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[boklecrt]

Hi guys,
long time lurker recent time poster on our forum, i recently underwent LON tibia with Dr. Quynh in Vietnam and wanted to share my thoughts and how things are going now that it has been about 2 and a half weeks since frame removal and im starting to use walker and learning to walk again. I write this diary post factum as I have questions pertaining to my recovery which I want to ask you, so might as well share my experience and then ask my questions.

Stats:
male
early 30s
starting height 170cm
western europe

Why I chose LON and tibia
Ive known about LL since many years, never was something I seriously considered, however recently over the past few years my height dysphoria has been amplified by some personal interactions. Also, I found myself single, without any immediate obligations therefore I finally could fit in a good 6 months away from friends/family for the LL + recovery so as to not have anyone know where exactly I am and what I am doing.

I chose LON instead of pure external for the fact that the frame comes off after lengthening is done, and tibia because there is just no way im doing LON on femur, I tip my hat to anyone who has undertaken LON Femur, you guys are heroes.

Furthermore, obviously price was a factor, as I am not financially well off enough to shell out 40-50k for internals. Moreover, reading about spending 100-130k on this surgery like how some patients do seems in the realm of dreams to me.

Anyway, I have told no one therefore couldn't enjoy the support of my family with the process and recovery. For this purpose I was looking for an LL doctor offering an all included package.

As we all know, the most famous "package" place is Buldu in turkey, but reading about his work ethics and distracting of 2mm per day and the fact that they put their patients faces on their instagram made me run away with 200km/h. Not to mention I don't feel the need to pay 24 000 euro to stay in a 5 star hotel for 3 months. A simple room with food seemed enough to me.

Enter the Vietnam doctor Dr. Quynh in Ho Chi Minh. This doctor does not speak English, which is not an issue to me, my main priority is skills and experience. Spent some time researching and figured he was a good choice.

The price I paid for my package was 21 000 USD for a 4 month All included package - visa, all surgeries up to frame removal(including scar revision which I decided not to do as I can't be bothered to stay in a hospital a 3rd time), room, food, helper 24/7, laundry, vitamins, medicine, xrays etc. Anything besides ordered food is covered. They say they offer 10 year warranty on complications - if something happens they cover free of charge. Hoping I don't have to take advantage of that one.

Anyway,
I wrote them in January, had the visa process started by them, waited 1.5 months for the visa and then flew to Ho Chi Minh to do it in March 2022.

What I experienced

Day 0-7
Arrival at airport - i got picked up by the English speaking assistant from the airport, who dropped me off at a quite nice small hotel in a good part of the city.

I spent 1 week in the hotel, and i was ordering food through him.

Day 4 of my stay we went for half body xray + tibia xray and to meet the Doctor, as well as current patients. Spoke with the patients, from their words and vibe I felt confident I have chosen a good place for LL. On the meeting with the doctor he looked at my legs and xrays and prescribed upper limit of 8cm lengthening. It was done with a contract which means that whatever I lengthen up to 8 cm will keep the complications warranty, and if I decide to do more than 8cm, there will be no warranty. Made sense to me.

Day 6
blood tests, heart tests, anesthesia doctor meeting, covid test etc

Day 7 surgery day
Well, finally the journey begins. In the surgery room I got a spinal infusion catheter installed for morphine and then had the surgery.

I woke up in the ICU with 7/10 pain, which I was warned would be expected, and its needed for adjusting the morphine dosage.

VERY GOOD THING was the fact that the English assistant was sitting next to my bed when I woke up in the ICU. I told them my pain level and they adjusted the morphine. I went back to sleep.

I think they overdid a little bit the morphine because I literally felt 0/10 pain for the next 2 days I had the morphine catheter on. Not that im complaining, I hate pain anyway.

After the icu I got moved to my hospital room, where a helper, a middle aged vietnamese lady, was waiting for me. The room had 2 beds, so she would be 24/7 with me. I was feeling 0 pain but slept most of that day. I spent the next few days in bed as I was only allowed mild exercise such as raising my legs to get the blood moving.

Day 9
Removal of morphine from spine and continuing normal infusion painkillers and antibiotics and blood thinners.

I got infused paracetamol multiple times a day which kept my pain level at 0/10 for the entire 7 day hospital stay. There was other things written on the paracetamol bottles which I couldn't read so it was some sort of paracetamol cktail + other medicine which I don't know.

Considering what horror stories I have read in the past on diaries here, I had a completely uneventful hospital stay with 0/10 pain.

Day 10
First walking with walker in hospital room. Well it was definitely painful but I knew I had to walk some so I walked across the room and back to the bed. Took me about 30 minutes and several sitting downs to rest.

Day 14
Discharge from hospital and getting back to the center. Got to their center, which was a multi-room apartment located in a residential area. Every patient has his own room and some get an inroom bathroom for extra charge. I didn't pay extra so I was sharing a bathroom with another patient. The helper from the hospital stayed with me in the room for 3 more days.

I was walking with the walker for these 3 days with the helper standing behind me with a small chair in case I need to rest or lose my balance.

Since I hate pain, I asked the assistant for painkillers and they gave me a Tramadol/Paracetamol mix, which kept my pain at 0/10 for basically the entire time in frames.

Day 17
Helper leaves, Im left alone. I get told to use a wheelchair for moving around as noone can be with me 24/7 like the helper to walk behind me and keep me safe from losing my balance and falling backwards. First time in my life using a wheelchair, you get used to operating it literally in 5 minutes though.

Day 18
Doctor comes with several assistants, one of which is my English speaking assistant. He did some adjustments to the frame and taught me how to turn the frame in order to distract.

Day 19-75
The lengthening process. Every day I hang out in my room, do my 4 turns a day, eat my food, and watch stuff on my laptop. Physical therapist comes every day 5 days a week for 1 hour and you need to do exercises, and she gives you feet massage.

Sleeping on my back was an issue for a good 3 weeks after I moved from the hospital to the apartment, until I got used to it. Every time i tried to side-sleep with the frames on it felt very awkward so I just stuck to back sleeping.

Showering was once a week, with waterproof covering on frames while sitting in the wheelchair in the shower.

Bandage change was 2 times per week, with the 2nd time being after the shower to remove moisture and lower the pin site infection chance.

Happy to report I had no pin site infections, which I understand are quite painful so at least that I skipped.

I cleared 50 mm so time to get those frames off.

Day 76
Frame removal day, back to the hospital. Felt excited to have these medieval torture devices off my legs and the lightness to come. I wake up in ICU with 6/10 pain concentrated in the ankles for some reason, have them adjust the morphine machine(this time IV), get down to 1-2/10 and get moved to my hospital room.

Again, a vietnamese lady helper to be with me during my hospital stay, which was 1 day. Not much to report regarding pain or discomfort. Just slept a lot, unfortunately had 0 appetite, especially when I smelled the hospital food when they brought it in. Ordered take out McDonalds to my hospital room, 3 burgers to at least eat something caloric that day and not have an entire day of 0 food. I spent 4 hours eating my Mcdonalds bite by bite, as 0 appetite made it difficult, so i had to be very careful not to make myself nauseous and having to puke all over myself.

Day 77
Back to the apartment, felt very good to be home(and it does feel like home after so long in there).

Day 78-83
4/10 pain level in ankles which I controlled with tramadol.

Day 84
First day of 0 painkillers as the pain was tolerable at 0-1/10. Going forward I haven't taken any more Tramadol, which was a milestone for me, as I had been taking it daily for all this time so I was concerned there would be addiction, thank God, no issues with craving to take it or anything.

Day 89
Xray day to see how the healing goes. Doctor tells me im allowed 70% weight bearing for 4 more weeks(total 6 weeks after frame removal). This shattered my hopes for walking without assistance sooner than 6 weeks however if the doctor says I will of course listen.

Day 91
After 2 weeks of 0 weight bearing this is the first day Im allowed to walk with the walker. Ballerina at 1.5cm if im able to judge correctly. Felt sad and depressed as I was walking with the walker i was only able to use my toes and it was very exhausting.

Day 93
Today, already did 3 sessions of therapy and walking. Still on my toes. Current thoughts and state of mind - mildly depressed, will I ever be able to take a normal stride where I put my heel down and push off with my toes, will I ever be normal again?! Did I make a mistake fking up my healthy legs and body.........and such thoughts..............time will tell


All in all summary of the Pros and cons of doing surgery with this doctor and their package

PROS
- cheapest LON package currently as far as I know, almost 10 000 USD less than Buldu
- pain management protocol dedicated to full patient comfort. Narcotics are given as much as requested(tramadol), without issue
- quiet, clean room in an apartment on the 15th floor so no mosquitoes and random bugs flying in the room
- good enough wifi to stream netflix
- assistant with you at all times for xrays and hospital visits. Assistant available 24/7 on the phone if needed during the lengthening process. You just call him and wake him up if its an emergency and he comes in 5 minutes. I had to take advantage of that only once, one night at around 2cm lengthened I panicked because I couldn't fall asleep and just straight up told him to start organizing the frame removal as I can't be bothered with this bull  anymore and wasn't thinking clearly. He came over in the middle of the night and calmed me down.


CONS
- Noone speaks english besides the assistant - need google translate app on the phone to communicate
- Food provided with the package is vietnamese, as a westerner I can't get used to it. It is eatable but nothing to write home about. You can make small adjustments if you're vegan for example. I had them make me extra eggs every day(boiled/omelletes etc). Sometimes I don't eat it and order takeout
- xrays are not digitally provided to patient besides physically looking at them because their framing is a company secret
- For tibia they use 3/4 illizarov frame(opening on the back allows full knee mobility) which is very heavy and bulky. Would've preferred monorail like the turkish doctors. For femur they do use monorail for obvious reasons


Open for questions as I am kinda bored sitting in my room

[LL2022]

Hi man,

Congratulations on your successful journey, you finished the difficult part and have the "easier" part left. By the way, Are you able to walk with crutches atleast, for how long?

[boklecrt]

Hi man,

Congratulations on your successful journey, you finished the difficult part and have the "easier" part left. By the way, Are you able to walk with crutches atleast, for how long?

Hi
thanks!!! It really is surreal having to be done with the difficult part which is the frames, all the discomfort and laying in bed staring in the ceiling at night are somewhat of a distant memory by now.

For your question please read my update below



UPDATE

Today marks 3 weeks after frame removal. As I said in my original post after the frame removal, the doctor does not allow any weight bearing for 2 weeks. So for these 2 weeks its full disabled wheelchair mode.

On monday was my first therapy day, all i could do was get up with the walker and just stand for a bit, but got exhausted immediately and told the therapist to just give me a foot massage and leave.

The next day, tuesday, i walked with the walker around the apartment corridor, id say a combined 15-20 meters of distance. Many stops over the course of this session to rest, the therapist walked behind me with a small chair and every time i need to stop i tell her and she puts it below my ass and i sit on it. I walked exclusively on my toes, and it made me quite quite sore and exhausted half way through but I pushed through in order to get back to my bed and put my legs up.

Wednesday, Thursday, Friday
More of the same, however after sleeping off the tiredness from Tuesday I was able to double my walking distance(instead of 1 lap of the corridor I did full 2 laps).

Saturday, Sunday
The therapist does not come on weekend days, so I did stuff on my own, mainly stretching and standing up on the walker to stretch the posterior chain.

Still unable to take a step and to touch the floor with my heel, due to the slight ballerina foot but I do feel it has improved slightly from my first pathetic attempt at standing up and walking from Monday.

It feels like the entire body is strengthening up once you start walking - walking with the walker for 7 METERS was a full on workout at the first few days but now my arms dont get that tired, my breathing does not make me winded, my calves are able to support me without extreme discomfort

Also I felt yesterday the stretch in my calves was not extreme burning muscle fiber tearing sensation but rather still stretched out just a tad less burning. I sincerely hope this means my tissues are taking the hint and stretching out to help with the new length


Xrays 13 days after frame removal(0 weight put on legs from frame removal surgery to xray day):

 


Questions for experienced members based on these xrays:

1. Is the left leg having misalignment or its within the safe and expected limit? Is this an issue? When you trace the line from upper part across the gap to the lower part it does look like it goes where its supposed to however I am just covering my bases here when it comes to knowledge what to expect

I do know based on my research in bone trauma and orthopedics that eventually a broken bone will straighten itself naturally over the course of the recovery but I would want reassurance on this from someone who knows

2. Right leg upper screws protruding from the bone into the soft tissues - is this a problem? I never had any pain or even suspected a screw is protruding until i saw the xray and I asked the team and they said there is no nerves there as well as if I didn't feel anything then there is no point for concern but now that i know about this screw going out of the bone I want to get a second opinion on this.


Next update - in one week

[171in2022]

Nice diary, I'm lengthening here at the moment too so it's interesting to see someone else at a similar stage as me.

I think 5cm is a good amount to have lengthened so I'm sure you will have a great outcome.

How long do you think until you can walk without crutches?

[ilovescience]

Nice diary, I'm lengthening here at the moment too so it's interesting to see someone else at a similar stage as me.

I think 5cm is a good amount to have lengthened so I'm sure you will have a great outcome.

How long do you think until you can walk without crutches?

Hi welcome to the forum. Are you doing LL now in Vietnam? Looking forward to your diary too. Is 171 your starting height?

[boklecrt]

UPDATE

This week was week 2 of my therapy and week 4 of my frame removal. Today marks exactly 4 weeks since the surgery.
This week was not that good in terms of therapy, I overdid the standing up on last Sunday which left me with some pain in my right leg's screws area. Pain was intense pulsating an lasted 5 days, i'd say constant 6/10 pain. Because of it I was not able to sleep very well and my therapy sessions were mediocre at best. I did not take any painkillers as I wanted to push through on my own. 2 months daily was enough of these stupid chemicals for me

I'd say this week 0 progress has been made.


No idea when I could walk without crutches, I am still on the walker stage. I am content that I chose this doctor since the package is 4 months and not the usual 3 months like the turkish so I was not kicked out on the 3rd month fresh out of frames to go home and be seen by everybody in a crippled state.

I am however aware that after my 4 months are up here I have to hide myself even more while recovering so I have planned to fly to the Phillipines and stay 2 months there to do therapy alone

[ilovescience]

UPDATE

This week was week 2 of my therapy and week 4 of my frame removal. Today marks exactly 4 weeks since the surgery.
This week was not that good in terms of therapy, I overdid the standing up on last Sunday which left me with some pain in my right leg's screws area. Pain was intense pulsating an lasted 5 days, i'd say constant 6/10 pain. Because of it I was not able to sleep very well and my therapy sessions were mediocre at best. I did not take any painkillers as I wanted to push through on my own. 2 months daily was enough of these stupid chemicals for me

I'd say this week 0 progress has been made.


No idea when I could walk without crutches, I am still on the walker stage. I am content that I chose this doctor since the package is 4 months and not the usual 3 months like the turkish so I was not kicked out on the 3rd month fresh out of frames to go home and be seen by everybody in a crippled state.

I am however aware that after my 4 months are up here I have to hide myself even more while recovering so I have planned to fly to the Phillipines and stay 2 months there to do therapy alone

I am just curious. Are you from the Philippines? Do they offer people to do LL or after care for people who did cosmetic surgery abroad?

Salamat po.

[boklecrt]

I am from western europe, no ties to PH
Just picked it as a cheap nearby destination for me to spend a few more months in a hotel with a gym and swimming pool and get myself up to presentable condition before I return to my home

[boklecrt]

UPDATE

Today marks 5 weeks since the removal of my frames and 3 weeks since I have begun therapy to re-walk again.
This week I changed my strategy and started taking tramadol before my therapy sessions to dull the sensations and have more effective therapy.
This has proven to be a semi-successful strategy as I am able to do up to 2 hours of walking, standing, stretching etc without significant discomfort.
When I finish my sessions my legs feel very exhausted. I feel the exhaustion on the next day upon waking up since the tramadol had worn off and my legs feel sore, weak, ankles still hurting

After 20-30 minutes of stretching i am able to put my heel down therefore I start walking with the walker at this point where when i take a step I plant my foot down fully. This is a small progress towards eradicating my ballerina deformation which has been at around 1.5-2cm

This week I will slowly start experimenting movement with crutches instead of walker as next sunday I am changing the country and cannot travel with the walker.

By the way, after observing many other diaries and patient xrays over the past few weeks I have come under the conclusion that my xrays which I posted in my 2nd post in this thread do not warrant further scrutiny as they represent a fine job done by the surgeon. My two concerns about misalignment and protruding screws are nothing to worry about.

I am extremely hopeful I will be able to finish my recovery without any sudden complications. At this point my only concern is not to suffer a bent or broken screw of my IM nails.

[boklecrt]

UPDATE

Today marks 6 weeks after frame removal, and 4 weeks after starting therapy to learn walking again. The doctor now allows me full weight bearing therefore from now on I will be concentrating solely on regaining proper gait as now I can step forward with one foot, push my walker forward then step with the other foot and put it in front of the first foot(normal walking gait), instead of my therapy gait til now which consisted of putting two feet together and then pushing walker(50% body weight per leg).

On friday I used crutches for the first time - it was unbelievably awkward and difficult. Balance = 0. My brain has completely forgotten how to walk. Managed to step a few meters and then lost my balance and fell backwards onto my bed.

The fight continues.

I got some new xrays and a CT scan and my final result is 51mm per leg. Quite happy with that fact.

Reposting the xrays from my 2nd post in this thread for side-by-side comparison of callus and muscle growth.

Xrays 2 weeks post frame removal:


Xrays 6 weeks post frame removal:

[marcjero]

Yhanks for sharing. I'm sue you will do progress very quicly right now.

[boklecrt]

UPDATE

Week 7 after frame removal, week 5 after started partial weight bearing, and week 1 of full weight bearing allowed

Well, this week i have had massive progress due to the fact that I am now allowed to fully weight bear my entire body weight on each leg. This means that I am able to mimic normal walking gait. It has truly filled me with optimism that in maximum 2-3 more weeks id be able to walk unassisted and feel like a normal person again.

Last friday was the first day I tried using crutches which was a disaster due to the fact that I didnt warm up my legs before trying that out so I was basically trying to balance on my tip toes and my calf muscle had no stretch.

What I started to do after that is to walk with the walker for some time, 15-20 minutes and get nice and warmed up before attempting crutch usage.
This was a successful strategy as it led to warming up my leg muscles and dropping down my ballerina to the floor which allowed balancing with the crutches.

I started walking with a 4 point crutch gait technique on monday tuesday and wednesday, and on thursday friday and saturday I walked by holding both crutches to the sides and walking in the middle.

The thing that currently hampers my progress is the massive pain i feel in the legs after walking 150-200 meters. It is a serious pain in the lower front tibia bones and general weakness in the entire ankle joint. Needless to say, I am taking tramadol before exercise and even that is unable to kill these sensations that come from my exercise sessions.

In order for me to be able to walk i have to continue crutch usage until my body strengthens those areas enough to allow for unassisted walking. I predict it will take me 2-3 weeks, perhaps more, noone knows, however now I have a clear path to recovery and that has been great on my mental health.

[boklecrt]

UPDATE

8 weeks post frame removal
2 weeks now of full weight bearing and crutch usage

This week I did the same as what i did last week however slowly day by day the pain in the front lower tibia that manifests from walking is less and less. Also ankles seem to be strengthening which is a very good sign.

I have started doing calf raises and squats to get my muscles back up and its going good. Of course i am unable to do a normal squat because my dorsiflexion is almost non existent therefore I use a belt which I tie to the railing in the corridor outside of my room and squat while holding to it. Combined I do 500 calf raises a day and 100 squats, as well as about 2 hours of combined walking with crutches a day.

Last sunday I did about 10 steps without any assistance however was hunched over in order to keep balance therefore I have not attempted walking without assistance again as I dont want to teach myself improper hunched over walking technique.

I feel id need 2-3 more weeks of this to start unassisted walking.

[boklecrt]

UPDATE

Unassisted walking achieved at 8 weeks post frame removal

The next day after my last update 2 weeks ago I began unassisted walking. Gait is abnormal due to all the stiffness in the tendons, ligaments and muscles down there and the fact that everything is interconnected.

It would take some time for normal gait to be restored as soft tissues need time to stretch.

Reasons why I didnt start walking unassisted sooner than 2 months after removal of the frames:

1. I was lazy during the frames and didnt stretch enough so instead of stretching all the soft tissues during the frame period I had to waste time doing that after the frame removal
2. I used my wheelchair for every daily activity and barely used the walker
3. I was instructed to do 2 weeks of no weight bearing after the frame removal
4. I was instructed to weight bear up to 70% of body weight until 6 weeks post frame removal

When I started weight bearing fully at week 6, I immediately became competent with the crutches starting at 4 point crutch gait, moving to 2 point crutch gate within just days

2 weeks of that led to unassisted walking

Upon good warm up and lots of walking when all the leg tissues have been properly warmed up I am able to get very close to normal gait.

I reckon I need another month until normal gait, making my entire journey complete 6 months.

Will update again in a few weeks with a walking video

[id0n4x]

Good luck with the rest of your journey, I'm planning to go to this doctor so I'll be sure to look for your updates all very much appreciated, thank you and good luck.

[boklecrt]

Good luck with the rest of your journey, I'm planning to go to this doctor so I'll be sure to look for your updates all very much appreciated, thank you and good luck.

yeah good choice honestly, the surgeon works pretty clean and as long as you listen to what they tell you I doubt you'd face any complications

by listening what they tell you means not to do stuff on your own accord like walking without the walker while alone in the room and general ignorant stuff like not scratching your pin sites if it itches etc

i specifically went to them because i needed an all included package, not having to invent the wheel with all the other side considerations like with other surgeons - where to sleep, who to be roommates with, how to cook food, having to hire helper, how to clean your airbnb, how to change your bed sheets, how to get to the hospital for the xrays every 2 weeks etc etc

good luck

[hoopdreams]

How did you even contact this Dr.? I heard he retired 3 years ago

[boklecrt]

How did you even contact this Dr.? I heard he retired 3 years ago

"hoop dreams" so youre into basketball then eh
id say youre too tall for this surgery, why do you want to do it? no real social benefits at your starting height and if youre doing it for basketball purposes have in mind you wont be dunking after it any time soon no matter how much you lengthen


if you insist:
http://www.limblengtheningforum.com/index.php?topic=3852.0
in this thread they clearly say the old doctor retired 2017 so now dr Quynh is their main doctor. i went to their website from that thread and wrote them on whatsapp

[id0n4x]

Any updates, how are you?

[boklecrt]

Figured ill add an update for all my buddy boyos

Well, friends, 5 and a half months now from the surgery and I can say I have achieved functional normality.

This means my walking is normal now.

For the past 1 month i have been doing 3 km of daily walking, and a month ago I used to take this distance for about 70 minutes, with my legs feeling like absolute  shyte at the end of the session(swollen and painful and ankles feel like dismantling and stuff, had to lay down for an hour after to recover)

Today I broke 3km for 45 minutes and my legs werent even all that tired at the end of it, I just got bored walking. Feels fookin great buddy boyos!!!


Anyways, I am obviously not 100% back to normal because:
1. going down stairs as pre op is still impossible due to my ongoing dorsiflexion issue. I am getting there, but it will take more months

2. im not running or jumping. this i will not be doing until xray proof of full consolidation. I will go get an xray sometime in december at about 6-7 months into recovery

but besides those two, im walking normal and fast, and it feels amazing being capable again

cheers mateys

[4cm]

Congratulations.

[sprit33]

Your have an amazing recovery efficiency, congratulations

[boklecrt]

thanks boyos
id say normal healing time considering i did the famous 5 cm tibia limit. i had actually planned to gigaheightmaxx with 3 inches on tibia but when i started the process i saw i wouldnt be able to swing it

just the ballerina at 7.5 wouldve been a killer, good thing i changed my target promptly before crippling myself

[shortisnotfun]

thanks boyos
id say normal healing time considering i did the famous 5 cm tibia limit. i had actually planned to gigaheightmaxx with 3 inches on tibia but when i started the process i saw i wouldnt be able to swing it

just the ballerina at 7.5 wouldve been a killer, good thing i changed my target promptly before crippling myself

Very interesting, thanks for the diary. How are you doing right now? Normal walk?

[shortisnotfun]

Hi guys,
long time lurker recent time poster on our forum, i recently underwent LON tibia with Dr. Quynh in Vietnam and wanted to share my thoughts and how things are going now that it has been about 2 and a half weeks since frame removal and im starting to use walker and learning to walk again. I write this diary post factum as I have questions pertaining to my recovery which I want to ask you, so might as well share my experience and then ask my questions.

Stats:
male
early 30s
starting height 170cm
western europe

Why I chose LON and tibia
Ive known about LL since many years, never was something I seriously considered, however recently over the past few years my height dysphoria has been amplified by some personal interactions. Also, I found myself single, without any immediate obligations therefore I finally could fit in a good 6 months away from friends/family for the LL + recovery so as to not have anyone know where exactly I am and what I am doing.

I chose LON instead of pure external for the fact that the frame comes off after lengthening is done, and tibia because there is just no way im doing LON on femur, I tip my hat to anyone who has undertaken LON Femur, you guys are heroes.

Furthermore, obviously price was a factor, as I am not financially well off enough to shell out 40-50k for internals. Moreover, reading about spending 100-130k on this surgery like how some patients do seems in the realm of dreams to me.

Anyway, I have told no one therefore couldn't enjoy the support of my family with the process and recovery. For this purpose I was looking for an LL doctor offering an all included package.

As we all know, the most famous "package" place is Buldu in turkey, but reading about his work ethics and distracting of 2mm per day and the fact that they put their patients faces on their instagram made me run away with 200km/h. Not to mention I don't feel the need to pay 24 000 euro to stay in a 5 star hotel for 3 months. A simple room with food seemed enough to me.

Enter the Vietnam doctor Dr. Quynh in Ho Chi Minh. This doctor does not speak English, which is not an issue to me, my main priority is skills and experience. Spent some time researching and figured he was a good choice.

The price I paid for my package was 21 000 USD for a 4 month All included package - visa, all surgeries up to frame removal(including scar revision which I decided not to do as I can't be bothered to stay in a hospital a 3rd time), room, food, helper 24/7, laundry, vitamins, medicine, xrays etc. Anything besides ordered food is covered. They say they offer 10 year warranty on complications - if something happens they cover free of charge. Hoping I don't have to take advantage of that one.

Anyway,
I wrote them in January, had the visa process started by them, waited 1.5 months for the visa and then flew to Ho Chi Minh to do it in March 2022.

What I experienced

Day 0-7
Arrival at airport - i got picked up by the English speaking assistant from the airport, who dropped me off at a quite nice small hotel in a good part of the city.

I spent 1 week in the hotel, and i was ordering food through him.

Day 4 of my stay we went for half body xray + tibia xray and to meet the Doctor, as well as current patients. Spoke with the patients, from their words and vibe I felt confident I have chosen a good place for LL. On the meeting with the doctor he looked at my legs and xrays and prescribed upper limit of 8cm lengthening. It was done with a contract which means that whatever I lengthen up to 8 cm will keep the complications warranty, and if I decide to do more than 8cm, there will be no warranty. Made sense to me.

Day 6
blood tests, heart tests, anesthesia doctor meeting, covid test etc

Day 7 surgery day
Well, finally the journey begins. In the surgery room I got a spinal infusion catheter installed for morphine and then had the surgery.

I woke up in the ICU with 7/10 pain, which I was warned would be expected, and its needed for adjusting the morphine dosage.

VERY GOOD THING was the fact that the English assistant was sitting next to my bed when I woke up in the ICU. I told them my pain level and they adjusted the morphine. I went back to sleep.

I think they overdid a little bit the morphine because I literally felt 0/10 pain for the next 2 days I had the morphine catheter on. Not that im complaining, I hate pain anyway.

After the icu I got moved to my hospital room, where a helper, a middle aged vietnamese lady, was waiting for me. The room had 2 beds, so she would be 24/7 with me. I was feeling 0 pain but slept most of that day. I spent the next few days in bed as I was only allowed mild exercise such as raising my legs to get the blood moving.

Day 9
Removal of morphine from spine and continuing normal infusion painkillers and antibiotics and blood thinners.

I got infused paracetamol multiple times a day which kept my pain level at 0/10 for the entire 7 day hospital stay. There was other things written on the paracetamol bottles which I couldn't read so it was some sort of paracetamol cktail + other medicine which I don't know.

Considering what horror stories I have read in the past on diaries here, I had a completely uneventful hospital stay with 0/10 pain.

Day 10
First walking with walker in hospital room. Well it was definitely painful but I knew I had to walk some so I walked across the room and back to the bed. Took me about 30 minutes and several sitting downs to rest.

Day 14
Discharge from hospital and getting back to the center. Got to their center, which was a multi-room apartment located in a residential area. Every patient has his own room and some get an inroom bathroom for extra charge. I didn't pay extra so I was sharing a bathroom with another patient. The helper from the hospital stayed with me in the room for 3 more days.

I was walking with the walker for these 3 days with the helper standing behind me with a small chair in case I need to rest or lose my balance.

Since I hate pain, I asked the assistant for painkillers and they gave me a Tramadol/Paracetamol mix, which kept my pain at 0/10 for basically the entire time in frames.

Day 17
Helper leaves, Im left alone. I get told to use a wheelchair for moving around as noone can be with me 24/7 like the helper to walk behind me and keep me safe from losing my balance and falling backwards. First time in my life using a wheelchair, you get used to operating it literally in 5 minutes though.

Day 18
Doctor comes with several assistants, one of which is my English speaking assistant. He did some adjustments to the frame and taught me how to turn the frame in order to distract.

Day 19-75
The lengthening process. Every day I hang out in my room, do my 4 turns a day, eat my food, and watch stuff on my laptop. Physical therapist comes every day 5 days a week for 1 hour and you need to do exercises, and she gives you feet massage.

Sleeping on my back was an issue for a good 3 weeks after I moved from the hospital to the apartment, until I got used to it. Every time i tried to side-sleep with the frames on it felt very awkward so I just stuck to back sleeping.

Showering was once a week, with waterproof covering on frames while sitting in the wheelchair in the shower.

Bandage change was 2 times per week, with the 2nd time being after the shower to remove moisture and lower the pin site infection chance.

Happy to report I had no pin site infections, which I understand are quite painful so at least that I skipped.

I cleared 50 mm so time to get those frames off.

Day 76
Frame removal day, back to the hospital. Felt excited to have these medieval torture devices off my legs and the lightness to come. I wake up in ICU with 6/10 pain concentrated in the ankles for some reason, have them adjust the morphine machine(this time IV), get down to 1-2/10 and get moved to my hospital room.

Again, a vietnamese lady helper to be with me during my hospital stay, which was 1 day. Not much to report regarding pain or discomfort. Just slept a lot, unfortunately had 0 appetite, especially when I smelled the hospital food when they brought it in. Ordered take out McDonalds to my hospital room, 3 burgers to at least eat something caloric that day and not have an entire day of 0 food. I spent 4 hours eating my Mcdonalds bite by bite, as 0 appetite made it difficult, so i had to be very careful not to make myself nauseous and having to puke all over myself.

Day 77
Back to the apartment, felt very good to be home(and it does feel like home after so long in there).

Day 78-83
4/10 pain level in ankles which I controlled with tramadol.

Day 84
First day of 0 painkillers as the pain was tolerable at 0-1/10. Going forward I haven't taken any more Tramadol, which was a milestone for me, as I had been taking it daily for all this time so I was concerned there would be addiction, thank God, no issues with craving to take it or anything.

Day 89
Xray day to see how the healing goes. Doctor tells me im allowed 70% weight bearing for 4 more weeks(total 6 weeks after frame removal). This shattered my hopes for walking without assistance sooner than 6 weeks however if the doctor says I will of course listen.

Day 91
After 2 weeks of 0 weight bearing this is the first day Im allowed to walk with the walker. Ballerina at 1.5cm if im able to judge correctly. Felt sad and depressed as I was walking with the walker i was only able to use my toes and it was very exhausting.

Day 93
Today, already did 3 sessions of therapy and walking. Still on my toes. Current thoughts and state of mind - mildly depressed, will I ever be able to take a normal stride where I put my heel down and push off with my toes, will I ever be normal again?! Did I make a mistake fking up my healthy legs and body.........and such thoughts..............time will tell


All in all summary of the Pros and cons of doing surgery with this doctor and their package

PROS
- cheapest LON package currently as far as I know, almost 10 000 USD less than Buldu
- pain management protocol dedicated to full patient comfort. Narcotics are given as much as requested(tramadol), without issue
- quiet, clean room in an apartment on the 15th floor so no mosquitoes and random bugs flying in the room
- good enough wifi to stream netflix
- assistant with you at all times for xrays and hospital visits. Assistant available 24/7 on the phone if needed during the lengthening process. You just call him and wake him up if its an emergency and he comes in 5 minutes. I had to take advantage of that only once, one night at around 2cm lengthened I panicked because I couldn't fall asleep and just straight up told him to start organizing the frame removal as I can't be bothered with this bull  anymore and wasn't thinking clearly. He came over in the middle of the night and calmed me down.


CONS
- Noone speaks english besides the assistant - need google translate app on the phone to communicate
- Food provided with the package is vietnamese, as a westerner I can't get used to it. It is eatable but nothing to write home about. You can make small adjustments if you're vegan for example. I had them make me extra eggs every day(boiled/omelletes etc). Sometimes I don't eat it and order takeout
- xrays are not digitally provided to patient besides physically looking at them because their framing is a company secret
- For tibia they use 3/4 illizarov frame(opening on the back allows full knee mobility) which is very heavy and bulky. Would've preferred monorail like the turkish doctors. For femur they do use monorail for obvious reasons


Open for questions as I am kinda bored sitting in my room

Hey man, can I also ask, how did you pay for this surgery? Did you have to bring cash with you? Or what

[boklecrt]

No, i never like to bring cash around

When they make the visa for you and they tell its ready, you then send a $1000 deposit to get the visa in order to use it for flying to Vietnam. Then when you go there and meet the doctor and everything you sign the contracts and send the rest of the money, can be in parts as well if you don't have it all right away. they are flexible

I used Transferwise to send the payment - extremely easy and cheap compared to 40$ bank wire fees

[liltunechi]

No, i never like to bring cash around

When they make the visa for you and they tell its ready, you then send a $1000 deposit to get the visa in order to use it for flying to Vietnam. Then when you go there and meet the doctor and everything you sign the contracts and send the rest of the money, can be in parts as well if you don't have it all right away. they are flexible

I used Transferwise to send the payment - extremely easy and cheap compared to 40$ bank wire fees

Hey man, is it possible if you could please PM me the contact details to your Dr?

Thank you

[4cm]

Hi,
I send you a PM.

[Torbjorn]

Hey bro,
Congrats for your new height. Can you show us a pic of what the LON device looked on your tibias? (you mentioned it is not the same as buldu). Could you show us a pic of your scars?
Keep us update on your recovery. Thanks a lot

[mellowrain]

How flexible were you prior to surgery?
How is your ballerina now.
I was considering the same doctor.
Covid has pushed back my plans until next year.

[Unknown]

Do u have d? Can i talk to u?