Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Moonrise]

Hi Maxheight35
I will meet doctor Bets in 3 weeks and also I am considering LL for tibia. Very nice to hear your story man, I am following you on Instagram.

[maxheight35]

Great Progress man! BTW cool book on your desk exactly what you need, when lengthening.

Yes this book is amazing. Think & Grow Rich by Napoleon Hill. 1937 unedited edition

[maxheight35]

Hi Maxheight35
I will meet doctor Bets in 3 weeks and also I am considering LL for tibia. Very nice to hear your story man, I am following you on Instagram.

Nice! So far I’m happy with Tibia first. Thanks for the follow and have fun meeting Becker / Betz !

[Bagga]

can show how it was done?

[SpeedDialer]

What are Dr. Becker/Betz's thoughts on this strategy?

do 5-6 cm on tibias -> then if run into big problems with ballerina foot/range of motion, just focus on stretching/healing

then after you make a full recovery, rebreak one year later to grab 2-2.5 ish more cm?

I feel some people with not-great flexibility won't have the flexibility to get more than 5-6cm tibias in one shot, not sure though

On the other hand, Betz has said in the cyborg4life interview that in his experience he is able to achieve greater lengths than what people achieve with precise

I looked at the youtube cyborg4life interview with Betz and saw in the comments a BF complain that his GF went with Betz, did 8 cm in one go, and got non-union. And then I think medium drink of water the mod on this forum did 7.5cm ish on tibia in one shot (but it was externals so its different maybe) and wish he did less because of some issues it caused him later. I don't know what to make of comments like this, I don't know how to evaluate their accuracy, but they increase my fear/anxiety significantly because it feels like these problems might be hard to detect until its too late

If things go wrong with the betzbone from too much lengthening, is it possible / too expensive to have the rod removed, then shorten the tibias with a new inserted precise 2.2?

Or if I go with precise tibias to begin with and I run into problems from doing too much lengthening, can I rebreak my tibias later down the line and then shorten them with the same precise nail?

[tallmen]

So good to see you walk so early mate. This is a Big W.

[maxheight35]

I spent 3 years doing research and meetings doctors, learning about the different nails / devices and the strategies of the aftercare for each doctor and from my personal experience the Betz / Becker combo is the way to go.

I’m slowly starting to walk without crutches now and I didn’t think it would be possible so soon after this type of surgery!

What are Dr. Becker/Betz's thoughts on this strategy?

do 5-6 cm on tibias -> then if run into big problems with ballerina foot/range of motion, just focus on stretching/healing

then after you make a full recovery, rebreak one year later to grab 2-2.5 ish more cm?

I feel some people with not-great flexibility won't have the flexibility to get more than 5-6cm tibias in one shot, not sure though

On the other hand, Betz has said in the cyborg4life interview that in his experience he is able to achieve greater lengths than what people achieve with precise

I looked at the youtube cyborg4life interview with Betz and saw in the comments a BF complain that his GF went with Betz, did 8 cm in one go, and got non-union. And then I think medium drink of water the mod on this forum did 7.5cm ish on tibia in one shot (but it was externals so its different maybe) and wish he did less because of some issues it caused him later. I don't know what to make of comments like this, I don't know how to evaluate their accuracy, but they increase my fear/anxiety significantly because it feels like these problems might be hard to detect until its too late

If things go wrong with the betzbone from too much lengthening, is it possible / too expensive to have the rod removed, then shorten the tibias with a new inserted precise 2.2?

Or if I go with precise tibias to begin with and I run into problems from doing too much lengthening, can I rebreak my tibias later down the line and then shorten them with the same precise nail?

[Stand taller]

Sorry bro! Yeah Dr. Becker is a great guy and has been very supportive!

And yes I had the surgery in Frieburg at Praxisklinik 2000… I was so happy to leave that place! The nurses were OK but yeah the food absolutely sucked!!! I ordered takeout for every meal other than breakfast and I would have ordered breakfast if there was an option lol.

I heard about many stories with the duck ass with femurs. Actually think it comes down to the dedication you give on stretching everyday! I met this guy Nico here who did surgery as well about 4 months ago and he’s walking fine with no duck ass but man he puts in the work! Even when we are talking and eating he’s always stretching.

So far so good on the tibias. 10cm is definitely a game changer and I’ll be going for the max height possible with femurs. Hopefully another 12 there and then it’s game on baby!!!

Staying positive, active, and keeping my mind as busy as possible is key with this whole operation and situation. This hotel is amazing as well I can’t say it enough… I’m very happy and grateful for the level of service I’m being given from Dr. Becker and his team down to the hotel staff and physical therapy clinic staff as well!

Have you thought about doing tibias?

Yeah, I really like Dr. Becker, great dude!

Not a fan of that hospital, but as you said the nurses where nice. Got to practice my German a bit, but the FOOD SUCKED! I don't understand how they can serve you such   food when your body is in dire need of good nutrition after a surgery like that. Makes no sense to me! And also there is no ventilation in that hospital so I god bad head aches after a few hours with the window closed. After a week in Praxisklinikk 2000 I was very lucky to stay in the luxury flat underneath Dr. Beckers Clinic. It was a large (160 square meter) flat that I still have very fond memories of nine months later. Also ordered two - three meals a day from Liverando when I got to the flat.

For some duck ass seems to be inevitable, especially when going 7-8cm +. I didn't have any sign of it until 7cm +. I stretched as much as 2 hours a day not counting going to my physiotherapist three times a week for even more stretching. In my case I have done a much stretching and workout as my body has allowed, because it also needs rest. If I only did 7-cm I would be good a long time ago, but I did go 11,5cm and I am still not good. But things are improving and I am not far away from getting rid of my duck ass and walking normal.

How much will you do in total then, tibias + femurs?

I am 177cm tall now and have no plans on tibias or getting any taller. I am more than good at this height, and I still haven't been out at bars or clubs yet and tested my new height. With some nice shoes I am easily 180cm and that is just awesome, I don't need any more because I don't feel small anymore. Heck, I am basically average - so I am in fact not small anymore.

I can't wait to test my new height out at bars and clubs though. I have always had good confidence and a good ability to speak for myself. I've been a manager since I was 19, so while I was young and small I had to develop the ability for people to listen to me and take me seriously. I am not the best looking, but I have been described as a chad lite by many attractive girls throughout the years. I have also had quite a few attractive girlfriends who all where a little taller than me, so even when I was small I was quite confident. But even with at successful career, confidence, charm, good style and good looks being 165cm cm in a Nordic country put a limit on my success that I was never comfortable with. Especially knowing the fact that If I was the same me, only taller I most likely would have had much more success with women with less work. And now that I am a taller version of my self, I think I am good. No need for anymore height.

[SpeedDialer]

I spent 3 years doing research and meetings doctors, learning about the different nails / devices and the strategies of the aftercare for each doctor and from my personal experience the Betz / Becker combo is the way to go.

I’m slowly starting to walk without crutches now and I didn’t think it would be possible so soon after this type of surgery!

I think your diary is maybe the most important diary on the forum right now

Because we have alot of datapoints on this forum gnail femurs (weight bearing) with Giotikas that have been relatively successful. We have alot of datapoints about precise 2.2 (non-weight bearing) being successful but being potentially very long and unpleasant in terms of wheelchair time. Giotikas doesn't do weight bearing internal tibias at the moment-- unless someone counts situations where someone is low-ish weight and happens to fall below precise tibia's weight limit

We don't have as many datapoints on this forum about Betzbone 2.0 internal tibias, which seem to be the cheapest good weight bearing purely internal tibia method that doesn't have the corrosion problems of the older fitbone. I think Guichet and Betz are the only  weight bearing internal tibias options now, but Guichet is more expensive than Betz I think and its not really clear if Guichet is better than Betz

I guess things may change when the next generation of precise comes out, but that may be a while and I don't know how they will solve certain problems like the osteolysis (don't know the cause of it) for the next generation of precise if they want to attempt another weight bearing nail

A big draw of betz aside from his higher length limits is that he seems to let patients go to work much sooner compared to other doctors (which I think was a big reason Apotheosis went with Betz) and the weight bearing tibia nail helps.

I vaguely remember there may have been some kind of controversy with Apotheosis and Betz years ago (or maybe it was with Sarin, not sure), but I feel like we can put that behind us now, its been 10 years, all LL doctors improve over time I'm sure

[maxheight35]

My goal is 10cm on tibias and the full 12cm on femurs.

Total 22cm = about 9 inches

From 5,3” to 6,0” would be life changing!

Yeah, I really like Dr. Becker, great dude!

Not a fan of that hospital, but as you said the nurses where nice. Got to practice my German a bit, but the FOOD SUCKED! I don't understand how they can serve you such   food when your body is in dire need of good nutrition after a surgery like that. Makes no sense to me! And also there is no ventilation in that hospital so I god bad head aches after a few hours with the window closed. After a week in Praxisklinikk 2000 I was very lucky to stay in the luxury flat underneath Dr. Beckers Clinic. It was a large (160 square meter) flat that I still have very fond memories of nine months later. Also ordered two - three meals a day from Liverando when I got to the flat.

For some duck ass seems to be inevitable, especially when going 7-8cm +. I didn't have any sign of it until 7cm +. I stretched as much as 2 hours a day not counting going to my physiotherapist three times a week for even more stretching. In my case I have done a much stretching and workout as my body has allowed, because it also needs rest. If I only did 7-cm I would be good a long time ago, but I did go 11,5cm and I am still not good. But things are improving and I am not far away from getting rid of my duck ass and walking normal.

How much will you do in total then, tibias + femurs?

I am 177cm tall now and have no plans on tibias or getting any taller. I am more than good at this height, and I still haven't been out at bars or clubs yet and tested my new height. With some nice shoes I am easily 180cm and that is just awesome, I don't need any more because I don't feel small anymore. Heck, I am basically average - so I am in fact not small anymore.

I can't wait to test my new height out at bars and clubs though. I have always had good confidence and a good ability to speak for myself. I've been a manager since I was 19, so while I was young and small I had to develop the ability for people to listen to me and take me seriously. I am not the best looking, but I have been described as a chad lite by many attractive girls throughout the years. I have also had quite a few attractive girlfriends who all where a little taller than me, so even when I was small I was quite confident. But even with at successful career, confidence, charm, good style and good looks being 165cm cm in a Nordic country put a limit on my success that I was never comfortable with. Especially knowing the fact that If I was the same me, only taller I most likely would have had much more success with women with less work. And now that I am a taller version of my self, I think I am good. No need for anymore height.

[maxheight35]

Thanks man.

The Betz nail and Dr Becker combination is amazing, from my personal experience. I’m genuinely enjoying the lengthening process here at the hotel Dorint & therapy clinic.

I’ve hit the sauna quite a few times now, made some new LL friends as well as friends who work at the hotel. Also explored the city of Freiburg the other day with another patient. Very fun times!!!

I think your diary is maybe the most important diary on the forum right now

Because we have alot of datapoints on this forum gnail femurs (weight bearing) with Giotikas that have been relatively successful. We have alot of datapoints about precise 2.2 (non-weight bearing) being successful but being potentially very long and unpleasant in terms of wheelchair time. Giotikas doesn't do weight bearing internal tibias at the moment-- unless someone counts situations where someone is low-ish weight and happens to fall below precise tibia's weight limit

We don't have as many datapoints on this forum about Betzbone 2.0 internal tibias, which seem to be the cheapest good weight bearing purely internal tibia method that doesn't have the corrosion problems of the older fitbone. I think Guichet and Betz are the only  weight bearing internal tibias options now, but Guichet is more expensive than Betz I think and its not really clear if Guichet is better than Betz

I guess things may change when the next generation of precise comes out, but that may be a while and I don't know how they will solve certain problems like the osteolysis (don't know the cause of it) for the next generation of precise if they want to attempt another weight bearing nail

A big draw of betz aside from his higher length limits is that he seems to let patients go to work much sooner compared to other doctors (which I think was a big reason Apotheosis went with Betz) and the weight bearing tibia nail helps.

I vaguely remember there may have been some kind of controversy with Apotheosis and Betz years ago (or maybe it was with Sarin, not sure), but I feel like we can put that behind us now, its been 10 years, all LL doctors improve over time I'm sure

[lessthanavg8300]

Looks like you're making the most of things from what I see on IG.  Thats awesome.  LL is time in your life, you should enjoy it as much as you can like you are.  How long do you think youll stay there through lengthening?  Or not sure yet.

[shortisnotfun]

My goal is 10cm on tibias and the full 12cm on femurs.

Total 22cm = about 9 inches

From 5,3” to 6,0” would be life changing!

Rooting for you brother!

[SpeedDialer]

Thanks man.

I’ve hit the sauna quite a few times now, made some new LL friends as well as friends who work at the hotel. Also explored the city of Freiburg the other day with another patient. Very fun times!!!

That's awesome, how did the sauna feel? I'm doing gnail femurs now. After I go back to the United States, I am thinking of going to the sauna and also walking in a pool (has some metal rails for handicaped people but water is not too deep)

[1team]

My goal is 10cm on tibias and the full 12cm on femurs.

Total 22cm = about 9 inches

From 5,3” to 6,0” would be life changing!

What is your sitting height and wingspan? I thought 16cm total was crazy but this is next level, did your doctor say this was safe?

[SpeedDialer]

Has Dr. Becker/Betz ever done a rebreak for someone for Betzbone tibias 2.0? Ex: if they are running into too much ballerina foot/afraid of non-union and want to buy some time by stopping, healing to normal function, then rebreak later

I know Paley allows 4cm on tibias then rebreak to do another 4cm on tibias so I wonder if 4+4 could be a good option for Betzbone 2.0 tibias also

Since its weight bearing I have to think that a rebreak would not be that disruptive to someone's life?

[SpeedDialer]

What is your sitting height and wingspan? I thought 16cm total was crazy but this is next level, did your doctor say this was safe?

Yeah, its sort of interesting how these clashing viewpoints on length limits will play out

With Paley saying that (4,4 rebreak 4,4) for 16cm total is the absolute maximum versus betz achieving 7-11 on femurs in one shot and sometimes 9+ on tibias in one shot

From a self interest perspective, it is good for us to have more datapoints on the forum of people doing like 10+cm on tibia or 10+cm on femurs and good for us not to dissuade them from doing this much (so the forum has more information/examples)

But it also sort of creates this tension where on one hand it can make a diary writer uncomfortable when readers comment on this very large length, but on the other hand it is hard for readers to not to talk about how long 10+cm on one segment is, like its quite hard to ignore

I appreciate the 11cm betz femur patient from another thread coming onto the forum and being open about the duckass but optimistic that it will go away with enough training

I also understand that rebreak is a pain in the ass and time consuming and why people wouldn't want to do it. But I do like the 'reset' or 'cheating' aspect of rebreak to do 4cm and then try to get to like a 'new baseline' by fully recovering after 4cm before doing more

[maxheight35]

Looks like you're making the most of things from what I see on IG.  Thats awesome.  LL is time in your life, you should enjoy it as much as you can like you are.  How long do you think youll stay there through lengthening?  Or not sure yet.

I’m leaving next week. Headed to NYC for a bit.

walking daily without crutches now. Limping but manageable!

[maxheight35]

Rooting for you brother!

Thank you bro 🙏

[maxheight35]

That's awesome, how did the sauna feel? I'm doing gnail femurs now. After I go back to the United States, I am thinking of going to the sauna and also walking in a pool (has some metal rails for handicaped people but water is not too deep)

Dude the sauna is awesome. I’m doing it as much as I can now… it helps so much, I think it’s one of the reasons how I’m able to walk without the crutches so soon. Sleep a lot better at night as well!

[maxheight35]

What is your sitting height and wingspan? I thought 16cm total was crazy but this is next level, did your doctor say this was safe?

Have no idea what my sitting height is and don’t care tbh. Long legs are sexy. I’m going to push as far as my body allows, and yes Dr Becker did say to stop at 10cm on tibias.

[maxheight35]

Hmm, not sure it’s necessary since the Betz nail already is able to go max 12cm. I think it depends on the maintenance of the patient and how often you stretch and train, etc. personally I’m religiously stretching, icing the legs, sauna, lots of sleep. Anything and everything I can do make it feasible!

Has Dr. Becker/Betz ever done a rebreak for someone for Betzbone tibias 2.0? Ex: if they are running into too much ballerina foot/afraid of non-union and want to buy some time by stopping, healing to normal function, then rebreak later

I know Paley allows 4cm on tibias then rebreak to do another 4cm on tibias so I wonder if 4+4 could be a good option for Betzbone 2.0 tibias also

Since its weight bearing I have to think that a rebreak would not be that disruptive to someone's life?

[Taller90]

I believe its always worth to give it a try to go to the personal targeted length in the first place before thinking about rebreaking. There is no law that the limit is exactly at 8 cm for femurs or 5 cm in tibia. The only limited factor is your body and in particular your nerves! You need to find the perfect balance between daily lengthening and the maximum your muscles, tendons, IT Band and nerves can be stretched. Where muscles and tendons can be stretched very very much and nearly to every length (if they get the necessary time), nerves have their natural limit which is different at everybody and which you should not exceed as they than can get damaged! So as long as your nerves are playing the game together with you and there is enough sign for bone consolidation, I would go ahead with the lengthening. It is not an easy game as the muscles and tendons need much more time to get to the desired length than your lengthening period will be. That means you will have a long recovery period to get normal when you  are lengthening amounts like 10cm or more. 

I appreciate Paley expertise but I pesonally don´t like his rebreak approach before the patient has at least give it a try to go to 6 or 7 cm in tibia and 9 or 10 cm in femur in the first place. Every surgery of this type are risky and should not be done, if it is not really necessary. This length are recheabe in the first place but need a good monitoring of the lengthening period where you listen to your body and are in close touch with your surgeon and good physiotherapist. There are enough best practices (beside of mine ) that such amounts are feaseable.

However, this are only my two cents.

Yeah, its sort of interesting how these clashing viewpoints on length limits will play out

With Paley saying that (4,4 rebreak 4,4) for 16cm total is the absolute maximum versus betz achieving 7-11 on femurs in one shot and sometimes 9+ on tibias in one shot

From a self interest perspective, it is good for us to have more datapoints on the forum of people doing like 10+cm on tibia or 10+cm on femurs and good for us not to dissuade them from doing this much (so the forum has more information/examples)

But it also sort of creates this tension where on one hand it can make a diary writer uncomfortable when readers comment on this very large length, but on the other hand it is hard for readers to not to talk about how long 10+cm on one segment is, like its quite hard to ignore

I appreciate the 11cm betz femur patient from another thread coming onto the forum and being open about the duckass but optimistic that it will go away with enough training

I also understand that rebreak is a pain in the ass and time consuming and why people wouldn't want to do it. But I do like the 'reset' or 'cheating' aspect of rebreak to do 4cm and then try to get to like a 'new baseline' by fully recovering after 4cm before doing more

[Taller90]

Dude the sauna is awesome. I’m doing it as much as I can now… it helps so much, I think it’s one of the reasons how I’m able to walk without the crutches so soon. Sleep a lot better at night as well!

You are doing it the right way! Sauna and ice are very good try to keep that on a regular basis when getting home. You will need it much more when the stiffness is becoming harder.

[OzBoy39]

Dude the sauna is awesome. I’m doing it as much as I can now… it helps so much, I think it’s one of the reasons how I’m able to walk without the crutches so soon. Sleep a lot better at night as well!

after reading your comment about the sauna, a couple.of hours ago I went to the local gym, had a sesh of hydrotherapy and then went into the sauna.

Kid you not for the first time in more than 1 month the nerve pain I have on my right leg disappeared. I was so surprised.

It came back later but it's quite ok and manageable now. So yeah, saune is the way from now on.
Thanks for that tip

[maxheight35]

This was an amazing reply post. Well said 🤝

I believe its always worth to give it a try to go to the personal targeted length in the first place before thinking about rebreaking. There is no law that the limit is exactly at 8 cm for femurs or 5 cm in tibia. The only limited factor is your body and in particular your nerves! You need to find the perfect balance between daily lengthening and the maximum your muscles, tendons, IT Band and nerves can be stretched. Where muscles and tendons can be stretched very very much and nearly to every length (if they get the necessary time), nerves have their natural limit which is different at everybody and which you should not exceed as they than can get damaged! So as long as your nerves are playing the game together with you and there is enough sign for bone consolidation, I would go ahead with the lengthening. It is not an easy game as the muscles and tendons need much more time to get to the desired length than your lengthening period will be. That means you will have a long recovery period to get normal when you  are lengthening amounts like 10cm or more. 

I appreciate Paley expertise but I pesonally don´t like his rebreak approach before the patient has at least give it a try to go to 6 or 7 cm in tibia and 9 or 10 cm in femur in the first place. Every surgery of this type are risky and should not be done, if it is not really necessary. This length are recheabe in the first place but need a good monitoring of the lengthening period where you listen to your body and are in close touch with your surgeon and good physiotherapist. There are enough best practices (beside of mine ) that such amounts are feaseable.

However, this are only my two cents.

[maxheight35]

Oh man I’m happy to hear that! Have you tried ice as well? Also what about the massage gun?

https://www.therabody.com/us/en-us/therabody-recovery-devices/?prefn1=productTypeMasterPLP&prefv1=theragun

Get either the Elite or the Pro model. Personally have the Pro and it’s been a great investment. I used it on muscles prior to lengthening but this is also a game changer on the legs fresh in the morning and a few times throughout the day.

after reading your comment about the sauna, a couple.of hours ago I went to the local gym, had a sesh of hydrotherapy and then went into the sauna.

Kid you not for the first time in more than 1 month the nerve pain I have on my right leg disappeared. I was so surprised.

It came back later but it's quite ok and manageable now. So yeah, saune is the way from now on.
Thanks for that tip

[tallmen]

Is is possible to get this surgery with dr becker and then stay there for 3-4 weeks and then continue rest of the lengthening in my home country? I am thinking about getting 4-4.5 cm tibia with Dr. becker in Jan-Feb.

[RealLostSoul]

Is is possible to get this surgery with dr becker and then stay there for 3-4 weeks and then continue rest of the lengthening in my home country? I am thinking about getting 4-4.5 cm tibia with Dr. becker in Jan-Feb.

Sure that’s possible.


Also about rebreak. Yes they do it but the thing is this depends on the patient. If you stretch and keep going then you can get more. If you don’t you may need to quit early because of becoming too tight and clicking will become hard again. Generally speaking, doing 5cm and then 5cm again half a year late is more comfortable and easy with stretching and all but it does require another surgery. It depends on the patient, his progress and how much he stretches mainly.
They will tell you this though (if you are able to continue or need to stop)

[maxheight35]

Yes, I would recommend staying at least 4 weeks to get in a good routine. And in my opinion the surgery isn’t worth it for only 4-5cm… go for at-least 8!

Is is possible to get this surgery with dr becker and then stay there for 3-4 weeks and then continue rest of the lengthening in my home country? I am thinking about getting 4-4.5 cm tibia with Dr. becker in Jan-Feb.

[tallmen]

Yes, I would recommend staying at least 4 weeks to get in a good routine. And in my opinion the surgery isn’t worth it for only 4-5cm… go for at-least 8!

I'll see how you feel when you reach 5cm.