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[HateLAPELoveSTEM]

I am only 162cm barefoot at night which remains an excruciating shame to me and I want to do Option 5, since I have enough moeny for to me go for it.
I live in China and I know there will be someone recommending me to do 13cm instead but that will still be considered short due to the toxic ideologies saturating into the society now(The average height of GenZ is 180cm or so or even taller and many dumb ppl truly believe it and will disdain anything below 180cm as average). With a pair of shoes on I will reach 181cm or so after Option 5 but now I have deep fear of its feasibility. If I can't do Option 5 my complex inferiority will never disappear entirely, or maybe I should move to another country with less heightism?(Admittedly China is the most heightism country all over the world now)

[EndGame]

In which country is average height of gen z 180?

[HateLAPELoveSTEM]

In which country is average height of gen z 180?

I think I mentioned China and of course it is totally bs but China is very heightism so you gotta be over 180cm to be 'average'.

[LONFemurs2021]

In which country is average height of gen z 180?

https://www.worlddata.info/average-bodyheight.php
This is general average, but it's pretty safe to assume that the countries with an average height of 179 got an average of 180 or so specifically for gen z as well.

[TheDream]

Height dysphoria is heavily correlated with a toxic environment.
Basically it is your mind going into panic and telling you to risk everything to try and fix something really shameful. This shame is fueled by the environment.

I think that doing LL is not a bad move, but going for that many cm’s is. As in, if you feel you have to still wear tall shoes or whatever afterwards to reach X height, then this is not good.

China is probably the most toxic country on the planet when it comes to heightism. If you can get out of there as fast as you can. Trust me, the Chinese Gen z are not 180 cm on average, it’s lies due to the extreme heightist environment. Basically it is prestigious to have your young generation be as tall as the Netherlands and Norway and Denmark on average, so that’s what ends up being the “data”.

In a healthy mind you would go for maybe 5-6 cm on femurs, and the. Maybe 4-5 cm on tibias years later, and be happy with your new height, and move on with life no longer thinking about height.

I think you’ve been traumatized so much by Chinese society you need therapy + LL to get rid of the shame.

[HateLAPELoveSTEM]

Height dysphoria is heavily correlated with a toxic environment.
Basically it is your mind going into panic and telling you to risk everything to try and fix something really shameful. This shame is fueled by the environment.

I think that doing LL is not a bad move, but going for that many cm’s is. As in, if you feel you have to still wear tall shoes or whatever afterwards to reach X height, then this is not good.

China is probably the most toxic country on the planet when it comes to heightism. If you can get out of there as fast as you can. Trust me, the Chinese Gen z are not 180 cm on average, it’s lies due to the extreme heightist environment. Basically it is prestigious to have your young generation be as tall as the Netherlands and Norway and Denmark on average, so that’s what ends up being the “data”.

In a healthy mind you would go for maybe 5-6 cm on femurs, and the. Maybe 4-5 cm on tibias years later, and be happy with your new height, and move on with life no longer thinking about height.

I think you’ve been traumatized so much by Chinese society you need therapy + LL to get rid of the shame.

Thx a lot! I appreciate your reply!

It seems to me nowadays China has become more heightism even than West and I even stumbled upon a female on the Internet(but I suspected her to be a male) who said 'Short men gotta be crushed by a truck and they should be considered as the crime committers because they can not see the trucks so the accidents are their faults!'

I myself also have been called to kms for many times because of my height(but only on the Internet. I guess that is because China's Internet is now very toxic since there are many ignorants egoists misandrists misognists etc.. Everyone irl treats me well, though I am only 162cm.) Things like 185cm ugly stupid poor man has higher possibilities of dating a girl than 160cm handsome rich man are indeed happening and that's why I am dying for a 178cm height(It can lied about as 180cm and with shoes on I can self-report my height is 182cm).

Don't downplay the difference between 175cm and 180cm. As though trivial the visual difference is, there will be a big differences of sxxual attractions and social respects between reporting 175cm and 180cm. I am also too tired to 'compensate' for my 162cm height by contriving to be/prove myself xxx, yyy, zzz only to be perceived as 'a short man deserving to be respected'. So yeah, you can see this is kinda tragic that tall man does not need to be xxxyyyzz to able to be respected. I know it is not correct to live myself on others' opinions about me but it's really hard for me to be confident while having no other advantages, not to mention I found out the more understandings about myself I had, the worse I found out I was.

[TheDream]

Thx a lot! I appreciate your reply!

It seems to me nowadays China has become more heightism even than West and I even stumbled upon a female on the Internet(but I suspected her to be a male) who said 'Short men gotta be crushed by a truck and they should be considered as the crime committers because they can not see the trucks so the accidents are their faults!'

I myself also have been called to kms for many times because of my height(but only on the Internet. I guess that is because China's Internet is now very toxic since there are many ignorants egoists misandrists misognists etc.. Everyone irl treats me well, though I am only 162cm.) Things like 185cm ugly stupid poor man has higher possibilities of dating a girl than 160cm handsome rich man are indeed happening and that's why I am dying for a 178cm height(It can lied about as 180cm and with shoes on I can self-report my height is 182cm).

Don't downplay the difference between 175cm and 180cm. As though trivial the visual difference is, there will be a big differences of sxxual attractions and social respects between reporting 175cm and 180cm. I am also too tired to 'compensate' for my 162cm height by contriving to be/prove myself xxx, yyy, zzz only to be perceived as 'a short man deserving to be respected'. So yeah, you can see this is kinda tragic that tall man does not need to be xxxyyyzz to able to be respected. I know it is not correct to live myself on others' opinions about me but it's really hard for me to be confident while having no other advantages, not to mention I found out the more understandings about myself I had, the worse I found out I was.

Sorcerer you have to relax with the 180 cm, and realize this is not logical but crazy talk.

Wanting to be taller and putting in the effort, money and time to do LL is logical.

Doing 12 cm+ lengthening just to then walk in tall shoes to then lie about 180 cm is insanity.

I’m not saying this to insult you, but just to try and give you a voice of sanity, because it sounds like you have been surrounded by some crazy talk when it comes to height.

Does China have a really big incel problem due to the 1 child policy some years ago (i.e. more young men than young women?) because what you described from the Chinese internet sounds a lot like that.

[HateLAPELoveSTEM]

Sorcerer you have to relax with the 180 cm, and realize this is not logical but crazy talk.

Wanting to be taller and putting in the effort, money and time to do LL is logical.

Doing 12 cm+ lengthening just to then walk in tall shoes to then lie about 180 cm is insanity.

I’m not saying this to insult you, but just to try and give you a voice of sanity, because it sounds like you have been surrounded by some crazy talk when it comes to height.

Does China have a really big incel problem due to the 1 child policy some years ago (i.e. more young men than young women?) because what you described from the Chinese internet sounds a lot like that.

That there are more young men than young women is not the culprit of China's nowadays inceldom. China is indeed suffering from an imbalanced sexual ratio but the imbalance is not so big that it can empower women to perceive themselves as if they were queens. I think women are condescending upon men is because 'Douyin' and 'Kuaishou' are encouraging them to do so but it's astounishing to me that men are also condescending upon each other even though they are hating women's condescendances. 

As a side note because of the toxicity of China's Internet I am spending most of my time on the International Internet. Can't say it is perfect either of course but much better, at least there are no too toxic ideologies spewed out. Another merit of spending your time there is that users have more sanities on avg than those on the China's Internet. China's Internet is now like a massive asylum.

[1team]

What is the point of this post? You want to lengthen 16cm with Paley and you said you have the money to do it. So go do it.

[TheDream]

The first man to go into space was 1.57 m so there is absolutely nothing shameful about being smaller as a man. Most fighter pilots are also of a smaller size. The people posting that stuff on social media or harboring those opinions are just warped. If you want to do LL to work on the bad self image this is absolutely fair, but my advice is you need to find some middle ground.

You will have to use those legs the rest of your life, which hopefully also means when you are older. So I think mobility and preserving athletic ability should be a lot more important when doing LL than reaching some crazy number that will make those people approve of you. Trust me, if you waved a magic wand, and you were magically 1.8 m tomorrow, and you were married to one of these women, you would find out very fast that they are crazy about other stuff too, and not very pleasent to be with.

Unfortunately we are just wired very strongly as humans to gain the social approval of the village, and when the village is crazy then so will our desires and self image.

Set a more realistic goal, and try to seriously work against this idea that anything less than 1.8 m is shameful. Because that is just simply not true.

[tsmith4900]

Things like 185cm ugly stupid poor man has higher possibilities of dating a girl than 160cm handsome rich man are indeed happening and that's why I am dying for a 178cm height(It can lied about as 180cm and with shoes on I can self-report my height is 182cm).

So, you've finally accepted that height and looks are more important than money and normie 'career success'?

[tsmith4900]

The first man to go into space was 1.57 m so there is absolutely nothing shameful about being smaller as a man. Most fighter pilots are also of a smaller size. The people posting that stuff on social media or harboring those opinions are just warped. If you want to do LL to work on the bad self image this is absolutely fair, but my advice is you need to find some middle ground.

You will have to use those legs the rest of your life, which hopefully also means when you are older. So I think mobility and preserving athletic ability should be a lot more important when doing LL than reaching some crazy number that will make those people approve of you. Trust me, if you waved a magic wand, and you were magically 1.8 m tomorrow, and you were married to one of these women, you would find out very fast that they are crazy about other stuff too, and not very pleasent to be with.

Unfortunately we are just wired very strongly as humans to gain the social approval of the village, and when the village is crazy then so will our desires and self image.

Set a more realistic goal, and try to seriously work against this idea that anything less than 1.8 m is shameful. Because that is just simply not true.

There is something shameful about it as we are not islands - gaining the approval of others is a very normal and rational thing to desire. The weird ones are actually those who unironically think they should only 'do LL for themselves'. Back in reality, thousands of years of evolution has meant those who were accepted by the tribe and village survived and prospered while those who did not died out.

Anyone who is 'proud to be short' or whatever coping normie phrase of the day is used is actually mentally ill. It's like saying you're proud to be illiterate, to have a small dck, to work at McDonalds, to be a 30 year old virgin or whatever. It's objectively a bad thing to be short, that's the whole point of doing LL to begin with.

The manlet cope that women who have height standards are just bitches is just that - a cope. I'm sure you have looks standards for a girl and don't consider yourself unpleasant and toxic. Attraction is important and non-negotiable for both sexes.

[dboy123]

If you have the money do it but understand the risk and everything I agree Paley is probably the top Dr. in the world for LL, but I'm assuming option 5 is lengthen, then rebreak?     Also what's your wingspan and how about your frame? Do you care about aesthetically being good or just want to LL? because 5'3 to 5'10 is a big jump         

[HateLAPELoveSTEM]

If you have the money do it but understand the risk and everything I agree Paley is probably the top Dr. in the world for LL, but I'm assuming option 5 is lengthen, then rebreak?     Also what's your wingspan and how about your frame? Do you care about aesthetically being good or just want to LL? because 5'3 to 5'10 is a big jump         

My Wingspan is pretty much my height I guess but I don't care being disproportional since that is way better than being short.
Of course a conventional 16cm quadrilateral lengthening will be impossible, but Paley rendered it into a possible one by rebreaking.

[1team]

My Wingspan is pretty much my height I guess but I don't care being disproportional since that is way better than being short.
Of course a conventional 16cm quadrilateral lengthening will be impossible, but Paley rendered it into a possible one by rebreaking.

You need to add in arm lengthening as well since having an ape index at -16cm will look absolutely ridiculous. When are you having the surgery done?

[HateLAPELoveSTEM]

You need to add in arm lengthening as well since having an ape index at -16cm will look absolutely ridiculous. When are you having the surgery done?

I am not sure why 2cm arm lengthening can improve the ape idex. Btw I am planning to do it years after. I am now still studying and can't spare time to do it.

[EndGame]

I am not sure why 2cm arm lengthening can improve the ape idex. Btw I am planning to do it years after. I am now still studying and can't spare time to do it.

Why are you saying 2cm arm lengthening? The top US LL doctors all seem to agree 5cm humerus LL safe reasonable way to go. Additionally, 5cm adds 10cm total to arm span and would be a huge difference. You should precisely measure your arm span as +1" vs -1" starting ape index is significant (you said about 0" right?) if you really want to add 6.3" through 16cm double quad option 5 with Paley. Unfortunately, -16cm ape index likely would look noticably off and kinda bad. I'm not trying to discourage you from doing 16cm, but rather suggesting you should think about time/money of doing arm LL after +16cm quad LL as you'll very likely feel like you need it to balance things out. The other key proportion to consider is your SHR. What is your sitting height? If you'd end up 0.50 or lower after +16cm LL (a near certainty given your starting height) that starts to look weird on most people, but long arms I think help balance out proportions on someone with a very low SHR. Not hating, just really think arm LL may dramatically improve your post +16cm double quad LL appearance. Good luck on your LL journey!

[dboy123]

Why are you saying 2cm arm lengthening? The top US LL doctors all seem to agree 5cm humerus LL safe reasonable way to go. Additionally, 5cm adds 10cm total to arm span and would be a huge difference. You should precisely measure your arm span as +1" vs -1" starting ape index is significant (you said about 0" right?) if you really want to add 6.3" through 16cm double quad option 5 with Paley. Unfortunately, -16cm ape index likely would look noticably off and kinda bad. I'm not trying to discourage you from doing 16cm, but rather suggesting you should think about time/money of doing arm LL after +16cm quad LL as you'll very likely feel like you need it to balance things out. The other key proportion to consider is your SHR. What is your sitting height? If you'd end up 0.50 or lower after +16cm LL (a near certainty given your starting height) that starts to look weird on most people, but long arms I think help balance out proportions on someone with a very low SHR. Not hating, just really think arm LL may dramatically improve your post +16cm double quad LL appearance. Good luck on your LL journey!

Not only sitting height or wingspan, unless your built fking bulky, people at 5'3 have smaller freaking frames/torso, as well as broad shoulders, I know there's small frame tall ppl there but it looks weird when all things don't go together.

[HateLAPELoveSTEM]

Why are you saying 2cm arm lengthening? The top US LL doctors all seem to agree 5cm humerus LL safe reasonable way to go. Additionally, 5cm adds 10cm total to arm span and would be a huge difference. You should precisely measure your arm span as +1" vs -1" starting ape index is significant (you said about 0" right?) if you really want to add 6.3" through 16cm double quad option 5 with Paley. Unfortunately, -16cm ape index likely would look noticably off and kinda bad. I'm not trying to discourage you from doing 16cm, but rather suggesting you should think about time/money of doing arm LL after +16cm quad LL as you'll very likely feel like you need it to balance things out. The other key proportion to consider is your SHR. What is your sitting height? If you'd end up 0.50 or lower after +16cm LL (a near certainty given your starting height) that starts to look weird on most people, but long arms I think help balance out proportions on someone with a very low SHR. Not hating, just really think arm LL may dramatically improve your post +16cm double quad LL appearance. Good luck on your LL journey!

I have yet to measure my sitting height but my legs are relatively short to my torso. I will one day post my body photo.

[HateLAPELoveSTEM]

Not only sitting height or wingspan, unless your built fking bulky, people at 5'3 have smaller freaking frames/torso, as well as broad shoulders, I know there's small frame tall ppl there but it looks weird when all things don't go together.

I think the guy above you got it right that longer armspan can balance out disproportion a little, any being disproportional or looking weird to me is way better than being short, at least nobody will discriminate you because you look weird but it is different when you are short.

[1team]

I think if you already accept you'll look odd doing that amount it's better mentally. Very unfair to be a 162cm man as we don't have the ability yet to get someone 16cm taller without looking weird.

It's also going to be an insane amount of time spent recovering from all these surgeries, is there any chance of doing them sooner as you don't want to waste your 20s with all these surgeries like take a break from your studies.

[dboy123]

I think the guy above you got it right that longer armspan can balance out disproportion a little, any being disproportional or looking weird to me is way better than being short, at least nobody will discriminate you because you look weird but it is different when you are short.

Also be prepared for a long 3 year recovery as your breaking your legs and rebreaking extending the recovery peroid, as well doing arm lengthening it could possibly be 4 years till your actually normal better do it early then later. If I were you I would probably do G-Nail or Betz nail just for time savings and go ahead and do 9.5cm on femurs and 6.5 on tibia, yes your more prone to complications but your saving time and money.

[KrP1]

what are the prices there?

[1team]

Also be prepared for a long 3 year recovery as your breaking your legs and rebreaking extending the recovery peroid, as well doing arm lengthening it could possibly be 4 years till your actually normal better do it early then later. If I were you I would probably do G-Nail or Betz nail just for time savings and go ahead and do 9.5cm on femurs and 6.5 on tibia, yes your more prone to complications but your saving time and money.

Those are huge amounts for a guy who average height remember OP is 162cm which is tiny, it would be murder on his body to be doing those amounts without rebreaks. Agree the worst is if he goes through his 20s wasting it for surgeries just to be in his 30s to look weird as hell with his proportions. It's a really tough call.

[tallmen]

I am only 162cm barefoot at night which remains an excruciating shame to me and I want to do Option 5, since I have enough moeny for to me go for it.
I live in China and I know there will be someone recommending me to do 13cm instead but that will still be considered short due to the toxic ideologies saturating into the society now(The average height of GenZ is 180cm or so or even taller and many dumb ppl truly believe it and will disdain anything below 180cm as average). With a pair of shoes on I will reach 181cm or so after Option 5 but now I have deep fear of its feasibility. If I can't do Option 5 my complex inferiority will never disappear entirely, or maybe I should move to another country with less heightism?(Admittedly China is the most heightism country all over the world now)

Don't destroy your body. Do it upto 175cm and then wear elevator shoes. You don't need to be 180cm.