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[Bernard33]

I had LON FEMUR surgery, but I only gained 4cm, as I had complications at the time.

Is there any impediment to doing another one on the femurs again?

[Saviour69]

Ofc - there was even a guy on this forum (need to look up his nickname) who found a surgeon who was willing to perform a femur lengthening upon an existing femur lengthening procedure. He went for a weight bearing nail option, and for the second surgery, his surgeon inserted a nail, in the alread existing nail - which is brilliant and insane at the same time. I believe he had some challenges at the beginning given he needed to turn his leg by almost 360 degrees in order to lengthen both rods, but he managed everything well. Married to a former Victoria secrets model and is playing American football with the Miami patriots, as a quarterback or so. Hope his helps!

[Bernard33]

Ofc - there was even a guy on this forum (need to look up his nickname) who found a surgeon who was willing to perform a femur lengthening upon an existing femur lengthening procedure. He went for a weight bearing nail option, and for the second surgery, his surgeon inserted a nail, in the alread existing nail - which is brilliant and insane at the same time. I believe he had some challenges at the beginning given he needed to turn his leg by almost 360 degrees in order to lengthen both rods, but he managed everything well. Married to a former Victoria secrets model and is playing American football with the Miami patriots, as a quarterback or so. Hope his helps!

Wow, thanks a lot!

I haven't spoken to my Doctor yet, but I have some questions, I wonder what he'll say.

I still have the intramedullary nails on the femurs. Would I need to remove them or can I use them again? They're screwed to the bones.

What about cutting the skin, can it be done in the same places, to avoid new scars on the leg?

As for the cut in the bone, is it done over the regenerated bone or on a new portion of the femur?

[Saviour69]

U can certainly re-use your old nails and I highly encourage to do so, not only for a matter of $$$ but especially to avoid any unnecessary waste of resources - we need to protect our home,
man, god gave us one planet!! And, no worries
w/r to the scars, he can enter yo ur body via the same entries as your surgeon did, m doing it the same way with married women.

[heightiseverything]

Interesting question, I wonder that too. Like is it possible to do 16 cm in total on femurs but like 8 cm at a time spread around 2 years apart or so?

[Body Builder]

Interesting question, I wonder that too. Like is it possible to do 16 cm in total on femurs but like 8 cm at a time spread around 2 years apart or so?

It is not possible to gain 16cm in one segment and not be completely ruined even if you did 8 LLs from 2cm each.

[heightiseverything]

It is not possible to gain 16cm in one segment and not be completely ruined even if you did 8 LLs from 2cm each.

I am not sure I believe this, like if you had consolidation and your nerves adapted, you can just repeat the same way given you take enough time for adaptation. What's preventing that? Furthermore, during puberty you can get like 30 cm increase naturally. That doesn't make sense, since it's distraction osteogenesis in both cases.

[Cll123]

Theoretically the bone can be lengthened to anything with no problems but the tissues not even if they adapted getting 16 cm from the femurs only will skew up the femur tibia ratio and to be honest I don’t know what r the exact effects of that skewed ratio but I am really sure that it will affect negatively the movement dynamics in your knees or hips

[heightiseverything]

Theoretically the bone can be lengthened to anything with no problems but the tissues not even if they adapted getting 16 cm from the femurs only will skew up the femur tibia ratio and to be honest I don’t know what r the exact effects of that skewed ratio but I am really sure that it will affect negatively the movement dynamics in your knees or hips

Could you please expand on the tissue part? Is there a confirmed limit after which your tissues don't adapt or cause excessive strain? I assume some sort of a mathematical formula or something might be helpful but couldn't find in any literature so far.

This is a very important point and so far hasn't been adressed in any LL forum.

[Body Builder]

I am not sure I believe this, like if you had consolidation and your nerves adapted, you can just repeat the same way given you take enough time for adaptation. What's preventing that? Furthermore, during puberty you can get like 30 cm increase naturally. That doesn't make sense, since it's distraction osteogenesis in both cases.

If you understand what is biomechanics then you could understand too why it is impossible to lengthen that much in one segment and still be functional.

[heightiseverything]

If you understand what is biomechanics then you could understand too why it is impossible to lengthen that much in one segment and still be functional.

I am also studying biomechanics at the moment, and besides knock knees or some other valgus/varus deviation, I don't see any evidence why that couldn't work. I am only talking about the bone part however, it's probably a different story with the tissues as I wrote in my comment.

[Cll123]

Ok to point that out in puberty both the tibia and the femur increase in height and they do increase in height in a much lower rate than u do in the surgery . I know that a bone can be lengthened to what ever we want for ex if we isolated a bone in a lab supplying the bone with needed stuff (btw they did actually  grow a bone in a lab before and I guess not sure that in future having artificial growth plate cells and using them in adult humans could be be achieved from a research like that ) and increasing the height of the the bone by surgery it will increase with no issues , but our body works as a system your bones aren’t alone in your body they are surrounded with nerves , muscles , ligaments and tendons + your knee

In the surgery we increase height by 8 cm in 90 days which is way faster than the normal rate of growth in teens not only that but also we gain the whole 8 cm thing in just one bone

So already doing the surgery it will be already faster than where your bones were growing in your teens and also the tissues as they grow
But according to doctors the average limit to grow a bone by surgery is a 1 mm in femur and .75 in tibia which in my view is still fast for the tissues if lengthening for more than 5 cm . Unfortunately we can’t lengthen in a slower rate because early consolidation will occur it occurs because the bone regenerates faster than the tissues around it.

As for the biomechanics between the femur ,knee and tibia
Lengthening more than 8 cm in my opinion in the femur without lengthening the tibia
Could have a negative effect on it my opinion tho regarding this part isn’t supported by evidence
But some doctors say that even lengthening the femur by 8 cm and leaving the tibia isn’t good for biomechanics I say yes of course your biomechanics will change but change doesn’t mean bad
But for sure after a certain limit it will be bad.

[JON SNOW]

For each centimeter of elongation in soft tissues, the main component is new growth but not all, a percentage is simply stretched tissue and would remain than way for many years or even a lifetime, and this percentage increases exponentially.

That is why, among other things, complications and recovery increase exponentially the more one lengthen, 16cm (in 1 segment) can only be done safely in people with dwarfism, since their tissues are compressed initially

and as others have told you, the biomechanical component would be compromised

no respectable doctor would allow you to do this plan, imo

[wes07]

Do you how fast the bones lengthen naturally during puberty? what's the minimum rate we can lengthen the femurs using an internal method and avoiding consolidation?

[Cll123]

The curve for growth is different for everyone until you finish puberty  ; I’m growth starts ti slow down then stops when does it stop its is different for each person not not a big difference for the Average human male (17-18)

Now how much u grow I guess that it is impossible that your body in puberty will increase 8 cm in just one bone and in 3 months
U may get the 8 cm in a spurt around the 3-5 months
But from your tibia , femur , and spine

As for the minimum rate to avoid consolidation
I’ll say that I don’t know 😅
It will depend on many factors
1-The total target height increase
,4 is different than 6 than 8
2- the age of the person
3- how fast is your consolidation can happen ( from a genetic standpoint)
4-all these things are factors that’s why I guess when I’ll lengthen in the beginning the doctors will not start away with a full 1mm
Many starts at .75 or maybe less the first few days
Doing so  a doctor can  have an indication about the lengthening plan
Which is most of the time 1 mm
Until the target
If complications happen before the target height
The doctor will be like
Stop now
Either stop now means to take a break for few days and continue
Or stopping at all

[heightiseverything]

For each centimeter of elongation in soft tissues, the main component is new growth but not all, a percentage is simply stretched tissue and would remain than way for many years or even a lifetime, and this percentage increases exponentially.

That is why, among other things, complications and recovery increase exponentially the more one lengthen, 16cm (in 1 segment) can only be done safely in people with dwarfism, since their tissues are compressed initially

and as others have told you, the biomechanical component would be compromised

no respectable doctor would allow you to do this plan, imo

I highly doubt that the tissues don't adapt along the way, after some point the strain becomes unbearable so they forcefully extends to adapt themselves better (or you can have a surgery that forcefully releases tension). But note that I haven't studied this yet so can't back it up, just my opinion.

There are people who lengthened 12 cm in a single surgery on this forum, so naturally this implies that if you make this process even easier (obviously, lengthening the same part two times is safer than lengthening in one go), you could gain even more on a single bone. So no, I don't believe this works only for people with dwarfism.

Speaking for biomechanics, I don't believe it to be a great deal (who cares about how fast you walk or how much you can bend your knees, anyway?)

Third, I emailed many doctors and the absolute majority are willing to do surgery on the same bone, furthermore doctors don't control how much you lengthen, after the surgery they can only give you recommendations.

[Cll123]

Even if you are right doing 12 cm on the femur alone is a bad choice
Even if u divide it by 3 lengthening periods

For real and doing more than 8 pm the femur will be really hard perhaps impossible
Of course some people do it but it is a small percentage
And most have issues

I want to tell you that many cll patients can’t tolerate reaching to 7 on femurs
🙂 maybe even 6.5 on one go


What I mean that u won’t be able to do 12 cm in one go
Or even more  than 9

If u divide the lengthening your body proportions then will be really off

Getting 12 cm on femurs only in my opinion is proportionally worse than doing
8 femur and 8 tibia
Which is 16
Let alone doing 16 in the femur only how off will it be

[Robert Adam]

https://limblengthening.org/lengthening-options/

[heightiseverything]

Even if you are right doing 12 cm on the femur alone is a bad choice
Even if u divide it by 3 lengthening periods

For real and doing more than 8 pm the femur will be really hard perhaps impossible
Of course some people do it but it is a small percentage
And most have issues

I want to tell you that many cll patients can’t tolerate reaching to 7 on femurs
🙂 maybe even 6.5 on one go


What I mean that u won’t be able to do 12 cm in one go
Or even more  than 9

If u divide the lengthening your body proportions then will be really off

Getting 12 cm on femurs only in my opinion is proportionally worse than doing
8 femur and 8 tibia
Which is 16
Let alone doing 16 in the femur only how off will it be

What do you mean by most can't "tolerate" it? How do you define tolerance? Is it the pain? Is it the rate of complications (what kind of them, do you know that most of these are fairly easily manageable)? What you are doing here is just using emotional language, not scientific one. Theoretically, it is not impossible and you probably know it, I am just asking you to define precisely what you mean by that.

[Cll123]

Ask a doctor by not tolerate it could be muscle soreness and tissue problems
According to Cyborg livestreams with doctor Robbins 
The surgery has risks and they increase as you lengthen that’s why they have limits
If your to do more than 10 cm in one go with the femur go ahead and try by yourself
Probably you will be through many complications the least of them is getting a nerve issue where the skin nerve receptors don’t work if u continued you lengthening when getting it you may loose the sense in that area for your life time talking here about reaching for the 8 cm not 10 or more
This area is a small area so even if u lost sensation u won’t be really affected
But this is a minor complication

U can get problems with motor nerves
Tissues
And many many more

Your body isnt  made from bones only u got other stuff running there
And to be sure u can ask a creditable surgeon that u want to do 16 cm on your femur
And check what will he say to u
Not to mention that precice does only 8 or 8.3

So doing more than that means that u will be doing Lon
Or lizarov
 And both are way painful speaking (logically)
More screws into your femur

[heightiseverything]

Ask a doctor by not tolerate it could be muscle soreness and tissue problems
According to Cyborg livestreams with doctor Robbins 
The surgery has risks and they increase as you lengthen that’s why they have limits
If your to do more than 10 cm in one go with the femur go ahead and try by yourself
Probably you will be through many complications the least of them is getting a nerve issue where the skin nerve receptors don’t work if u continued you lengthening when getting it you may loose the sense in that area for your life time talking here about reaching for the 8 cm not 10 or more
This area is a small area so even if u lost sensation u won’t be really affected
But this is a minor complication

U can get problems with motor nerves
Tissues
And many many more

Your body isnt  made from bones only u got other stuff running there
And to be sure u can ask a creditable surgeon that u want to do 16 cm on your femur
And check what will he say to u
Not to mention that precice does only 8 or 8.3

So doing more than that means that u will be doing Lon
Or lizarov
 And both are way painful speaking (logically)
More screws into your femur

If you mean tissue problems, again it's fairly treatable and it gets better with time, I don't believe those to be a big deal. If it doesn't, another surgery to decompress nerves is required.

And I don't encourage anyone to lengthen beyond 8 cm on femurs or 6 cm on tibias respectively in one go. I am talking about a very specific case of extensive LL where you for example gain 16 cm on femurs by dividing it into two surgeries set a year or so apart, not lengthening the entire 16 cm on femurs in just one surgery. This is obviously crazy, and I highly doubt it's possible for anyone without achondroplasia.

[Cll123]

Surgical truama in the femur 2 times with a 1 year gap only is crazy
Btw your tissues don’t grow 100%  their is a good part that is stretched only remember that this is artificial growth
 where the rate is higher than the normal growth of  teens and kids
8 cm in one bone in 3 months a normal body can’t do that

+ surgical trauma getting frequent in your bone isn’t something u will like


+ You will ruin also  your bio mechanics
Do 16 cm on femur
And 16 or 10 in tibia

Bio mechanics is the relation  between a bone and a bone also ligaments ,tendons with the movement of muscles


Biomechanics in the human body is a science by itself I can’t explain all the possible outcomes but for sure the probability of having a bad outcome will skyrocket doing what u want

And even nerves and how the gravity and force are divided through ur legs
Having bad biomechanics means that u won’t be able to move well
If u moved even if u did u will move with the worst giat i

[heightiseverything]

Surgical truama in the femur 2 times with a 1 year gap only is crazy
Btw your tissues don’t grow 100%  their is a good part that is stretched only remember that this is artificial growth
 where the rate is higher than the normal growth of  teens and kids
8 cm in one bone in 3 months a normal body can’t do that

+ surgical trauma getting frequent in your bone isn’t something u will like


+ You will ruin also  your bio mechanics
Do 16 cm on femur
And 16 or 10 in tibia

Bio mechanics is the relation  between a bone and a bone also ligaments ,tendons with the movement of muscles


Biomechanics in the human body is a science by itself I can’t explain all the possible outcomes but for sure the probability of having a bad outcome will skyrocket doing what u want

And even nerves and how the gravity and force are divided through ur legs
Having bad biomechanics means that u won’t be able to move well
If u moved even if u did u will move with the worst giat i

1-year time frame is arbitrary, but I am prepared to wait for how long it takes. I also however doubt it takes longer than 1.5-2 years for you to reheal completely to be allowed for another surgery as people do surgeries on the same part in a much shorter span.

On the tissue part I am still doing my research and may change my opinions accordingly, but based on the current evidence tissues do adapt if you give them enough time depending on the lengthening amount. And I don't see what is the difference between artificial growth and natural growth?

Even though I am studying my fair share of biomechanics right now, can you elaborate on what you mean by change of force and gravity? Naturally, I assume there's only two major things in biomechanics that change after the surgery: the angle of femurs (which is very negligible) and femur-to-tibia ratio. But I don't see enough evidence to believe that these things are something to be primarily concerned about (I and the vast majority of serious LLrs do not care if they can't run as fast as before or have perfect flexibility) unless you provide me with more information.