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[Aturro]

Thats awesome, congrats! And great motivation for the rest of us...enjoy the new life!

[Alu]

It is genuinely great to hear that your journey  has been a success after a long year.
Would you possibly mind posting pictures of your proportions? You can feel free to cover your face with a blur or black spot; anything that focuses more on your body image would be greatly appreciated for refrence.
Also have there been any other complications with your knees or so? Thank you!

[programdude]

Knees are 100% fine. In a few days I will report on if those other issues the hardware seems to have caused are totally gone.

I will probably post pics at some point once I am a bit more filled in. Yellowspike can weigh in with his honest opinion about how I looked/my proportions also since he got to meet me in nyc.

[YellowSpike]

ProgramDude's proportions looked fantastic to me. And will look even more awesome when he bulks his legs back up more (I'm working on the same thing too).

[Taller]

Are your femurs longer than your torso and, if so, is it noticeable? I guess those proportions actually look good (and makes you look taller than you really are) BUT you have to have long arms to pull it off. But you're fine in that regard, it seems.

[Taller]

ProgramDude's proportions looked fantastic to me. And will look even more awesome when he bulks his legs back up more (I'm working on the same thing too).

Also, the real question we all want answered: are Programdude and Yellowspike really as good looking as it would seem they are? Lol.

[Uppland]

Great meeting you PD. Congrats on being officially done with this sh*t. Now get on dat full recovery time so we can spit game to NYC chicks 

Oh, crap. Looks like these two are gonna bite a large chunk out of the big apple.

Seriously though, congrats to both of you.

[YellowSpike]

Also, the real question we all want answered: are Programdude and Yellowspike really as good looking as it would seem they are? Lol.

Regarding ProgrameDude...I mean, was there ever any doubt? Lol.

[programdude]

Yellowspike kept the train going of most people I've met doing LL being good looking and sane going. We would clean up a NYC bar nicely.

I am feeling alright, pain meds keep the pain quite tolerable though the sides are unfortunate. I can walk relatively normally when on the meds, and it already feels like the issues I had pre removal aren't present. Nasty bruise on my left hip when I took bandages off, but dr. R said it should be no problem though.

[femoral_indecency]

Your insurance is paying for a cosmetic limb lengthening procedure??!!   Wtf, who you have your insurance with? Lol

[mb53]

Glad to see you're doing well. I had my surgery on the 22nd, so it's been about 11 days post-op. PT is going fine and pain is manageable but my only trouble is sleeping. I can't remember the last time I slept at night. I take brief naps during the day (which I realize I should stop doing) but other than that I'm constantly awake. It's 2am right now and have zero hopes of falling asleep anytime soon. I'll probably just end up watching It's Always Sunny or reading till the morning. What tips do you have for sleeping at night? Nothing seems to work for me. Thanks.

[programdude]

Your insurance is paying for a cosmetic limb lengthening procedure??!!   Wtf, who you have your insurance with? Lol

It covered some of the hospital fees for removal only...

As for sleep, the bad news is, as my diary indicates, sleep is the worst part of all this and never gets better. ZZZquill helped. Read through my thread and you will pick up some things here and there. It can be brutal.

Ps. it seems running again was only hindered by the rods, I ran today fine, despite not being full recovered from removal. Also walked around a lot today NO more clicking, NO more pain in my left leg. It looks like I am finally free.

[Bohemia]

Very happy for you, bro.

I undergo mine on August 25th in Spain.

[Sweatpants]

Hi PD,

Congrats on removal and successful completion!

I was wondering what pain meds you take now and how often? how is the pain from 1 to 10? did you do xray post op?
Since i am having my removal soon I d like to get some general idea about it .

Thanks! 

[programdude]

Hi PD,

Congrats on removal and successful completion!

I was wondering what pain meds you take now and how often? how is the pain from 1 to 10? did you do xray post op?
Since i am having my removal soon I d like to get some general idea about it .

Thanks!

Hey sweatpants, good seeing you here.

To give you an idea, even though I was told I'd need my crutches, I was able to walk out of recovery, and stand up to get dressed and use the bathroom etc. right away. I even could walk up and down stairs of the house I stayed at, and was able to drive home at around 4 am the morning after my evening surgery. In other words: nothing how you felt after your initial surgery.

You will get some duck ass just right after since you be too sore in the hips to straighten, but this will go away. The days right after pain when walking and moving is around a 5, and when stationary, almost painless. My back did get seriously tight to the point of being painful and is still somewhat tight even after deep massages, but thats probably not overly common and is probably just because I was mostly stationary a few days.

Now, about a week and a half later, there is still soreness but I don't need pain killers and I walked around almost all of saturday normally.

No x rays post op, and in the days after I was using about 4 of the percocets per day.

[KrP1]

Programdude i have some duck ass
 I emailed dr paley  and he told me that doing femurs will reduce or not change my duck ass but not get worse
 Is this true?

[programdude]

From my experience, at least a year later, this doesn't seem to be true. I have certainly not had duck ass improvement(had slight going into it). And if anything the tightness makes it worse after. Its possible with more time and very rigorous training it will get better, but I can't imagine this helping duck ass.

[YellowSpike]

Most people who do femurs will get duckass. I just don't see any way around it. Dr. G told me once you start getting to high lengthening amounts (7cm and up), it can take up to a year to completely go away. I'm almost 8 months post-op, and while I feel great (just came back from gym, did a killer glutes workout), I still have some duckass. Much better than what it was, but it's still there for sure.

[mb53]

What is duckass? I keep seeing this word on this forum but I don't understand what it means. I've only lengthened 13mm but as far as I can tell there's nothing seriously wrong with my posture.

[YellowSpike]

What is duckass? I keep seeing this word on this forum but I don't understand what it means. I've only lengthened 13mm but as far as I can tell there's nothing seriously wrong with my posture.

Duckass is the layman's term for lordosis. You can google it. Basically, it is caused by a combination of super tight hip flexors (due to the lengthening of femurs), weak glutes (from not using them while lengthening), and to a lesser extent, weak abs.

It basically looks like you're sticking your ass out like a Kartrashian.

[Sweatpants]

Hey sweatpants, good seeing you here.

To give you an idea, even though I was told I'd need my crutches, I was able to walk out of recovery, and stand up to get dressed and use the bathroom etc. right away. I even could walk up and down stairs of the house I stayed at, and was able to drive home at around 4 am the morning after my evening surgery. In other words: nothing how you felt after your initial surgery.

You will get some duck ass just right after since you be too sore in the hips to straighten, but this will go away. The days right after pain when walking and moving is around a 5, and when stationary, almost painless. My back did get seriously tight to the point of being painful and is still somewhat tight even after deep massages, but thats probably not overly common and is probably just because I was mostly stationary a few days.

Now, about a week and a half later, there is still soreness but I don't need pain killers and I walked around almost all of saturday normally.

No x rays post op, and in the days after I was using about 4 of the percocets per day.

Thanks PD for the answer, it helps a lot

[KrP1]

This is a part of the email dr Paley sent me:


Finally, if it has any effect on spine it is to lessen lordosis not increase it. The increase you may read about called ‘duckass’ is due to contracture of the TFL (iliotibial band) which we routinely lengthen.


-did he does iliotibial release on you?

[programdude]

IT band? Yes, but that is by the knees... not the hip area which is where the duck ass seems to radiate from...

I can speak only from personal experience as a patient, Paley is obviously more qualified, though I found him and his team to really underplay the intensity of a lot of this process- Whether it is to drive sales or genuine lack of understanding of what a patient goes through I won't speculate on.

I will keep people posted with how my duckass is once my hips are no longer sore, though its already basically back to where it was before removal.

[mb53]

Duckass is the layman's term for lordosis. You can google it. Basically, it is caused by a combination of super tight hip flexors (due to the lengthening of femurs), weak glutes (from not using them while lengthening), and to a lesser extent, weak abs.

It basically looks like you're sticking your ass out like a Kartrashian.

  Now that I look in a mirror this may be developing...

[programdude]

It is very normal and I haven't heard of anyone not getting it.

[Tylerdurden389]

I stayed up till nearly 3 am to try and read this entire diary but couldn't keep my eyes open. Just finished now in the morning as the last 5-6 pages are a quicker read lol. Thank you PD for doing this. It's given me (and others) a lot more confidence and assurance about doing LL. As a very short man of only 5-2.25 (158-159 cm), I was afraid that only doing 5-6.5 centimeters on both femurs and tibias meant a double surgery would only result in being like 5-6 or 5-7. Meaning I'd still be short. But reading your journal I can see that getting 3 inches/8 cm from the internal nail shouldn't be a problem. Being man who's been into bodybuilding for 17 years (I'm 31, started working out when I was 14), I feel confident that the post-op PT would be a breeze for me, as I also enjoy the challenge of pushing myself to the limit.

So who knows, maybe if I ever get the cash someday, I'll go for 8cm on the femur, and like 7-8 cm on the tibia, and I can result with being like 5-8 or 5-8.5. Sure I'd still be short in many people's eyes, but at least I wouldn't be "technically" short in the most general of terms.

Thanks again!!

[programdude]

No problem! Between the pain killers and lack of sleep some parts of the diary are definitely embarrassing but I'm glad I did it and like to think its a thorough idea of what to expect from this process.

Still haven't read back over the thread, but I am sure it will be interesting to say the least.

Sometimes I look back and honestly don't know how I did this all. There are so many components to it all, and thats not even accounting for the crazy amount of money or fear one could have, neither of which were an issue for me fortunately(the former was still hard to swallow). To have gone from short, to almost bed ridden, to a gimp, and now just simply tall to the untrained eye is wild. And the funniest thing is that if you do it well and discretely, pretty much no one will know what you've been through. I look forward to being 100% once the trauma from the legs goes away. I've definitely considered writing a book/starting a resource website since I remember how overwhelmed and lost I felt going into this, and know having a friend or guide would have made it all easier.

[Tylerdurden389]

I especially loved the part where you said Paley has a lot of patients do this and how it's getting bigger. As it gets more well known, it'll be less embarrassing to hide from others (I honestly don't think it should be embarrassing at all, and you can bet if I ever do have it done, I WILL let my girlfriend know). Who knows, maybe someday LL will be just as common and accepted as every other cosmetic procedure that people get and don't think anything of it.

[programdude]

Its only as big a deal as you make it. I don't want to be known as "that guy who got cosmetic surgery", sure, but I haven't flinched in telling those close to me about it. Not to mention I told a lot of girls there in florida about it, and a couple locally and it doesn't stop their enthusiasm.

If you are insecure about it and don't own it then it might not go so well though.

[KiloKAHN]

I especially loved the part where you said Paley has a lot of patients do this and how it's getting bigger. As it gets more well known, it'll be less embarrassing to hide from others (I honestly don't think it should be embarrassing at all, and you can bet if I ever do have it done, I WILL let my girlfriend know). Who knows, maybe someday LL will be just as common and accepted as every other cosmetic procedure that people get and don't think anything of it.

I personally think the future of CLL is more bleak. As the legit doctors retire there probably won't be as many safe options to choose from, and the ones left will jack up the price because the demand will be higher. Then you'll get joint replacement surgeons with barely any specialty training doing botch jobs on people and the reputation of the surgery will decline further as more and more people need repeat surgeries for corrections. The stigma will stay, imo.

[programdude]

There will always be stigma to cosmetic surgeries. Other than braces there is basically nothing that isn't looked down on to some extent, be it hair transplants, breast implants, nose jobs, etc.