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Author Topic: Wannabetaller destroyed my life  (Read 32431 times)

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WannaBeTaller-Official

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Re: Wannabetaller destroyed my life
« Reply #93 on: August 21, 2023, 02:53:46 PM »


The video is about the same batch of patients I was in Wannabetaller (bubuzenggao) in Turkey. She only lengthened 4cm  because of the pain、ballerina foot and inversion of foot . Wbt also peddled her to spend money to find yunus to do relax achilles tendon surgery(at that time, other companies were free to charge this surgery ), She wore a plaster cast for another 3+ months at the hotel rented to her by wbt.  After returning to China, after walking, the broken bone suddenly became red, swollen, hot and painful, and the internal infection broke out!  Later, the nails became red, swollen and infected!  She also has injury of  common peroneal nerve,.Because the patient had already returned to China ,so that was perfunctory by WBT, this matter was left alone, and she could only admit that she was unlucky!


I know this patient in the video well and I will not repeat my answers because you have already shared this post many times and I have already answered them. As far as I know this patient is healthy now and has been sharing many wonderful photos from many beautiful places in the world from her Wechat account for a long time.
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The Victims Of WannaBeTaller

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Re: Wannabetaller destroyed my life
« Reply #94 on: August 21, 2023, 03:25:17 PM »


I know this patient in the video well and I will not repeat my answers because you have already shared this post many times and I have already answered them. As far as I know this patient is healthy now and has been sharing many wonderful photos from many beautiful places in the world from her Wechat account for a long time.
She is good because our Chinese doctors treated her in a timely manner and did not let your butcher treat her, otherwise her fate would be the same as mine. It's because she saw my fate and promptly sought help from Chinese doctors, not your butcher.

WannaBeTaller-Official

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Re: Wannabetaller destroyed my life
« Reply #95 on: August 21, 2023, 03:38:47 PM »

She is good because our Chinese doctors treated her in a timely manner and did not let your butcher treat her, otherwise her fate would be the same as mine. It's because she saw my fate and promptly sought help from Chinese doctors, not your butcher.

No, you are giving incomplete or incorrect information again. She has already shared this video and more with us through Wechat in Agu 2022. We were in close cooperation on what could be done. Thankfully, she focused on her treatment and took precautions before it was too late, instead of targeted us pointlessly to and fro like you. As I said before, she was in Turkey to complete the rest of the dental treatment and she contacted us again for this in Apr 2023.
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The Victims Of WannaBeTaller

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Re: Wannabetaller destroyed my life
« Reply #96 on: August 21, 2023, 03:39:21 PM »

I remember someone complain that Wannabetaller's breakfast existed flies one month ago in other post. They handle the matter today ? The efficiency is really "high " .The wheelchair is broken, and our wheelchair costs $300. It's so easy to break, the quality is really "good". Even the basic service of changing bed sheets every day has problems, and you still use it to show off, not ashamed, but proud It's really kind of you to handle small things in life slowly, and not deal with major infections directly. WBT is so good that I feel nauseous.

The Victims Of WannaBeTaller

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Re: Wannabetaller destroyed my life
« Reply #97 on: August 21, 2023, 03:42:02 PM »

Wannabetaller do not provide any information. But they still have the face to criticize me. Come on, continue to make up stories, continue to spread rumors about me, come on

The Victims Of WannaBeTaller

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Re: Wannabetaller destroyed my life
« Reply #98 on: August 21, 2023, 03:53:20 PM »

WBT accused me of providing some information. Should I tell you when I eat and when I sleep? Then you can provide complete information. You will definitely refuse to provide it under various excuses.

WannaBeTaller-Official

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Re: Wannabetaller destroyed my life
« Reply #99 on: August 21, 2023, 04:01:18 PM »

I remember someone complain that Wannabetaller's breakfast existed flies one month ago in other post. They handle the matter today ? The efficiency is really "high " .The wheelchair is broken, and our wheelchair costs $300. It's so easy to break, the quality is really "good". Even the basic service of changing bed sheets every day has problems, and you still use it to show off, not ashamed, but proud It's really kind of you to handle small things in life slowly, and not deal with major infections directly. WBT is so good that I feel nauseous.


We had already warned the hotel management as soon as the fly problem was mentioned here. We just needed visual confirmation to figure out what kind of the problem was, and that just happened two days ago.
Who said we're going to get paid for wheelchairs? We will either fix it or give you a new one. That's it! After all, breakage is not directly related to their flaws.
There is always the possibility of a problem with any service, basic or not. The important thing is to pay attention to these problems and ensure that they do not recur. We are trying to do that too.
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WannaBeTaller-Official

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Re: Wannabetaller destroyed my life
« Reply #100 on: August 21, 2023, 04:02:45 PM »

WBT accused me of providing some information. Should I tell you when I eat and when I sleep? Then you can provide complete information. You will definitely refuse to provide it under various excuses.


We are engrossing the people in useless discussions in this forum and occupying their agenda in vain. I hope the forum moderator/official puts an end to this.
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Ahri

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Re: Wannabetaller destroyed my life
« Reply #101 on: August 22, 2023, 06:10:39 AM »

It was me - I can confirm since I posted that they installed a fly zapper in the kitchen and are in the process of installing ramps now. They’ve also been more diligent keeping the physio room clean and sanitary. I do have an issue with one of the nurses, but not going to comment since its second hand and I’m no longer at the facility. I stand by the doctor being good and WBT making changes in the right direction. I was / am in the process of being refunded money for leaving early. This isn’t something I asked for or remembered, so was kind and honest of them to do.

For anyone hurt or suffering from this procedure, my heart goes out to you, and I hope you heal and return to normal life. I was lucky, and most patients in my group had very few issues. I think if WBT takes patient feedback seriously with Dr. Oc they have potential to be one of the best options in Turkey.
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Height Reduction Procedure on 7/4/23
173 cm (5'8") -> 169.5 cm (5'7)

Among us

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Re: Wannabetaller destroyed my life
« Reply #102 on: August 22, 2023, 09:08:59 AM »

I agree
While I understand that the number of cases I'm referring to might be relatively small, my experience involved being with around 15 patients, and none of us faced any major health issues. The few minor concerns that did arise appeared to be handled quite well.On a personal note, my only difficulties were related to the hotel, but it's encouraging to see that they are gradually resolving these matters, including better food quality, installation of ramps, and overall customer service. There is still some problems but overall I would choose this company again.
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Maison

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Re: Wannabetaller destroyed my life
« Reply #103 on: August 22, 2023, 02:48:53 PM »

In my honest opinion, both the posts by Bubuzenggao and the official ones are overly verbose and hard to comprehend.
I recognize that Bubuzenggao has serious frustrations about what happened at WBT, but I believe it would be better to summarize the facts simply and chronologically.
Posting a large number of screenshots makes it hard to read and doesn't seem effective for the forum participants.

Additionally, I have one concern about WBT. It appears that the manager of WBT is not a medical doctor, and there is a frequent turnover of surgeons at WBT. I wonder if, when a patient desires treatment for complications after a doctor has been replaced, the new doctor at WBT is contracted to provide the treatment?

Also, concerning the tibial misalignment by WBT's former Özgur Karakoyun, it seems to be missing from Bubuzenggao's signature, so I have included it here.
http://www.limblengtheningforum.com/index.php?topic=64059.0
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Ahri

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Re: Wannabetaller destroyed my life
« Reply #104 on: August 22, 2023, 05:15:48 PM »

I believe so. A few patients treated by the old doctors have either been treated by or given medical advice from Dr. Yunus Oc. The problem with WBT is that from 2019-2020 or maybe 2021 they had doctors that weren’t stellar and had issues. Those complaints may well be valid, but it isn’t representative of the doctor now, and the company is improving based off feedback. If the problem was severe like chronic osteomyelitis from surgery a year or two ago, I can imagine it being really difficult to treat.
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Height Reduction Procedure on 7/4/23
173 cm (5'8") -> 169.5 cm (5'7)

Maison

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Re: Wannabetaller destroyed my life
« Reply #105 on: August 23, 2023, 03:19:25 AM »

I believe so. A few patients treated by the old doctors have either been treated by or given medical advice from Dr. Yunus Oc. The problem with WBT is that from 2019-2020 or maybe 2021 they had doctors that weren’t stellar and had issues. Those complaints may well be valid, but it isn’t representative of the doctor now, and the company is improving based off feedback. If the problem was severe like chronic osteomyelitis from surgery a year or two ago, I can imagine it being really difficult to treat.

I was operated by Yuksel, when my leg was swollen I contacted wannabetaller and they told me they are not working with Yuksel anymore. And gave me contact information to contact Yuksel myself, I contacted Yuksel and he said he was back after 5 days vacation.

WBT provided Bubuzenggao with the contact information for Yuksel after the doctor's change, but it's unclear whether they did so because he preferred treatment from Yuksel rather than Yunus.
Additionally, it's unknown how the treatment expenses were handled at that time.
Regarding this matter, I would like to wait for an explanation from the parties involved. 

As an aside, Bubuzenggao especially wanted debridement early, but I suspect that the infection had already spread widely by the time the pus burst.
Therefore, debridement alone would not have been enough for a complete cure, and the removal of the nail would have been necessary.
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WannaBeTaller-Official

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Re: Wannabetaller destroyed my life
« Reply #106 on: August 23, 2023, 08:32:18 AM »

It was me - I can confirm since I posted that they installed a fly zapper in the kitchen and are in the process of installing ramps now. They’ve also been more diligent keeping the physio room clean and sanitary. I do have an issue with one of the nurses, but not going to comment since its second hand and I’m no longer at the facility. I stand by the doctor being good and WBT making changes in the right direction. I was / am in the process of being refunded money for leaving early. This isn’t something I asked for or remembered, so was kind and honest of them to do.

For anyone hurt or suffering from this procedure, my heart goes out to you, and I hope you heal and return to normal life. I was lucky, and most patients in my group had very few issues. I think if WBT takes patient feedback seriously with Dr. Oc they have potential to be one of the best options in Turkey.


Here, after one of our patients, I was convinced of the concreteness of the complaint when I read your comments about breakfast, and I reported the problem to the hotel management the very next day. Also I had the chance to share the visual confirmation from one of our patients the other day, and I think they had already taken the initiative to solve the problems. And yes I was informed that the ramp for the pool has been completed since the beginning of this week.

We truly value feedback from patients. Sometimes we take immediate action to solve the problems we observe in the field without even waiting for their feedback. The work we do is multi-unit work(transfer, hospital, accomodation, nurse, therapy, office management etc.), which presents us with several challenges when dealing with many details in many units. Here, the feedback of our patients enables us to realize some problems earlier. For example, I would not have known about this problem if the patients had not mentioned the problem at breakfast here.  Since I did not know, I would not be able to take action to solve it. Or, if the patients had not mentioned some of the problems they encountered in ambulance transfer - fast and unstable driving etc. - we would not have observed a problem with this service and this would have caused the problem to continue. However, thanks to the feedback given by a few of our patients, we became aware of this problem and changed the ambulance company.
In summary, we closely monitor the system and try to detect and involve the problems as soon as possible. However, despite all our efforts, problems beyond our control mechanism may arise. The more patients cooperate with us, the faster we can resolve these issues.

Thanks for your contribution and comments.
« Last Edit: August 23, 2023, 09:07:41 AM by WannaBeTaller-Official »
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WannaBeTaller-Official

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Re: Wannabetaller destroyed my life
« Reply #107 on: August 23, 2023, 08:35:11 AM »

I agree
While I understand that the number of cases I'm referring to might be relatively small, my experience involved being with around 15 patients, and none of us faced any major health issues. The few minor concerns that did arise appeared to be handled quite well.On a personal note, my only difficulties were related to the hotel, but it's encouraging to see that they are gradually resolving these matters, including better food quality, installation of ramps, and overall customer service. There is still some problems but overall I would choose this company again.


We are aware of the problems and we have put them all on our agenda since the day was told. We have solved some of them and some still take time. We did not know that we would face all the challenges of a new hotel. Our aim was to provide good service to our patients in a hotel that has just been opened and therefore in quite good condition. However, due to some reasons, the hotel management could not fulfill its commitments to us. Undoubtedly, they had their own reasons. However, this did not change the fact that our patients had to struggle with some problems. Our only consolation is that you will complete your process in a healthy way.
Thank you for sharing your thoughts here.
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WannaBeTaller-Official

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Re: Wannabetaller destroyed my life
« Reply #108 on: August 23, 2023, 09:01:41 AM »

In my honest opinion, both the posts by Bubuzenggao and the official ones are overly verbose and hard to comprehend.
I recognize that Bubuzenggao has serious frustrations about what happened at WBT, but I believe it would be better to summarize the facts simply and chronologically.
Posting a large number of screenshots makes it hard to read and doesn't seem effective for the forum participants.

Additionally, I have one concern about WBT. It appears that the manager of WBT is not a medical doctor, and there is a frequent turnover of surgeons at WBT. I wonder if, when a patient desires treatment for complications after a doctor has been replaced, the new doctor at WBT is contracted to provide the treatment?

Also, concerning the tibial misalignment by WBT's former Özgur Karakoyun, it seems to be missing from Bubuzenggao's signature, so I have included it here.
http://www.limblengtheningforum.com/index.php?topic=64059.0



Frankly, I was not in favor of having a discussion with this patient (that you call bubuzenggaao).If this patient had not manipulated so much and turned the truth upside down in some points, I would not even have answered her. After all, she is a patient who had to go through a difficult process.  In fact, my focus was on some of the claims of our few patients who were staying with us at that moment, which were beyond their purpose and far from constructive criticism, and I came to the forum to defend that these claims are unfounded from our own point of view. I have tried to answer all the allegations made without sacrificing honesty and transparency. I also carefully noted each of the constructive criticisms. An unbiased eye will already notice all.

Yes, the founder of WBT is not a medical doctor, he is a lengthening patient. This has its own advantages and disadvantages. In my observation and opinion, the biggest advantage of not being the founder as a medical doctor in such companies is that the doctor has the opportunity to focus only on the surgery he will perform. Lengthening surgery is not just about surgery and is part of a whole that requires the coordinated work of many units, from transfer to accommodation, from accounting to physiotherapy, from nursing to agency activities, from purchasing to other office works. It is clear that such a structure requires great organization and harmony. In our system, the doctor does not deal with any of these, does not spend time on any of them, and focuses only on his surgery and monitors his patients at regular intervals. Undoubtedly, a doctor can also establish this system, but no matter what, a doctor will have to deal with the functioning of the system he has established in one way or another. This will make the doctor more prone to problems than in a system where he doesn't have to deal with any of them.

We consider it a great advantage that the founder of our company is a height increase patient. We believe that the difficulties and experiences he had during the surgery process have improved our system's ability to empathize with patients. In fact, my presence in this company is the reflection of this empathy on the field in order to ensure patient satisfaction by constantly monitoring the services offered by the company. Our company is perhaps the only company operating in this field with quality control management. The company's choice of doctor gives flexibility to the company in achieving the targeted service quality, which gives us room to adapt our quality policy to the field. Our quality policy imposes the same responsibility on all our units and staff, including the doctor, and no one is exempt from this responsibility. For example, the reason why we parted ways with a doctor we work with will explain what I mean. This doctor stated that the muscles of one of our patients did not have sufficient flexibility during the routine check-up at the hospital, and that he did not receive adequate physical therapy services. However, he is obliged to visit his patients in certain periods (5-10 days) at the hotel and check their condition. A doctor can determine if a physiotherapy service is of the desired quality.We can only measure whether patients receive physical therapy according to the number and duration determined in the program. The doctor should have identified the quality problems in this physical therapy and warn us. After all, we could take the necessary actions according to his warning. In this example, the doctor noticed after almost a month that the patient was not getting good physical therapy, which was unacceptable.

As for your question, is it provided with a new doctor for the treatment of complications when the doctor changes? Doctors in Turkey are always cautious about dealing with another doctor's patient, but this is not a fixed behavior or rule. Therefore, even if the patient's own doctor has terminated the contract with the company, the patient can receive service from the company's new doctor. However, it should not be forgotten that his own doctor has a legal responsibility towards him regarding the problem he has experienced. Because in the agreement signed between the company and the doctor, "The doctor is responsible for all the results of the surgery and the doctor takes the action for the treatment of possible complications." phrase is included. In the meantime, in case we have started to offer a service that covers possible complications under insurance for about a year. Currently this insurance is optional, but we will discuss making it mandatory on a case-by-case basis.

I was not in this company yet when the company was working with Ozgur Karakoyun. Therefore, I do not have detailed information about the situations in this plugin. It is clear that a complete answer will require a detailed archive search. However, while making investigations on some case studies during the restructuring of the company, I learned that there were some problems in two of Karakoyun's patients, who had correspondence in the link you sent, and that one patient had a tibial alignment problem and other patient had different problem due to the Stryde nail, and the case was taken to the court.As far as I understand, the panel of experts appointed by the court has expressed an opinion that the problem, one of the patients has, is not caused by the doctor's procedure, but by the structural problems in the Stryde nail used. As it is known, the Stryde method has been abandoned worldwide after many problems. As for the patient having tibial misalignment, I do not remember if there is an expert report on tibial misalignment. However, in the first trials, the court did not find it appropriate to face any accusation WBT as the interlocutor in the case, as there was no point that required our company to be a party in the lawsuit. In other words, the lawsuit is between doctors and patients and is still ongoing.
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WannaBeTaller-Official

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Re: Wannabetaller destroyed my life
« Reply #109 on: August 23, 2023, 09:36:46 AM »

WBT provided Bubuzenggao with the contact information for Yuksel after the doctor's change, but it's unclear whether they did so because he preferred treatment from Yuksel rather than Yunus.
Additionally, it's unknown how the treatment expenses were handled at that time.
Regarding this matter, I would like to wait for an explanation from the parties involved. 

As an aside, Bubuzenggao especially wanted debridement early, but I suspect that the infection had already spread widely by the time the pus burst.
Therefore, debridement alone would not have been enough for a complete cure, and the removal of the nail would have been necessary.



Yes, Dr. Yuksel's contact information was given to her. Because it is always the first way to be preferred by the doctor who performs the procedure to follow his own case. But this does not mean that she was not informed that she could contact Dr. Yunus for his treatment. As a matter of fact, some of the diagnoses and treatments were made by Dr. Yunus. As far as I know she was not charged for these treatments, even medicine and transfer costs etc. were covered(If this my information is wrong or missing I will fix it.). In cases where it is not clear that any complication is caused by the negligence of the doctor under normal conditions, the treatment costs of the possible complication are covered by the patient. This is a valid application for many types of services in the medical field. A court order is often required for the cost of complications to be covered by the treating party. However, in most cases, the company did not hesitate to make all the financial sacrifices it could, even though it had no legal obligation. In addition, as I mentioned in my other answer, we have implemented an insurance protocol so that payments are no longer a problem, at least up to a point.

“As an aside, Bubuzenggao specifically requested early debridement, but I suspect the infection was already widely spread by the time the pus bursts.
Therefore, debridement alone would not be sufficient for full recovery and the nail would have to be removed.” you say.

These details require medical qualification and it would be more accurate for a professional to assess the situation. The company was not in a position to decide whether the treatment protocol adopted by Dr. Yuksel or Dr. Yunus for this patient was right or wrong. Therefore, it has always been the company's most reasonable option for an impartial third party (the court/expert) to take up the matter and provide an opinion and encouraged the parties to this option.
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Maison

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Re: Wannabetaller destroyed my life
« Reply #110 on: August 23, 2023, 12:38:07 PM »

As for your question, is it provided with a new doctor for the treatment of complications when the doctor changes? Doctors in Turkey are always cautious about dealing with another doctor's patient, but this is not a fixed behavior or rule. Therefore, even if the patient's own doctor has terminated the contract with the company, the patient can receive service from the company's new doctor. However, it should not be forgotten that his own doctor has a legal responsibility towards him regarding the problem he has experienced. Because in the agreement signed between the company and the doctor, "The doctor is responsible for all the results of the surgery and the doctor takes the action for the treatment of possible complications." phrase is included. In the meantime, in case we have started to offer a service that covers possible complications under insurance for about a year. Currently this insurance is optional, but we will discuss making it mandatory on a case-by-case basis.

I was not in this company yet when the company was working with Ozgur Karakoyun. Therefore, I do not have detailed information about the situations in this plugin. It is clear that a complete answer will require a detailed archive search. However, while making investigations on some case studies during the restructuring of the company, I learned that there were some problems in two of Karakoyun's patients, who had correspondence in the link you sent, and that one patient had a tibial alignment problem and other patient had different problem due to the Stryde nail, and the case was taken to the court.As far as I understand, the panel of experts appointed by the court has expressed an opinion that the problem, one of the patients has, is not caused by the doctor's procedure, but by the structural problems in the Stryde nail used. As it is known, the Stryde method has been abandoned worldwide after many problems. As for the patient having tibial misalignment, I do not remember if there is an expert report on tibial misalignment. However, in the first trials, the court did not find it appropriate to face any accusation WBT as the interlocutor in the case, as there was no point that required our company to be a party in the lawsuit. In other words, the lawsuit is between doctors and patients and is still ongoing.

Discussions about WBT are multifaceted and complex, encompassing both WBT's policies and medical malpractice by surgeons. I am primarily concerned with the medical malpractice and the associated contract.

Images from the Suddenurge topic (http://www.limblengtheningforum.com/index.php?topic=64059.0) are missing, but I remember seeing them at the time. They showed a procurvatum deformity of the tibia, apparently a result of a surgeon's technical error.
The contract states 'The doctor is responsible for all the results of the surgery and takes action for the treatment of possible complications,' so Dr. Özgur Karakoyun should be obliged to compensate the patient, depending on the trial's outcome. WBT has no contractual liability for medical malpractice.

However, since there was an obvious surgeon's error, the average patient would probably agree that if the doctor does not provide compensation himself, the operating company should offer some without a trial.
The system where the individual surgeon bears all responsibility could cause surgeons to be more reluctant to admit fault, possibly delaying the treatment of complications.

Moreover, the fact that the head of WBT is not a medical professional might also contribute to the hiring of incompetent surgeons without proper evaluation of their skills.
Hopefully, the current Dr. Yunus is competent. Additionally, I think an insurance protocol would be a good idea.
« Last Edit: August 23, 2023, 03:08:17 PM by Maison »
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WannaBeTaller-Official

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Re: Wannabetaller destroyed my life
« Reply #111 on: August 23, 2023, 05:19:17 PM »

Discussions about WBT are multifaceted and complex, encompassing both WBT's policies and medical malpractice by surgeons. I am primarily concerned with the medical malpractice and the associated contract.

Images from the Suddenurge topic (http://www.limblengtheningforum.com/index.php?topic=64059.0) are missing, but I remember seeing them at the time. They showed a procurvatum deformity of the tibia, apparently a result of a surgeon's technical error.
The contract states 'The doctor is responsible for all the results of the surgery and takes action for the treatment of possible complications,' so Dr. Özgur Karakoyun should be obliged to compensate the patient, depending on the trial's outcome. WBT has no contractual liability for medical malpractice.

However, since there was an obvious surgeon's error, the average patient would probably agree that if the doctor does not provide compensation himself, the operating company should offer some without a trial.
The system where the individual surgeon bears all responsibility could cause surgeons to be more reluctant to admit fault, possibly delaying the treatment of complications.

Moreover, the fact that the head of WBT is not a medical professional might also contribute to the hiring of incompetent surgeons without proper evaluation of their skills.
Hopefully, the current Dr. Yunus is competent. Additionally, I think an insurance protocol would be a good idea.



I also have to admit that the discussions are multifaceted and complex. This confusion is partly due to the fact that some patients, while addressing the issue, move away from the focus and make some irrelevant claims.

Yes, according to the contract, the doctor is responsible for the consequences of negligence, if there is any negligence. Even if this and similar phrases are not included in the contract itself, the laws already have an approach to hold the doctor responsible for the consequences of his negligence. I understand the expectations of patients from the company in such situations. But we will have to be realistic. Because in your proposal, the company is compressed in a double-sided vice, consisting of the mistakes of the patient on one side and the mistakes of the doctor on the other. If the patient is at fault or if the complication is caused by a naturally occurring factor such as bone nonunion, the doctor will not accept compensation or free treatment. In this case, the entire burden is placed on the back of the company. On the other hand, if the doctor is at fault, but is unwilling to pay the compensation for his mistake, the entire burden is again placed on the company. The primary issue here is to determine whether the fault/negligence is caused by the doctor or the patient. However, it is very difficult to understand who is right and who is wrong, as both the patient and the doctor will make their own claims. In this case, too, the best option is to seek the opinions of an impartial third party.

You expressed that "A system where full responsibility rests with the individual surgeon may make surgeons more reluctant to admit their mistakes and possibly delay the treatment of complications. Moreover, the fact that the WBT head is not a medical professional may also contribute to the recruitment of incompetent surgeons without properly assessing their skills." I also agree with this.
  "Yes, the founder of WBT is not a medical doctor, he is a lengthening patient. This has its own advantages and disadvantages."  I said in my previous answer. The disadvantages in our system are actually related to the points you highlighted. However, there is a dilemma here. If the responsibility does not belong to the doctor but the system, this time, a problem may arise, such as the doctor not being meticulous enough in his work, since he is not responsible. Think about it, why should anyone care about their job if someone else will pay the price for their mistake in a job instead of themselves! Moreover, the tendency to avoid problems/responsibility is a mistake that most doctors make, whether the doctor is the founder of the company or not. Here, it becomes more important for the doctor to have a professional ethic and character that will ensure that he does not make this mistake. As you mentioned, insurance is a good option to overcome these problems and we will develop this option.

Thank you for your gracious approach, reasonable suggestions and criticisms. It was my pleasure to exchange ideas with you.
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The Victims Of WannaBeTaller

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Re: Wannabetaller destroyed my life
« Reply #112 on: August 24, 2023, 04:28:11 PM »

WBT provided Bubuzenggao with the contact information for Yuksel after the doctor's change, but it's unclear whether they did so because he preferred treatment from Yuksel rather than Yunus.
Additionally, it's unknown how the treatment expenses were handled at that time.
Regarding this matter, I would like to wait for an explanation from the parties involved. 

As an aside, Bubuzenggao especially wanted debridement early, but I suspect that the infection had already spread widely by the time the pus burst.
Therefore, debridement alone would not have been enough for a complete cure, and the removal of the nail would have been necessary.
Hello, I think you may have misunderstood something, possibly due to language translation issues. Firstly, bubuzenggao is not my name, it is wannabertaller‘s name in China. You misunderstood I think it is normal. But as the second in command of the company, I find it a bit ridiculous that he could even use bubuzenggao as my name. They don’t clarify it. Secondly, when I discovered the infection, I immediately contacted the company, but the company said that Yuksel was on vacation and would be back in 5 days, without medical ethics and the company was not responsible. After Yunus took over, I always insisted on undergoing debridement surgery, while the company and doctors insisted that only antibiotics were needed, which made me trust the doctor's judgment and delayed the optimal treatment period. I have kept these conversation records. I have retained sufficient evidence, they have no evidence at all, and they keep spread rumors and shamelessly claim that my screenshot is incomplete. So why did not they send out chat records for everyone to see ? Just to mention protecting patient privacy? OK , I authorize Wannarbeteller can send out chat records with me for everyone to see.

The Victims Of WannaBeTaller

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Re: Wannabetaller destroyed my life
« Reply #113 on: August 25, 2023, 10:50:18 AM »

There is one more thing I want to say to everyone: Wannabetaller has been saying that I am distorting the facts and intentionally smearing them. I want to say that speaking on the forum does not benefit me at all . But Wannbetaller spoke on the forum, anxious to whitewash teamself, transfer all responsibility to the victim, What's their purpose? Everyone should have a scale in their hearts. You can make your own judgments, whether to gamble or not, gamble on your own legs.

Maison

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Re: Wannabetaller destroyed my life
« Reply #114 on: August 26, 2023, 07:09:28 AM »

Hello, I think you may have misunderstood something, possibly due to language translation issues. Firstly, bubuzenggao is not my name, it is wannabertaller‘s name in China. You misunderstood I think it is normal. But as the second in command of the company, I find it a bit ridiculous that he could even use bubuzenggao as my name. They don’t clarify it. Secondly, when I discovered the infection, I immediately contacted the company, but the company said that Yuksel was on vacation and would be back in 5 days, without medical ethics and the company was not responsible. After Yunus took over, I always insisted on undergoing debridement surgery, while the company and doctors insisted that only antibiotics were needed, which made me trust the doctor's judgment and delayed the optimal treatment period. I have kept these conversation records. I have retained sufficient evidence, they have no evidence at all, and they keep spread rumors and shamelessly claim that my screenshot is incomplete. So why did not they send out chat records for everyone to see ? Just to mention protecting patient privacy? OK , I authorize Wannarbeteller can send out chat records with me for everyone to see.

Hello.I am sorry for the misunderstanding about your name. 

In my personal opinion, it was a stroke of good luck that another osteomyelitis case in WBT was healed with early debridement.
When osteomyelitis occurs in the tibia with an intramedullary nail and the inflammation is so strong that the skin surface is swollen, I believe that usually in addition to debridement, nail removal and prolonged antibiotic therapy are also necessary.
Therefore, I think it is possible that even with early debridement, the osteomyelitis would not have healed and you would have had to switch to the treatment you received in China.

Wannabetaller asked their new doctor yunus to prescribe antibiotic IV for me after 15 days of pus and let me go home and infuse.  But because they said that I am not serious and do not need to do debridement, they said that the pus will not flow into the bone cavity, and finally the infusion did not completely kill the bacteria, 2 months have passed and my wound has not fully healed, and there is still fluid coming out  , yunus said it’s okay, I can take a shower, and promised that there will be no more problems in the future. After less than 2 months, my knees began to be red, swollen and painful.

If this is true, then Dr. Yunus clearly made a mistake.
He allowed the patient to return home without confirming that the osteomyelitis had been fully treated.


Also, I am not sure of the timeline of your symptoms, is it possible for you to tell me?

The date of your initial surgery
The date when the external fixator was removed
(July 8, 2022: When you first observed swelling in your lower leg)
The date Yunus started you on antibiotics
(October 24, 2022: When the swelling reappeared)
The date of your surgery in China
« Last Edit: August 26, 2023, 08:58:33 AM by Maison »
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WannaBeTaller-Official

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Re: Wannabetaller destroyed my life
« Reply #115 on: August 26, 2023, 01:33:48 PM »

Hello, I think you may have misunderstood something, possibly due to language translation issues. Firstly, bubuzenggao is not my name, it is wannabertaller‘s name in China. You misunderstood I think it is normal. But as the second in command of the company, I find it a bit ridiculous that he could even use bubuzenggao as my name. They don’t clarify it. Secondly, when I discovered the infection, I immediately contacted the company, but the company said that Yuksel was on vacation and would be back in 5 days, without medical ethics and the company was not responsible. After Yunus took over, I always insisted on undergoing debridement surgery, while the company and doctors insisted that only antibiotics were needed, which made me trust the doctor's judgment and delayed the optimal treatment period. I have kept these conversation records. I have retained sufficient evidence, they have no evidence at all, and they keep spread rumors and shamelessly claim that my screenshot is incomplete. So why did not they send out chat records for everyone to see ? Just to mention protecting patient privacy? OK , I authorize Wannarbeteller can send out chat records with me for everyone to see.

While I was writing my answer to the Maison, I mentioned you as "this patient" and in parentheses I stated "You(Maison) called Bubuzenggao". Your nickname was a very long name like Wannabetaller- Bubuzenggao(victims of Turkey) and I shortened it as Maison did. While stating this, I thought that Maison had already assumed that Bubuzenggao as your nickname. Even in this, I was really surprised that you were looking for ulterior motives.

"Secondly, when I discovered the infection, I immediately contacted the company, but the company said that Yuksel was on vacation and would be back in 5 days, without medical ethics and the company was not responsible." you say. An infection cannot appear out of nowhere and suddenly progress. I think you were late to connect with the relevant units. (I may be wrong.)
In the ordinary course of life, it is possible for a doctor to be on vacation when a patient contacts his doctor. What the company does here is to refer to the legal positions of the parties (Company-Doctor-Patient) framed by contracts. Medical ethics is also not a completely independent concept from this legal framework.

"While I always insisted on having debridement surgery after Yunus took over, the company and the doctors insisted that only antibiotics were needed, which gave me confidence in the doctor's judgment and delayed optimal treatment time." you say. The company cannot put pressure on the patient in any treatment or diagnosis protocol, and cannot insist on such matters. The company has to act in accordance with the opinion of the doctor/expert in the diagnosis and treatment of the disease. What was did is that you just have been reminded of this fact at that time. Reminding this fact does not mean that the company insists on anything, it simply means that it has to stick to the framework set by the expert. The same goes for you. No patient can tell the doctor which treatment and diagnostic protocol to follow. He/she, like all parties, has to act in accordance with the instructions of the expert. If he claims that he has been harmed because of following the instructions of the specialist/doctor, what needs to be done here is to apply to third parties (court-expert), which is the company's policy in this regard. If you have conversation recordings showing that the doctor was wrong and you think you have enough evidence with them, what you need to do is to apply to a legal authority for your rights as soon as possible. If the doctor thinks that he has made the right treatment and diagnosis and you, on the contrary, you think that he has made a wrong diagnosis and treatment, the company will recommend that you apply to an impartial authority as a third party. If you were faced with the same situation in an institution where the founder of the company was a doctor himself, this path you should follow would not change even so.

Yes, I still claim that you manipulated your screenshots. The first is because you distract your attention with unfounded claims that are not related to your victimization, and the second because it makes you think that you have chosen the passages that you think are in your favor. I stated very clearly more than once why I did not prefer to share the chat logs. This is a professional and principled stance for us, regardless of your consent or opinion. Although it was in our favor from the beginning, we did not share any screenshots in any place, but you already share everything. Therefore, you have no reason to renege on you from sharing.
« Last Edit: August 26, 2023, 02:31:01 PM by WannaBeTaller-Official »
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WannaBeTaller-Official

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Re: Wannabetaller destroyed my life
« Reply #116 on: August 26, 2023, 01:54:20 PM »

There is one more thing I want to say to everyone: Wannabetaller has been saying that I am distorting the facts and intentionally smearing them. I want to say that speaking on the forum does not benefit me at all . But Wannbetaller spoke on the forum, anxious to whitewash teamself, transfer all responsibility to the victim, What's their purpose? Everyone should have a scale in their hearts. You can make your own judgments, whether to gamble or not, gamble on your own legs.


I don't want to get into the same useless discussions with you here and doom both us and the forum members to a vicious circle. Still, I think a few clarifications would be helpful.

I never wanted to enter into a conflict with you over the victimization you experienced. I even pointed out persistently that you have to focus on your grievances and that resorting to unfounded claims and manipulations will affect you most negatively, and if you are right, unfounded claims and manipulations will harm your righteousness.

The thread that got me into the forum discussions was the thread of "My review of wannabe taller Turkey (mostly negative )". I came to the forum to respond to unfounded allegations made under this title, which have no other purpose than to defame the company. I responded to the allegations made with full candor and frankness. I carefully noted all the constructive and concrete criticisms. But you got involved in the discussion yourself while I was fighting against slander and defamation on the company under this title. I have nothing to say about your involvement in the discussion. I just advised you to stay away from manipulations by inviting you to be honest and transparent. I have never put all the responsibility on you for your suffering. An unbiased eye will notice how impartial I try to be, given that I am even an official.

Yes, everyone should have a balance in their heart, and everyone should fight for justice in moral and just/fair ways. But you failed to do so. Since I do not want to repeat the same things here, I will not repeat my answers about why you failed to do this and will only give an example:

False: The company sold my address information through a former employee to another patient (named Seven) who wanted to harm me. (This was your claim.)
True: Due to the personal conflict between you and Seven, you have shared the private information of this patient (named Seven), including the photos and identity information, on various platforms with insults. We have told you that what you have done is both wrong and a serious crime under Turkish law, and that this may cause you to be punished. Moreover, you were making the same mistake for our staff from Xiangian, who did nothing but strive for your well-being. You did not listen to us and continued with your misbehavior. After a while, our former employee came directly to me and stated that the patient named Seven offered him money to find out your address and that he wanted to punish you for what you did. Upon this news, I asked your representative to be warned once again about the relevant issue. We advised the patient after your address to seek his rights through legal means instead of embarking on such a dangerous and illegal path. So what did you do?! Despite all our humane and professional behavior in this matter for your sake, you have accused us here of selling your information. (In fact, I should be ashamed of myself due to revisit and elaborate on your claim here.)

"You can make your own judgments, whether to gamble or not, gamble on your own legs." you said. I totally agree with your opinion. Let people decide of their own free will. We have already acknowledged in previous discussions that choosing a company for a lengthening surgery is a kind of "gamble". We have also openly acknowledged and stated that the possible complications/risks in this gamble can be minimized, but never eliminated entirely by the nature of any surgery, if the patient strictly adheres to the instructions of the experts.
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WannaBeTaller-Official

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Re: Wannabetaller destroyed my life
« Reply #117 on: August 26, 2023, 02:14:04 PM »

Hello.I am sorry for the misunderstanding about your name. 

In my personal opinion, it was a stroke of good luck that another osteomyelitis case in WBT was healed with early debridement.
When osteomyelitis occurs in the tibia with an intramedullary nail and the inflammation is so strong that the skin surface is swollen, I believe that usually in addition to debridement, nail removal and prolonged antibiotic therapy are also necessary.
Therefore, I think it is possible that even with early debridement, the osteomyelitis would not have healed and you would have had to switch to the treatment you received in China.

If this is true, then Dr. Yunus clearly made a mistake.
He allowed the patient to return home without confirming that the osteomyelitis had been fully treated.


Also, I am not sure of the timeline of your symptoms, is it possible for you to tell me?

The date of your initial surgery
The date when the external fixator was removed
(July 8, 2022: When you first observed swelling in your lower leg)
The date Yunus started you on antibiotics
(October 24, 2022: When the swelling reappeared)
The date of your surgery in China


All the details you mention here are matters that require a medical expertise. Therefore, I neither reject nor accept your claim that the doctor misdiagnosed and treated. I think it would be more appropriate to seek the opinions of an expert before a court, just as you did here, and to stick to the court's decision.

According to my personal observations up to now, Dr. Yunus is a successful and talended doctor. Before working with our company, he has treated many orthopedic cases with great success. Likewise, he has been with us for about two years and has performed lengthening surgeries on more than 120 patients during this time according to my estimation. (Three of these surgeries are shortening surgery.) Fortunately, no major complication developed in any of our patients. Some minor complications developed in approximately eight of our patients, and these complications could be prevented without causing a serious problem, with the doctor's on-site and timely intervention. (Bone nounion in two patients, internal nail distortion in one patient, elongation stopped due to loosening of the fixator screw in one patient, the onset of infection in one patient, failure of the precice nail in the right leg to nonextend in one patient, the screws in the fixator connections being too tight in one of our patients, fat embolism during removal surgery in one patient. All these complications were successfully managed and each of our patients is now healthy.)
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Maison

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Re: Wannabetaller destroyed my life
« Reply #118 on: August 26, 2023, 04:03:16 PM »

.
« Last Edit: August 26, 2023, 04:31:01 PM by Maison »
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Maison

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Re: Wannabetaller destroyed my life
« Reply #119 on: August 26, 2023, 04:30:25 PM »

Also, I am not sure of the timeline of your symptoms, is it possible for you to tell me?

The date of your initial surgery
The date when the external fixator was removed
(July 8, 2022: When you first observed swelling in your lower leg)
The date Yunus started you on antibiotics
(October 24, 2022: When the swelling reappeared)
The date of your surgery in China

Sorry, I forgot that I asked similar questions earlier on another topic.
Here is a summary of the timeline I found from your previous post.
If you have any corrections or additions, please add a description. If you can, it would be helpful if you could write in the same style as I did to make it easier to read.

January 1, 2022: Initial surgery
April 5: Removal of external fixation

July 8: First observation of swelling in lower leg
July 10: Swelling erupted with a large amount of pus
July 11: Treated by intern doctor
July 14: Yunus conducted a bacterial culture test and prescribed oral antibiotics
July 20: Diagnosed with osteomyelitis and started on injections of gentamicin and rifamycin for 6 weeks

September 1: Told by Yunus that no further treatment was needed  
?: Return date to home country

October 24: Swelling reappeared
?: Date of surgery in China 
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ZuzulaTrip

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Re: Wannabetaller destroyed my life
« Reply #120 on: August 26, 2023, 07:38:10 PM »


When you said "I'm a patient of WBT" I had the misconception that you were one of the patients currently staying at the hotel. Because the information you provided in your post gave the impression that you were one of the patients currently staying at the hotel. But I see that you are our ex-patient who posted unsubstantiated posts with the nickname  "rbkfh7". We will not let your goal, which you seek to achieve with your palace intrigues and smokescreens that seem complicated but in fact very simple come true. Adorno says "A wrong life cannot be lived right." I also say to you that a right purpose cannot be achieved by wrong manners.

Based on the answers I've seen on this forum, I thought you as clever guy and expected you to notice this situation sooner. But you couldn't!!!!! That patient is indeed one of yours and is still at the hotel. You're mistaken to think he's not. A Finnish mischief maker, it seems!!!!!!!!! The Chinese patient, who was allegedly harassed , handed over the videos and others to the Finnish patient. Then he shared those videos and other allegations on this forum.
I'm sure they'll continue with what they're doing.
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WannaBeTaller-Official

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Re: Wannabetaller destroyed my life
« Reply #121 on: August 26, 2023, 11:23:24 PM »

Based on the answers I've seen on this forum, I thought you as clever guy and expected you to notice this situation sooner. But you couldn't!!!!! That patient is indeed one of yours and is still at the hotel. You're mistaken to think he's not. A Finnish mischief maker, it seems!!!!!!!!! The Chinese patient, who was allegedly harassed , handed over the videos and others to the Finnish patient. Then he shared those videos and other allegations on this forum.
I'm sure they'll continue with what they're doing.

What a weird claim this is! We have only one Finnish patient and I think he has no reason to be so hostile towards us. He finished his process in a very healthy way. His health is quite good. Besides, I don't think he has an unfulfilled request or a complaint that hasn't been taken into account. Moreover, although his process has ended for a long time, he still continues to stay in our hotel. We see this as an indicator of his satisfaction. So he has no reason to do what you say.

The Chinese patient who stayed at our hotel and finished the first surgery process has also no reason to be a part of such a smear campaign! We did our best for her safety and well-being. After the events between the four patients got out of control, I personally took the initiative for her well-being and safety. 

Why would they do such a foolish thing!? It is very sad that this forum has turned into a witch's cauldron with such useless discussions and weird claims. We are really unfair to forum members.
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jerrytheman

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Re: Wannabetaller destroyed my life
« Reply #122 on: August 27, 2023, 05:31:43 AM »

When WannaBeTaller spends more time luring people to get crippled in their clinic on here than to actually help those patients o.O
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WannaBeTaller-Official

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Re: Wannabetaller destroyed my life
« Reply #123 on: August 27, 2023, 12:17:52 PM »

When WannaBeTaller spends more time luring people to get crippled in their clinic on here than to actually help those patients o.O


When "Jerrytheman '' doesn't even understand what I've written up to now so far as "Jerry" in Tom&Jerry of Warner Bross does. o.0.O

Please stop blemishing us like a troll and try to be neutral. This is a platform where people share their experiences and ideas. We prefer to observe this platform only as a resource where we can make inferences in favor of our patients and improve ourselves, as long as there are no unfounded claims that force us to defend ourselves.
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