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Author Topic: Precise 2.2 CLL (femurs) with Dr. Rozbruch - February 2023  (Read 7202 times)

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uponly

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Precise 2.2 CLL (femurs) with Dr. Rozbruch - February 2023
« on: January 31, 2023, 09:46:30 PM »

I'm excited to share that I'll be undergoing CLL with Dr. Rozbruch in NYC very soon (next two weeks).  I will do my best to document my experience for others who are contemplating the surgery.

Vital stats: male, in excellent health, over 35. Non smoker/drinker/no drugs. Measured at 5'10" (178cm) or so in Dr. Rozbruch's office - though my Dr. and home measurements have me somewhere around 5'10.5' (179cm or thereabouts). Weigh 150 lbs. and plan to get to 145 lbs. by surgery time.  My canals are wide enough for the 12.5" nails which will allow some limited mobility with crutches during lengthening.

I pre-qualified through psychological assessments and consult with Dr. Rozbruch. Consulted both Dr. Rozbruch and Dr. Paley, and while both are obviously excellent choices, ultimately felt more comfortable with Dr. Rozbruch's approach and the reputation of HSS as being a world class hospital.

Given the (slow but certain) disappearing stigma around this procedure, its increase, and clinical acceptance of height dysmorphia, I am hoping this will be a judgment free place to post and help others through my experience.  I've been open about the procedure with my immediate family, close friends and significant other, who have all been encouraging.  I won't engage in any back/forth around why I'm having the procedure done with my height being what it is. I've suffered from height dysmorphia for decades and Dr. Paley has an excellent write-up on his experience with a 5'11" patient.  This is something I'm doing for ME, not for relationships, career, otherwise.

Will respond to most questions and do my best to keep a thorough journal.  Will not post pics - x-rays all look the same.

Thanks, and wish me luck!!
« Last Edit: January 31, 2023, 10:52:37 PM by uponly »
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Starting height: 5'10"ish (179cm).   Desired height: 6'1.5" (187cm).   Achieved on 5/31/23: 6'1.5" (187.3 cm).

Disclaimer: I am not a doctor. Nothing I post is intended to be or interpreted as medical advice. I am posting about my CLL experience for informational purposes only

informationispower

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Re: Precise 2.2 CLL (tibias) with Dr. Rozbruch - February 2023
« Reply #1 on: January 31, 2023, 10:24:50 PM »

Can I ask you why are you doing this? Not shaming but just curious as to why someone of an upper average height would pay so much and ensure ao much.

I wish you a safe and successful journey
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uponly

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Re: Precise 2.2 CLL (femurs) with Dr. Rozbruch - February 2023
« Reply #2 on: January 31, 2023, 10:27:58 PM »

Can I ask you why are you doing this? Not shaming but just curious as to why someone of an upper average height would pay so much and ensure ao much.

I wish you a safe and successful journey

I've had severe height dysmorphia since I was 15 years old.  I weighted the pros and cons and decided it was worth it for me to no longer bear this mental burden.  Really, that's it. 

Page 6 of this document by Dr. Paley has a very good explanation with someone near my starting height.

https://paleyinstitute.org/wp-content/uploads/Cosmetic-Stature-Lengthening-FAQs.pdf
« Last Edit: January 31, 2023, 10:53:42 PM by uponly »
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Starting height: 5'10"ish (179cm).   Desired height: 6'1.5" (187cm).   Achieved on 5/31/23: 6'1.5" (187.3 cm).

Disclaimer: I am not a doctor. Nothing I post is intended to be or interpreted as medical advice. I am posting about my CLL experience for informational purposes only

stretched

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Re: Precise 2.2 CLL (tibias) with Dr. Rozbruch - February 2023
« Reply #3 on: January 31, 2023, 10:46:25 PM »

What made you decide to go with the tibias over femurs?
Best of luck, you got this
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Goal: 161cm -> 170cm Quad Lengthening ~2026

uponly

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Re: Precice 2.2 CLL (femurs) with Dr. Rozbruch - February 2023
« Reply #4 on: January 31, 2023, 10:52:21 PM »

What made you decide to go with the tibias over femurs?
Best of luck, you got this

Both Dr. Paley and Dr. Rozbruch recommended femurs.  My sincere apologies and thank you for catching this.  I also edited the subject.

Both also had the same reasons.  My tibias are proportionate, and my femurs are objectively and visibly short. I have a long torso and above average wingspan.  Lengthening the femurs will actually bring me into proportion ratio-wise, and is safer, so it all made sense.
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Starting height: 5'10"ish (179cm).   Desired height: 6'1.5" (187cm).   Achieved on 5/31/23: 6'1.5" (187.3 cm).

Disclaimer: I am not a doctor. Nothing I post is intended to be or interpreted as medical advice. I am posting about my CLL experience for informational purposes only

EndGame

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Re: Precise 2.2 CLL (femurs) with Dr. Rozbruch - February 2023
« Reply #5 on: February 01, 2023, 12:15:18 AM »

I'm excited to share that I'll be undergoing CLL with Dr. Rozbruch in NYC very soon (next two weeks).  I will do my best to document my experience for others who are contemplating the surgery.

Vital stats: male, in excellent health, over 35. Non smoker/drinker/no drugs. Measured at 5'10" (178cm) or so in Dr. Rozbruch's office - though my Dr. and home measurements have me somewhere around 5'10.5' (179cm or thereabouts). Weigh 150 lbs. and plan to get to 145 lbs. by surgery time.  My canals are wide enough for the 12.5" nails which will allow some limited mobility with crutches during lengthening.

I pre-qualified through psychological assessments and consult with Dr. Rozbruch. Consulted both Dr. Rozbruch and Dr. Paley, and while both are obviously excellent choices, ultimately felt more comfortable with Dr. Rozbruch's approach and the reputation of HSS as being a world class hospital.

Given the (slow but certain) disappearing stigma around this procedure, its increase, and clinical acceptance of height dysmorphia, I am hoping this will be a judgment free place to post and help others through my experience.  I've been open about the procedure with my immediate family, close friends and significant other, who have all been encouraging.  I won't engage in any back/forth around why I'm having the procedure done with my height being what it is. I've suffered from height dysmorphia for decades and Dr. Paley has an excellent write-up on his experience with a 5'11" patient.  This is something I'm doing for ME, not for relationships, career, otherwise.

Will respond to most questions and do my best to keep a thorough journal.  Will not post pics - x-rays all look the same.

Thanks, and wish me luck!!

What do you mean by "I pre-qualified through psychological assessments"? What is required to qualify? I am actually confused on what Dr. Rozbruch's stance on LL actually is.  He seems to lengthen patients, including you OP, that he claims he doesn't believe in lengthening.

https://www.businessinsider.com/limb-lengthening-surgery-not-make-you-taller-cosmetic-height-2022-12

 I am all for you or anyone with height disphorea getting LL. I think what Paley has in his brochure is the correct thinking. Good luck on your LL journey!
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uponly

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Re: Precise 2.2 CLL (femurs) with Dr. Rozbruch - February 2023
« Reply #6 on: February 01, 2023, 12:36:23 AM »

What do you mean by "I pre-qualified through psychological assessments"? What is required to qualify?

I had to undertake a psychological assessment.  It was very thorough and if I hadn't been approved by Dr. Westrich I would not have done the surgery with Dr. Rozbruch.

I'm not certain that Dr. Rozbruch doesn't believe in lengthening taller patients, or if he did, that thinking may have changed. I do know he requires a psychological eval, Dr. Paley no longer so. As I said, ultimately I think Dr. Rozbruch was the right choice for me - two excellent surgeons but felt more comfortable with Dr. Rozbruch and HSS.

By the way, really appreciate your well wishes, as well as everyone else's!!
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Starting height: 5'10"ish (179cm).   Desired height: 6'1.5" (187cm).   Achieved on 5/31/23: 6'1.5" (187.3 cm).

Disclaimer: I am not a doctor. Nothing I post is intended to be or interpreted as medical advice. I am posting about my CLL experience for informational purposes only

SpeedDialer

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Re: Precise 2.2 CLL (femurs) with Dr. Rozbruch - February 2023
« Reply #7 on: February 01, 2023, 01:00:46 AM »

I'm excited to share that I'll be undergoing CLL with Dr. Rozbruch in NYC very soon (next two weeks).  I will do my best to document my experience for others who are contemplating the surgery.

Vital stats: male, in excellent health, over 35. Non smoker/drinker/no drugs. Measured at 5'10" (178cm) or so in Dr. Rozbruch's office - though my Dr. and home measurements have me somewhere around 5'10.5' (179cm or thereabouts). Weigh 150 lbs. and plan to get to 145 lbs. by surgery time.  My canals are wide enough for the 12.5" nails which will allow some limited mobility with crutches during lengthening.

I pre-qualified through psychological assessments and consult with Dr. Rozbruch. Consulted both Dr. Rozbruch and Dr. Paley, and while both are obviously excellent choices, ultimately felt more comfortable with Dr. Rozbruch's approach and the reputation of HSS as being a world class hospital.

Given the (slow but certain) disappearing stigma around this procedure, its increase, and clinical acceptance of height dysmorphia, I am hoping this will be a judgment free place to post and help others through my experience.  I've been open about the procedure with my immediate family, close friends and significant other, who have all been encouraging.  I won't engage in any back/forth around why I'm having the procedure done with my height being what it is. I've suffered from height dysmorphia for decades and Dr. Paley has an excellent write-up on his experience with a 5'11" patient.  This is something I'm doing for ME, not for relationships, career, otherwise.

Will respond to most questions and do my best to keep a thorough journal.  Will not post pics - x-rays all look the same.

Thanks, and wish me luck!!

Congrats!!!!

Good starting height, good starting low weight, good bone diameter, good doctor, good device, good health, I think you're going to do great! 
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uponly

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Re: Precise 2.2 CLL (femurs) with Dr. Rozbruch - February 2023
« Reply #8 on: February 02, 2023, 05:55:54 PM »

Pre-op procedures:

This had to be the absolute most thorough hospital/Dr.'s visit I have ever had and it only increased my confidence that I'm doing this procedure with the right doctor at the right hospital.

You arrive on the 3rd floor, you check in and you're immediately sent to 6th to obtain Dr.'s clearance. Note: this is in HSS, but a separate part of the hospital from Dr. Rozbruch's practice. You first meet with a RN who will ask you every question imaginable about your health history, medicine you take, past surgeries, family health history and so on. Blood pressure, heart rate, oxygen, height (I measured 179 cm!!), weight. They even measured my neck circumference. They go over protocols for before/after surgery: what you can eat/drink, what to avoid, what supplements to take/stop, etc., even shower procedures. You get a special scrubber that you need to scrub your femurs (in my case) for 2 minutes each night before surgery. They print all this out for you.

Then a Dr. comes in, and asks even more detailed questions, and upon satisfactory answers she orders tests and sends you to get an EKG, blood work (which will inform what supplements/meds you will need), and COVID test. Note: COVID protocols are in place at HSS, everyone is wearing masks and everything is sanitized.

After the COVID test you're sent to Dr. Rozbruch's office across the street (still part of HSS), where you go in for the specialized x-rays. They take them from different angles. You then see staff who take before pictures from all angles and video of walking, gait, etc. Then a PA comes in to answer any other questions you have about procedure, logistics, and to ensure you have support. They tell you what you can expect day of surgery. You get brochures and paperwork on recovery, facilities, etc.

Everything is done on time and the process works like a finely tuned machine. Everyone is incredibly nice and supportive. Pro tip: doing the paperwork through the portal saves time, do that before you go to the pre-op appointment.

Obviously do not lie to doctors or hospital staff, it would not be in your best interest going into any type of surgery. I answered every question with full honesty. The pre-op visit actually eliminated a lot of anxiety and I'm going into the surgery with a great degree of confidence.
« Last Edit: February 02, 2023, 06:22:03 PM by uponly »
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Starting height: 5'10"ish (179cm).   Desired height: 6'1.5" (187cm).   Achieved on 5/31/23: 6'1.5" (187.3 cm).

Disclaimer: I am not a doctor. Nothing I post is intended to be or interpreted as medical advice. I am posting about my CLL experience for informational purposes only

uponly

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Re: Precise 2.2 CLL (femurs) with Dr. Rozbruch - February 2023
« Reply #9 on: February 07, 2023, 09:41:45 AM »

Day Zero, through operation

I'm officially a cyborg. The operation went off without a hitch.

Pain level: 3/10 - where 0 is no pain and 10 is the worst pain of your life.

There's a lot of really good information that's missing about what happens up to and during the procedure, especially with Dr. Rozbruch and HSS, so I will do my best to add.

3 days before the surgery, you get a call with your surgery time. You're supposed to arrive 2 hours early, check in, get a wrist band and are sent to the 4th floor. If you have someone accompanying you, they MUST either have been vaccinated or have a PCR test (not antigen) no later than 5 days prior. This hospital is incredibly serious about COVID. Everyone is masked, everyone sanitizes frequently, which is awesome. The hospital and facilities appear to be very clean.

I went to 4 where I changed into a gown and got a bag for my personal items. Valuables are checked in with security. You're advised to not bring too much that is checked in. You get an IV drip going, and lots of people come and ask you both medical as well as safety/security related questions. You get your legs shaved with surgical clippers, which I'm going to buy based on their sheer effectiveness, assuming I can find them. Then you get scrubbed/sanitized again. Everything is super thorough. No one wants to make a mistake. You even get a visit from a "spiritual helper" of some sort who is just there to pep you up, and you have the option of having a chaplain (or other faith based leader) if needed prior to and post surgery.

You're eventually seen by an anesthesiologist, then Dr. Rozbruch, who signs the areas operated on, your bracelet and talks to you about what's going to happen, when you can expect to be released, and answers questions. Dr. Rozbruch informed me that he would try the 12.5mm diameter nails, but had the 10.7 just in case the former did not fit. Thankfully they did!!

My surgery was a bit delayed because the OR was very busy. This is apparently normal, and I took it as a good sign that they weren't rushing people through like an assembly line. When I got wheeled into the OR, there was music playing and a ton of staff just for me. I saw two Nuvasive boxes, was transferred to the operating bed, and chatted with the nurses and staff a bit. Then the anesthesiologist came in, went over what we discussed, and began to administer the epidural (general anesthesia is a last resort option) and nerve block. You essentially feel nothing from the waist down and it's safer, and you sleep the entire time. I wondered if I would. I did, because shortly after that I remember nothing and woke up several hours later in the recovery room. I never even saw Dr. Rozbruch enter the OR lol.
« Last Edit: February 07, 2023, 10:08:54 AM by uponly »
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Starting height: 5'10"ish (179cm).   Desired height: 6'1.5" (187cm).   Achieved on 5/31/23: 6'1.5" (187.3 cm).

Disclaimer: I am not a doctor. Nothing I post is intended to be or interpreted as medical advice. I am posting about my CLL experience for informational purposes only

uponly

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Re: Precise 2.2 CLL (femurs) with Dr. Rozbruch - February 2023
« Reply #10 on: February 07, 2023, 10:05:06 AM »

Day Zero, recovery to now

Pain level: 3/10. I should add the pain is really stiffness - think of it as having gone really hard on leg day and you're sore AF a day later. If you're not moving, you're fine.

You wake up kind of not knowing where you are, then the fog starts to lift. As soon as you're awake nurses begin to check on you. The first thing they want to see is how far along the nerve block is. You don't leave the recovery room until the nerve block fully loses effect. This took at least a couple of hours. You're asked to wiggle your toes, push a pedal, "can you feel anything" while they touch your feet. Initially the answer is no. You know something is down there, but nothing happens. Then gradually, you begin to regain motion and feeling in your legs and feet.

You have pain management options post-anesthesia, from Tylenol to opioids. I opted very light on opioids but was warned I would need some before morning to manage the pain. You also get inflating cuffs put on your tibias that inflate/deflate every several seconds as additional help against blood clots. You can finally have water and eat!! I suggest asking for food because in a busy recovery room, they tend to forget - I ate very late. You start with Jell-O and work up to a sandwich, or at least that's what I wanted. You're given whatever meds you use for sleep but in lower doses, given the fact that you have anesthesia in your system and opioids. Once the nerve block is gone and they deem you ready to leave recovery, you're wheeled off to a private room, which is where I am currently.

After the operation, your belongings follow you. They bring you a little sanitation kit with toothbrush/toothpaste, etc. I asked about showering and they prefer you do not shower until you leave the hospital. Strong emphasis on prefer. You pee in a urinal container designed to collect in bed. Wasn't really a problem. They insist you do this before you go up to your room, and when I said I don't know if I can, they ultra-sounded my bladder and showed me it was nearly full.

Sleep: You're not going to sleep the first night. If you do, consider yourself beyond lucky. I'm in a state of zombie like tiredness, and I'm obviously blogging at 4:51 AM and not sleeping. The PA said it's very common on the first night and just sleep when you can. This is the part that sucks the most.

Thus far: the professionalism, demeanor and overall logistics/cleanliness/safety of HSS and the folks that work here has been outstanding. Everyone is incredibly nice. At this point I have no reason to believe that Dr. Rozbruch did anything other than an excellent job, as one would expect. My legs feel like they weigh a ton each but seem otherwise fine for post-op conditions. They're heavily bandaged, so I can't see the incisions yet.

People check in on you constantly. If you push the red "I need help" button, you get someone fairly fast. The only thing that's been slow has been the PA with the meds. At this point I expect to just pass out when my body finally collapses, so not really worried about it.

I had no anxiety up to the surgery, not even the night before. I had a TON of anxiety in the hospital. It becomes real very quickly. At this point, I am VERY VERY glad I did this. Even coming out of the OR, I feel like a giant stone that's been there for decades has been lifted off my mind, and I'm only starting. I also feel great about my decision regarding Dr. Rozbruch and HSS.

If I couldn't afford either Dr. Rozbruch or Dr. Paley, I would have worked a side gig, Uber, DoorDash, anything, and saved until I could. For those that would say they can't, I met a handicapped Uber driver a year ago who has a government job and drives for Uber in the evenings so he can pay off the 3 bedroom house he and his family live in. Interestingly what convinced me to only do this with these two surgeons were the horror stories on this forum. I wanted to/still want to avoid being a statistic at all possible costs.

(Gentle note: above on surgeon/cost choice is my opinion obviously. Everyone will make the choice that fits them best. I won't engage in debate about this, I just wish everyone luck no matter what, and do your best to avoid known surgeons/facilities with risk)

I'll do my best to write comprehensively so these posts are hopefully useful and productive to those considering the surgery. I don't know how much time I'll have to answer questions, but I'll do my best. Physical Therapy apparently starts making rounds in 3 hours or. God I hope I get some sleep before then.
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Starting height: 5'10"ish (179cm).   Desired height: 6'1.5" (187cm).   Achieved on 5/31/23: 6'1.5" (187.3 cm).

Disclaimer: I am not a doctor. Nothing I post is intended to be or interpreted as medical advice. I am posting about my CLL experience for informational purposes only

EndGame

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Re: Precise 2.2 CLL (femurs) with Dr. Rozbruch - February 2023
« Reply #11 on: February 07, 2023, 08:03:43 PM »

Very detailed posts. Appreciate your diary. Good luck with everything.
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hippo60

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Re: Precise 2.2 CLL (femurs) with Dr. Rozbruch - February 2023
« Reply #12 on: February 08, 2023, 12:21:31 AM »

Great start to your diary, hopefully you can keep it up :)
I'm also a Rozbruch patient, feel free to reach out if you have any questions about what lies ahead or anything else ;)
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uponly

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Re: Precise 2.2 CLL (femurs) with Dr. Rozbruch - February 2023
« Reply #13 on: February 08, 2023, 02:04:47 AM »

Man it's not gonna be easy :). Thanks a lot for your support, as well as everyone else!
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Starting height: 5'10"ish (179cm).   Desired height: 6'1.5" (187cm).   Achieved on 5/31/23: 6'1.5" (187.3 cm).

Disclaimer: I am not a doctor. Nothing I post is intended to be or interpreted as medical advice. I am posting about my CLL experience for informational purposes only

uponly

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Re: Precise 2.2 CLL (femurs) with Dr. Rozbruch - February 2023
« Reply #14 on: February 08, 2023, 01:23:21 PM »

Day One, in hospital

Pain level: 5/10 - 10/10


At about 7:30 AM, you start getting a throng of visitors. One of Dr. Rozbruch's fellows, acute pain MD, the MD that cleared me came to check in - everything from doctors to housekeeping to the TV people (seriously). Everyone is super attentive, but all I wanted to do was sleep.

The acute pain doctor said one thing that bears repeating. When the nerve block comes off, the pain block is the last to go, and you'll know it when that happens. It's absolutely true. I didn't take enough Oxy because I didn't feel like I needed it. BIG mistake. When the nerve block wears off, it's like jumping off (or up??) a cliff in terms of pain.

A lot of people, myself included, wonder how painful this gets. It's the most painful thing I've ever been through, flat out. You will hurt, badly, and it's part of the process. I could have done better if I managed to prevent, and had to catch up all day. The slightest movement will send pain through your body that is so intense you'll feel like passing out. I now chuckle at the folks that wonder how soon they can walk and weight bear, because one day in, I can't even move my legs without feeling like I've entered a VIP room in hell.

PT came in to assess. I clearly failed, I could not get off the side of the bed because I was screaming in pain. Again, this is on me, and results should be different today. The higher Oxy doses and muscle relaxer are controlling the pain nicely right now.

Dr. Rozbruch came in to visit and lit into me a little for not managing the pain. PT also left this device that just moves your leg up and down, that I did for two hours each leg yesterday. That wasn't enough and he wants me to do more. I started early this morning, it's actually great for mobility since I can't lift my leg up on my own yet.

Nuvasive rep is going to come teach me how to use the distraction machine today. I think I lengthen a little in the process but don't know how much, certainly nothing significant. That starts next week.

If all goes well, looking at discharge tomorrow. Finally slept last night - my body just gave out. Once I leave the hospital I think I'll sleep for a week.
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Starting height: 5'10"ish (179cm).   Desired height: 6'1.5" (187cm).   Achieved on 5/31/23: 6'1.5" (187.3 cm).

Disclaimer: I am not a doctor. Nothing I post is intended to be or interpreted as medical advice. I am posting about my CLL experience for informational purposes only

hippo60

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Re: Precise 2.2 CLL (femurs) with Dr. Rozbruch - February 2023
« Reply #15 on: February 08, 2023, 03:19:49 PM »

Oh man, don't try to be a hero! You have to remember your body went through a very very very traumatic experience and it'll take weeks to subside. Personally I stopped oxy and some of the other pain meds after 5-6 days but you should do it gradually and don't rush it. Remember that not being in pain will help you move more which is important for your recovery.

Don't worry about that first PT visit. I was barely able to stand, did 2 steps to the chair and back to bed. It was so tough, I puked and almost fainted :D

The next day was already much better. It was still tough but way more manageable, so hang in there. Also that device that moves your leg is great, I really liked it! It's nice to have your legs moving and was kinda fun, felt like a mini PT session (that lasts for a while). I tried to use it for a few hours on each leg.

If you want to sleep well definitely stay on your meds or you'll wake up in the pain throughout the night  ;)
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uponly

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Re: Precise 2.2 CLL (femurs) with Dr. Rozbruch - February 2023
« Reply #16 on: February 09, 2023, 01:25:54 PM »

Day two, in hospital

Pain level: 4/10


Switched meds and it's night/day difference. Was able to get off the bed and "walk" a few steps to the high chair. Just getting out of bed seemed like a massive accomplishment.

Another thing I've seen that really hasn't been addressed: "What exercises do you need to do prior to LL?". Dips. Lots and lots of dips. Totally serious. You will have to post up and scoot A LOT. Make sure your upper body is prepared. Also pull-ups. I'm lucky because I'm active and do both as part of my workout routine. I would legit be screwed otherwise, especially if I could not be able to use my arms and chest to support my bodyweight.

The new meds gave me the undesired effect of not being able to pee, so they used a catheter. Slept as well as you can sleep in a hospital that checks on you this regularly. Learned to use the traction device - it's super easy and I didn't feel a thing. You have to break up the distractions into 4 per day, and if you miss one you have to let Dr. Rozbruch know. Yesterday was .2 mm on each side, but only to learn. I start distracting in earnest next week.

Waiting for PT to arrive - hopefully I clear today and get to leave. I feel much more optimistic given my new meds. I went from "I can't even twitch a single muscle" to moving around the bed and getting to the side of the bed completely unassisted last night, and I can pick up my legs this morning, so I should be OK.
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Starting height: 5'10"ish (179cm).   Desired height: 6'1.5" (187cm).   Achieved on 5/31/23: 6'1.5" (187.3 cm).

Disclaimer: I am not a doctor. Nothing I post is intended to be or interpreted as medical advice. I am posting about my CLL experience for informational purposes only

stretched

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Re: Precise 2.2 CLL (femurs) with Dr. Rozbruch - February 2023
« Reply #17 on: February 09, 2023, 02:10:40 PM »

One step at a time, glad you're feeling better.
What pain meds are you using now, and which meds were you using beforehand? Do you think your first day would have been significantly better had you taken the meds you are now?

Best
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Goal: 161cm -> 170cm Quad Lengthening ~2026

uponly

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Re: Precise 2.2 CLL (femurs) with Dr. Rozbruch - February 2023
« Reply #18 on: February 10, 2023, 04:06:35 AM »

One step at a time, glad you're feeling better.
What pain meds are you using now, and which meds were you using beforehand? Do you think your first day would have been significantly better had you taken the meds you are now?

Really appreciate that, thank you!!

I took Oxycodone, 10 mg, a muscle relaxer and Tylenol. I switched from Oxycodone to Dilaudid, 2 mg, with up to 4 mg as needed.

Short of anesthesia, nothing was going to make the first day post-op better. Everyone warned me the first day after surgery was going to be horrible, from the acute pain MD to the physical therapist. When the pain part of the nerve block comes off, it's literally like flipping a switch, but in a really bad way. You have to just grit through it.

This is a really painful surgery, and hippo60 said it best:

"You have to remember your body went through a very very very traumatic experience and it'll take weeks to subside."

This is very true, and matches accounts of patients I have spoken to prior to the surgery, as well as youtube video from Cyborg4Life where he took several polls on how bad the pain is and how it de-volves over time, under normal conditions. It just sucks and all I can do is follow Dr. Rozbruch's instructions to the letter to see my way out of the pain as quickly as possible.
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Starting height: 5'10"ish (179cm).   Desired height: 6'1.5" (187cm).   Achieved on 5/31/23: 6'1.5" (187.3 cm).

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uponly

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Re: Precise 2.2 CLL (femurs) with Dr. Rozbruch - February 2023
« Reply #19 on: February 10, 2023, 04:27:00 AM »

Day three, discharged from the hospital in the evening

Pain level: 4/10


The Dilaudid is definitely more potent that the Oxy, but the side effects are very noticeable, especially at 4 MG. I'm doing my best to take 2 MG and space out more and more. Independent pain management is a big deal of getting through this without an opioid addiction, which I'm certainly not going to have.

Today was all about clearing to leave. PT clears you first, then medical. I went through PT just fine, even with compliments. Medical was totally fine.

I did 3 hours each leg on the CPM machine (for those wondering, it's like this guy:

https://www.healthproductsforyou.com/p-kinetec-spectra-essential-knee-cpm-machine.html

But better padded/nicer. I seriously wish I had one.

Swelling: my legs are about 2x the size of normal

Movement: gets better every day, even with low doses of the Dilaudid. It is simply tiring to move because my legs feel like they have concrete blocks attached to them. I turned on my stomach (which is what Dr. Rozbruch and his fellow wanted), stood up on my own (and by that I mean posted up on the walker, took a few steps, etc., sat in the wheelchair). That's really all you can do and what's expected at this point.

What helps: getting your quads to fire again. Nothing more important. I'm doing air leg raises off the side of the bed, and an exercise where you lie flat on your back and drive the back of your knee into the mattress, and hold it for several seconds. The latter I got from PT staff, I can do 10 reps every hour.

What really helps: having functional hip flexors. This is a problem. After lying on my back for most of my stay, my hip flexors are dead and they HURT THE MOST, especially when I try to turn. The only thing I can do is do a few stretches, including when I'm on my stomach. But I'm taking my instructions seriously and came into the surgery in really good shape, which is helping.

The hospital staff was super nice and incredibly competent. No complaints other than the bed was pretty uncomfortable, but we made it work with a ton of pillows and a pillow that molds to you, which I took with me :). That lived under my butt since late day one, and I would have been in really bad shape without this.

Crashing for about 24 hours :).

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Starting height: 5'10"ish (179cm).   Desired height: 6'1.5" (187cm).   Achieved on 5/31/23: 6'1.5" (187.3 cm).

Disclaimer: I am not a doctor. Nothing I post is intended to be or interpreted as medical advice. I am posting about my CLL experience for informational purposes only

uponly

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Re: Precise 2.2 CLL (femurs) with Dr. Rozbruch - February 2023
« Reply #20 on: February 10, 2023, 06:10:25 PM »

Day 4, recovering in NYC hotel

Pain level: 4-5/10


I finally got sleep. It was broken up into 3 hour chunks due to bathroom trips (which are excruciating), but I no longer feel like a zombie. The hospital gave me tons of laxatives and, well... you get the rest. It felt absolutely amazing to get out of the hospital, however.

The pain is enormous, specifically in my quads and hip flexors. I'm convinced that whoever says that this procedure/recovery were not painful, at least in the initial stages, is flat out lying. I'm doing my best to manage with 2mg Dilaudid and 750 mg Methocarbamol every 8 hours, and 1000 MG of Tylenol 3x/day. I would take the opioids more frequently but they make me super loopy. The muscle relaxers I can only take 3x/day. Leg swelling has gone down a bit, not much. No bleeding around sutures.

I'm going to rest for a while and do my PT this afternoon. An hour seemed like light work before the surgery, now it feels like a Herculean task.
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Starting height: 5'10"ish (179cm).   Desired height: 6'1.5" (187cm).   Achieved on 5/31/23: 6'1.5" (187.3 cm).

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SpeedDialer

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Re: Precise 2.2 CLL (femurs) with Dr. Rozbruch - February 2023
« Reply #21 on: February 10, 2023, 09:35:31 PM »

Day 4, recovering in NYC hotel

The pain is enormous, specifically in my quads and hip flexors. I'm convinced that whoever says that this procedure/recovery were not painful, at least in the initial stages, is flat out lying.

100% Agreed
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uponly

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Re: Precise 2.2 CLL (femurs) with Dr. Rozbruch - February 2023
« Reply #22 on: February 12, 2023, 09:24:42 PM »

Day 5, hotel and travel home

Pain level: 6/10


Misery index: complete 10/10

There's so much to say after today. While not the most painful day, certainly the worst overall.

I actually woke up pain free, ate a decent breakfast and with my friend's help, started to pack and get ready to travel back home. After we left the hotel, everything went wrong.

We got a wheelchair accessible vehicle to take us to the airport. The drive was about 80 minutes through New York city traffic and potholes. I was in significant pain when we arrived at the airport. At the United desk, the attendant didn't want to help us - she kept pointing to the machine while texting (this was the First Class desk). The porter who was helping with our luggage actually yelled at her. At TSA precheck, which I have and my friend did not, they first let us through, then separated us at the last minute, because the TSA gate agent wanted to exercise his God-like TSA powers. They had plenty of staff, but no one bothered to help me. A passenger behind me took it upon himself to both help me and yell at the staff, while other passengers raised their voice as well and commented on how messed up that was. I finally went through, got my carry-on, and wheeled myself all the way to the gate, since I couldn't find my friend.

All I can say is that New Yorkers are massive d*cks in general. They do not give a sh*t if you're handicapped. Both handicapped bathroom stalls were taken by non-handicapped people (more on bathrooms later). While wheeling myself through the airport, not a single person offered to help. Several people on their phones almost walked into me (one did) because they expected the person in the wheelchair to get out of the way. I finally made it to the gate, and my friend did about 20 minutes later as he went through regular screening.

While getting on the plane: I was first through line as I both needed additional assistance, and was flying back in first class (1A and 1B). Here's where things get both interesting as well as educational. Your own wheelchair does not fit on the airplane. It's more than twice as wide as the aisle. So the airline is supposed to have an attendant waiting there to transfer you to one of their tiny wheelchairs and get you on the plane. The attendant was nowhere to be found. I waited for 35 minutes, in absolute humiliation, on the side of the door, as everyone looked down at me, and the flight attendants were desperate to find out where this person was. The pilot himself went to the front desk. The entire flight boarded. I was still waiting. Finally, someone came and with a lackadaisical attitude, put me in the tiny wheelchair and moved me 5-7 feet through the plane to my first class seat.

The airplane staff was absolutely mortified. I was livid. The gate agent came over to tell me it was my own fault for having my own wheelchair, at which point the captain lost it and told her "we have a playbook for this and it should have never happened". She shrugged and looked at me and said I'm sorry and asked if I needed anything. I told her I needed her to leave.

The airplane staff was super nice to me. By the time I landed, they had someone waiting, and my wheelchair was also waiting while they opened the door. They had also issued a refund for my flight. I didn't ask. In the airport where I live (also a big city), people left and right were asking if they could help us, and several airport staff went above and beyond to help us secure a wheelchair accessible taxi, which were mostly unavailable that evening for some reason.

On going to the bathroom on the plane: there's a youtube video in cyborg4life's channel where he apparently got feedback from 3 post CLL surgery patients, and at least one went to the bathroom, but said it was very difficult. I don't think cyborg4life lied. But I think whoever gave him that feedback wasn't being truthful. I would not have attempted to go to the bathroom unless my life depended on it, and I was in Row 1, literally steps away. I didn't have a walker, and if I did I couldn't use it. It's wider than the aisle. You're not walking on your own, even on weight-bearing nails, immediately after the surgery. During the recovery period, you're exhausted from 3-5 steps. There is no feasible way I see someone walking to a bathroom, standing for the line to clear, etc., from the middle of the plane, on a plane that may suddenly start shaking, etc.  I brought a male plastic urinal onboard and was prepared to use it under dire circumstances, but had gone to the bathroom before and ended up being OK.

I got to my place fully exhausted and in a lot of pain. All the movement takes an immense toll on your legs. I had a massive fever from the exertion (102.7) and broke into a sweat that drenched the bed. I didn't sleep well - I was in pain pretty much the entire night, and taking a day to rest.

Things worth noting:

- The male urinal plastic thing, hand sanitizer, body/butt wipes and the reaching/grabbing device are some of the most useful things you can have. They will make the difference between endurable pain and sheer misery.

- Bathrooms on a plane. Not possible. In my experience, I don't know how someone in their first week of CLL would be capable of this feat

- Stories of people doing elliptical for 20 minutes, walking, whatever immediately after surgery: these are either fabrications or the people doing these thing have super powers the rest of us do not. Whatever nail you have, your legs are FULLY BROKEN. In speaking to my personal Dr., he explained the pain and swelling phenomenon to me. Your body has no idea of what happened to you - it doesn't know that this was an elective procedure or that you just came out of a car crash, or that you have full bearing or partial bearing nails. It knows it is under major trauma and will rush platelets, red blood cells, etc. to the site to repair.  This is why you have the bruising and swelling, as well as the pain. They are indicators for you to rest and leave the traumatized site the hell alone. The legs will feel the same for a while. Heavy, hurting, tired, and the smallest movements will leave you dizzy and in pain.

I wish the people writing these diaries would have been a bit more forthcoming about the degree of pain and effort this involves, and how much it really takes out of you, especially during the first 1-3 weeks (which I hear are the worst). I am certainly of the personal opinion that doctors that make their patients walk immediately post-operatively or during the first few days extensively are absolutely medically irresponsible. Dr. Rozbruch and the hospital staff drew very strict lines around what was expected of me, and how much movement they wanted in the beginning stages. I overdid it yesterday, through sheer circumstance and with travel movement, and paid a massive price.

- how handicapped people are treated. Yesterday put people on crutches, in walkers, in wheelchairs etc. in a completely different perspective for me. I tried to be courteous, but I have to admit I've used the handicapped bathroom before, and being inpatient waiting in line behind a person in a wheelchair. Having now been fully on the other side, I think I'm an a**hole  for having done those things. We're hopefully in this situation temporarily, but many are not. We don't do enough to make their lives easier, and that's incredibly sad.
« Last Edit: February 12, 2023, 09:54:09 PM by uponly »
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Starting height: 5'10"ish (179cm).   Desired height: 6'1.5" (187cm).   Achieved on 5/31/23: 6'1.5" (187.3 cm).

Disclaimer: I am not a doctor. Nothing I post is intended to be or interpreted as medical advice. I am posting about my CLL experience for informational purposes only

stretched

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Re: Precise 2.2 CLL (femurs) with Dr. Rozbruch - February 2023
« Reply #23 on: February 12, 2023, 09:55:18 PM »

The first 1-2 weeks are the worst for everyone using the precise nail.
After the 2nd week, there is a massive drop off in terms of pain / discomfort. After that it's mainly about being on top of your PT.

No matter how bad of a day you may have, you never have to live that fking day again.
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uponly

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Re: Precise 2.2 CLL (femurs) with Dr. Rozbruch - February 2023
« Reply #24 on: February 13, 2023, 02:51:29 AM »

Day 6, Home

Pain level: 4-5/10


The first 1-2 weeks are the worst for everyone using the precise nail.
After the 2nd week, there is a massive drop off in terms of pain / discomfort. After that it's mainly about being on top of your PT.

No matter how bad of a day you may have, you never have to live that fking day again.

Appreciate your support and I hope you're right. That was awful on a completely different level.

*****

I woke up with no fever but in a lot of pain. I had pain in parts of the body where there had been no pain previously (lower left back). Chalking this up to the plane ride. No fever. I took my morning supplements and meds and went back to sleep for a bit.

I spent the day mostly recovering from yesterday. The entire lower half of my body feels like it went through a very aggressive wash cycle. I set up some things in my place that I hadn't for ease of access, etc., and made sure to eat well. My focus was spent on pain management. Today is the first day I took 4 MG of Dilaudid in one dose since the hospital. I got the pain under control about 30 minutes ago.

I noticed the pain is much worse in my non-dominant leg, which is also much weaker than my dominant leg. Something to work on as I rebuild. First solid bowel movement all week - huge win as far as I'm concerned. I'm urinating a lot - I bought several more male urinal bottles so I can either rotate/clean or throw them away and replace. Swelling has not gone down much, and my Dr. thinks it will be like this for another 1-2 weeks. The uncontrolled tremors seem to be gone.

I also spent time reviewing the surgery notes, which were posted in my HSS portal today. Dr. Rozbruch had said that there were no surprises in the OR once the operation began. My bones were very healthy, and everything was completely routine. The notes reflect the same thing, and I hope that's prognosis for a speedy recovery.

The real work begins tomorrow, at 8 AM, with the first distraction. I am supposed to distract each leg 4x/day. 8 AM, 12 PM, 4 PM, 8 AM. If I miss a session after midnight I am not supposed to make up for it, I am supposed to inform Dr. Rozbruch immediately. I blocked off 1 hour in the day for PT as well. One of the nurses in the hospital said the entire key to success with this procedure is consistency and patience. Once you start distraction, everything has to be done on the same exact schedule at the same exact time every day, very strict and disciplined routine. I'm going to start sleeping early in the hopes of getting 10-12 hours a day of sleep, and we'll see how everything goes.
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Starting height: 5'10"ish (179cm).   Desired height: 6'1.5" (187cm).   Achieved on 5/31/23: 6'1.5" (187.3 cm).

Disclaimer: I am not a doctor. Nothing I post is intended to be or interpreted as medical advice. I am posting about my CLL experience for informational purposes only

uponly

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Re: Precise 2.2 CLL (femurs) with Dr. Rozbruch - February 2023
« Reply #25 on: February 13, 2023, 03:00:23 AM »

I did notice something else. I measured my weight, unassisted (I am partial weight bearing) and I went UP in weight by about 11 lbs last week.

Given the amount of time I've been sedentary, this wouldn't be a surprise. However, I haven't really eaten much, and my body has been purging constantly for over 3 days. Does anyone here know how much the 12.5 mm Precice nails and accompanying screws/rods weigh? It may not be the entire 11 lbs for both, but it's certainly a non-zero number.

I tried searching online using multiple search parameters and came up empty. Planning to email and ask Dr. Rozbruch tomorrow.
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Starting height: 5'10"ish (179cm).   Desired height: 6'1.5" (187cm).   Achieved on 5/31/23: 6'1.5" (187.3 cm).

Disclaimer: I am not a doctor. Nothing I post is intended to be or interpreted as medical advice. I am posting about my CLL experience for informational purposes only

uponly

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Re: Precise 2.2 CLL (femurs) with Dr. Rozbruch - February 2023
« Reply #26 on: February 15, 2023, 12:27:47 AM »

Days 7-8, Home (Distraction started Day 7, .8 mm/day)

Pain level: 2-7/10


Yesterday was an amazing day comparatively. I slept a healthy 11 hours the day before, with only bathroom interruptions and night sweats (more on this in a bit). But I woke up with almost no pain in my legs. I distracted for the first time in the morning, on schedule, then 3 more times subsequently throughout the day. I spent the day working, relaxing, and opening tons of Amazon boxes with deliveries like the giant toilet seat with handles, shower seat with handles (returning the first one I bought) etc. I've started to really appreciate support handles everywhere I can find them.

I hung out on my balcony watching the water and the sun, watched TV, ate normal food. Appetite was fine. I had an appointment with my primary care doc, who answered a ton of questions that are really designed for post-operative care and better answered by your PC doctor. He recommended Turmeric as an additional option for inflammation, said that the weight gain was probably from the 3 liters or so of IV fluid during OR and being on an IV for some time, and that the swelling in my legs will last for another 10 days or so (f*ck). He was VERY surprised that I was allowed to travel that soon. I think I'm the first patient in his practice that has done this, but he's a world class doc himself and has taken care of me for 18 years - his opinion was a week's hospital stay at least. Alas, here we are. He said that the frequent urination was me still expelling liquid as the swelling gradually decreases and I can expect that to maintain for a bit as well (great).

He recommended hyperbaric chamber treatment as a healing accelerator, as well as short stints in an infrared sauna. I have access to the latter, looking at places near me for the former.

I did one hour of PT, and did it late. This was a severe mistake. My legs shot up in pain immediately afterwards, and had difficulty falling asleep.

During the night, I had drenching night sweats to a degree I've never experienced. The entire bed was fully soaked. I woke up miserable and in pain, to the point where I canceled my day and went to sleep. I emailed Dr. Rozbruch and he said it's most likely reaction from surgery or anesthesia and should pass.

Other than meeting my girlfriend for Valentine's Day dinner, nothing else planned. One more distraction left in the evening. I have split up PT in half and will not do PT after 3 PM anymore - lesson learned.

So, it seems as if I'm transitioning from a week of pain to a week of constant misery. I "lost" 6 of the 10 lbs gained, probably expelling fluid. I learned that sleep in large amounts is your #1 BFF during this process. Nothing has made a difference like a good night's sleep. I still haven't found out how much the Precice nails weigh.

Help wanted from you good folks that have gone through this:

- What has helped you with reducing swelling and inflammation, aside from prescribed meds?
- Can you massage areas that are in pain (not incision sites, but quads, etc?)
- If yes, do you use a massage gun, and if so, which one is the best one to buy?
- Are topical creams like IcyHot etc. useful?
- Any other tips to minimize swelling/bruising/inflammation/pain?

Thanks in advance
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Starting height: 5'10"ish (179cm).   Desired height: 6'1.5" (187cm).   Achieved on 5/31/23: 6'1.5" (187.3 cm).

Disclaimer: I am not a doctor. Nothing I post is intended to be or interpreted as medical advice. I am posting about my CLL experience for informational purposes only

hippo60

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Re: Precise 2.2 CLL (femurs) with Dr. Rozbruch - February 2023
« Reply #27 on: February 17, 2023, 03:00:11 PM »

I've been a bit hesitant replying since you pretty much ignored my previous message (don't like wasting my time ::)), but you seem like a good guy so I'm giving this another shot ;). I'll try to go over some of the things you mentioned -

Swelling and inflammation - did you try cold packs? It should help with that, along with the meds of course. I think it's going to get much better over the next week or two so I wouldn't worry about it too much but definitely try cold packs if you haven't.

Haven't tried any topical creams, you want to use it for the pain or anything else? I think the pain meds you're taking (assuming you're taking everything you were given) should be enough, and if not you can ask Rozbruch for something else. I'll be very surprised if a cream is going to do a better job than the pain meds but let us know if you tried.

You can massage your muscles, your PT might do that as well. Obviously need to be careful. I asked Rozbruch about massage gun and foam rollers and he said they're both fine. My PT (who has worked with many LL patients) said he was told even at the lowest setting the massage gun was painful to use, so I was holding off buying one. Funnily enough, I decided to order one and it should arrive today. I ended up buying the Theragun PRO 4th gen, which is probably the best on the market. You can buy the 5th gen for additional $170 but you don't really get much value in return.

I was also very surprised you were cleared to fly so early, I thought there is a risk for blood clout but I'm glad you're ok. Doctors typically ask patients to wait a couple of weeks before flying back, I guess because of the risk and that it's going to be a very painful experience beforehand. Anyhow, this is behind you :)

What's your PT situation? Do you have a local place/guy? I might have some tips I can share privately. Anyhow, you definitely want to do PT after 3pm, the more you do the better. Keep in mind your body is going to change significantly over this period, meaning even if you did something and it resulted in pain, it might be completely fine a few days / week later, so keep that in mind. Are you also making sure to move around throughout the day or do you mostly stay in bed / wheelchair?

I remember the days of waking up soaking wet, that wasn't fun :). Fortunately I wasn't in pain but definitely wet. I assumed it's my body healing from the surgery. I don't remember exactly when it ended but I think sometime in the first few weeks, it didn't last that long.

Stay strong ✊
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uponly

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Re: Precise 2.2 CLL (femurs) with Dr. Rozbruch - February 2023
« Reply #28 on: February 17, 2023, 06:28:27 PM »

I've been a bit hesitant replying since you pretty much ignored my previous message (don't like wasting my time ::)), but you seem like a good guy so I'm giving this another shot ;). I'll try to go over some of the things you mentioned -

Brother my apologies and I assure you it was 100% unintentional. I think I quoted you in a response. Thanks for the grace, heaven knows last week my brain was just as fried as my body.

I REALLY appreciate the detailed response. I'll PM you!! I hope you're healing well!
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Starting height: 5'10"ish (179cm).   Desired height: 6'1.5" (187cm).   Achieved on 5/31/23: 6'1.5" (187.3 cm).

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uponly

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Re: Precise 2.2 CLL (femurs) with Dr. Rozbruch - February 2023
« Reply #29 on: February 17, 2023, 06:56:50 PM »

Quote
Swelling and inflammation - did you try cold packs? It should help with that, along with the meds of course. I think it's going to get much better over the next week or two so I wouldn't worry about it too much but definitely try cold packs if you haven't.

I tried cold packs, and they did help. You are right about the inflammation going down. It's night and day different this week.

Quote
Haven't tried any topical creams, you want to use it for the pain or anything else? I think the pain meds you're taking (assuming you're taking everything you were given) should be enough, and if not you can ask Rozbruch for something else. I'll be very surprised if a cream is going to do a better job than the pain meds but let us know if you tried.

I tried IcyHot and Biofreeze for pain. I can tell you that IcyHot works wonders for temporary pain relief. Biofreeze didn't do much. I'm trying to not be dependent on opioids and muscle relaxers, though my primary care doc yelled at me about that this morning. He told me to take whatever I need to be comfortable for as long as I need it. I took a muscle relaxer today

Quote
You can massage your muscles, your PT might do that as well. Obviously need to be careful. I asked Rozbruch about massage gun and foam rollers and he said they're both fine. My PT (who has worked with many LL patients) said he was told even at the lowest setting the massage gun was painful to use, so I was holding off buying one. Funnily enough, I decided to order one and it should arrive today. I ended up buying the Theragun PRO 4th gen, which is probably the best on the market. You can buy the 5th gen for additional $170 but you don't really get much value in return.

Amazing, I literally just order it. Thank you!!

Quote
I was also very surprised you were cleared to fly so early, I thought there is a risk for blood clout but I'm glad you're ok. Doctors typically ask patients to wait a couple of weeks before flying back, I guess because of the risk and that it's going to be a very painful experience beforehand. Anyhow, this is behind you :)

Can't think of a worse day in my entire life.

I stayed in the hospital a night longer than you, but that's only because I couldn't pee lol. I talked about this with Dr. Rozbruch, and given my labs and overall health, he wasn't concerned. I honestly love his philosophy of "go recover where you'll thrive". He did say it would be painful, and my God he wasn't wrong.

Quote
What's your PT situation? Do you have a local place/guy? I might have some tips I can share privately. Anyhow, you definitely want to do PT after 3pm, the more you do the better. Keep in mind your body is going to change significantly over this period, meaning even if you did something and it resulted in pain, it might be completely fine a few days / week later, so keep that in mind. Are you also making sure to move around throughout the day or do you mostly stay in bed / wheelchair?

Any/all PT tips are welcome. In chatting with Erica initially, she told me that Dr. Rozbruch needs to clear my PT person to ensure they strictly adhere to his PT protocol and don't injure me. I was going to engage a PT clinic - there are many excellent ones here - but haven't yet because of this.

I can't do PT in the afternoon. If I do I can't sleep at night. So I do it in the morning and early afternoon. 2 sessions, one hour total. The exercises from the recovery manual. I also stretch. A LOT. This is helping the most. I had LOTS of ROM, could basically do the splits before the surgery. I'd like to get back there again.

Interestingly my primary care doc told me to look into hydrotherapy also. Erica just cleared me for this as long as it's non weight bearing. There's a great place near me, they have a treadmill inn the pool and film it all underwater and this is supposed to massively help with gait. As soon as I get the stitches removed I'm doing that.

Quote
I remember the days of waking up soaking wet, that wasn't fun :). Fortunately I wasn't in pain but definitely wet. I assumed it's my body healing from the surgery. I don't remember exactly when it ended but I think sometime in the first few weeks, it didn't last that long.

My night sweats have mostly subsided. Thank God. My primary care doc told me it's my body's response to fighting the inflammation at night.

Quote
Stay strong ✊

You too brother. We're both going to make it!!
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Starting height: 5'10"ish (179cm).   Desired height: 6'1.5" (187cm).   Achieved on 5/31/23: 6'1.5" (187.3 cm).

Disclaimer: I am not a doctor. Nothing I post is intended to be or interpreted as medical advice. I am posting about my CLL experience for informational purposes only

hippo60

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Re: Precise 2.2 CLL (femurs) with Dr. Rozbruch - February 2023
« Reply #30 on: February 17, 2023, 09:11:38 PM »

I tried IcyHot and Biofreeze for pain. I can tell you that IcyHot works wonders for temporary pain relief. Biofreeze didn't do much. I'm trying to not be dependent on opioids and muscle relaxers, though my primary care doc yelled at me about that this morning. He told me to take whatever I need to be comfortable for as long as I need it. I took a muscle relaxer today

Yeah man I'm going to yell at you as well. I was also super anxious about getting carried away with the pain meds and oxy in particular. This surgery is freaking hard as it is, don't make it harder by refusing to take meds. I only stopped the pain killers earlier because I felt good, but you're in more pain (possibly because you took less so far) so you have to sort it out. There is no reason for you to be in pain. You have enough intelligence and self awareness to keep yourself in check. Also keep in mind these first weeks are the most painful, most likely you won't need the meds (maybe just Tylenol) afterwards.

Amazing, I literally just order it. Thank you!!
Haha was expecting you to do some research first but I have a feeling you'll reach a similar conclusion. One of the advantages of the pro is that it comes with the Supersoft attachment which is "ultra-gentle" and that's the only one I'm using. I figured the others will be painful, I'm not even trying. Also remember that I'm further along the process, you might need to wait a few weeks till you're done with the surgery pain. Obviously confirm with Rozbruch.

Can't think of a worse day in my entire life.

I stayed in the hospital a night longer than you, but that's only because I couldn't pee lol. I talked about this with Dr. Rozbruch, and given my labs and overall health, he wasn't concerned. I honestly love his philosophy of "go recover where you'll thrive". He did say it would be painful, and my God he wasn't wrong.

Yeah it sounds like pure misery, I'm lucky to be local so that part was much easier for me. I'm really surprised with his approach letting people go back so early. Are you coming back for some follow ups or just going to x-ray locally and send him?

I definitely get the "recover where you'll thrive" and you can easily tell from the diaries here how people are happy to finally get back home, but it's still interesting. It's like he's on one extreme end of the spectrum, with Paley being on the other ("forcing" you to stay there while lengthening). I actually wanted to ask Rozbruch about it, it's probably a matter of philosophy but also patient selection.

Any/all PT tips are welcome. In chatting with Erica initially, she told me that Dr. Rozbruch needs to clear my PT person to ensure they strictly adhere to his PT protocol and don't injure me. I was going to engage a PT clinic - there are many excellent ones here - but haven't yet because of this.

I can't do PT in the afternoon. If I do I can't sleep at night. So I do it in the morning and early afternoon. 2 sessions, one hour total. The exercises from the recovery manual. I also stretch. A LOT. This is helping the most. I had LOTS of ROM, could basically do the splits before the surgery. I'd like to get back there again.

Yeah I definitely don't want to do PT with someone not familiar with this surgery. Dr. Marie Gdalevitch shared in her interview with Viktor that her patient broke his nail during PT when he was doing something he shouldn't have done, so need to be really careful here. Just to make sure we're sync'ed here, what do you mean by PT? Because for me PT = stretching ::)

Interestingly my primary care doc told me to look into hydrotherapy also. Erica just cleared me for this as long as it's non weight bearing. There's a great place near me, they have a treadmill inn the pool and film it all underwater and this is supposed to massively help with gait. As soon as I get the stitches removed I'm doing that.
OMG I'd love to do hydrotherapy, but not sure there is a place nearby. I talked to my PT about it, and he mentioned the logistics issue of getting in and out of the pool. Check out this video  from Dr. Donghoon Lee, they have an actual lift for patients. Hopefully you find something that works.


My night sweats have mostly subsided. Thank God. My primary care doc told me it's my body's response to fighting the inflammation at night.
Makes sense!

You too brother. We're both going to make it!!
0.2mm at a time 🫡
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