How have your scars healed? It might be asking too much to see pictures, whatever you're comfortable with.

[VegasLights]

Actually so far it's been mostly embarrassing and I had to hide it.

Is it you feeling embarrassed because people 'look down' on you for having the surgery? Or some other reason?

You've made a brave life decision, never feel embarrassed!

[Medium Drink Of Water]

Do you feel the way you walk/run/otherwise use your legs has changed since the operation and 'recovery'?

How have your scars healed? It might be asking too much to see pictures, whatever you're comfortable with.

Yes, I feel like my strides are shorter when I walk.  I have to take more steps to travel the same distance as someone who's a natural 5'10.  Having longer tibiae means a shorter stride, having longer femurs means a longer stride.  The tibia:femur ratio affects when your foot will hit the ground in your stride.  It's less noticeable when I run.

When driving, I have to adjust the seat differently.  The seat goes all the way back, and the backrest goes all the way forward.  The tibiae got longer but the arms didn't.

Hey,

After LL, how did you deal with these things?

1. explaining to employers about why you were not working for a year
2. getting a job/going back to school?
3. explaining to employers you got height surgery?

Could you post a picture of your scars on the forum?

When people see your scars what do they say?

1. I had a whole lot more than just a year of not working to explain to potential employers.  I'd never had a job before LL and didn't get my first one until two years after.  What I say in job interviews varies depending on what they ask, and if they try to dig too deep I just end the interview.  If your situation requires a detailed explanation, I suggest either telling the truth or making up a story nobody would be able to contradict.

2. I'd gone to college and dropped out multiple times as a short guy with mental illness.  I don't know how it is elsewhere, but in America there are community colleges that accept everyone who applies.  You can do half a bachelor's degree there and then transfer to a 4-year university as a 3rd year student.  Most state universities are required to accept community college transfer students with a 2.0 or better GPA.

3. I don't tell anyone I got height surgery except doctors, and only the doctors that need to know about it.

If anyone asks about my scars I tell them I had knee surgery.  I had scar removal done by a plastic surgeon so they don't show much.  I'll be telling the full story about scar removal in my diary once I get to the post LL-phase.  Here are some pics of my right knee.

[Time4LL]

I think you are really helping this forum and I have enjoyed everything you have written. I was wondering about the S-cut by the Beijing Institute. Did you have this done to you? Do you feel that it is a much better way to have the bone cut? Any information about that would be helpful, thanks.

By the way your diary is really interesting. I hope you keep posting great information.