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[Medium Drink Of Water]

I'm not an expert on LL; you may know more than me about certain technical details.  I had the surgery in 2007 and can provide a recovered patient's insights and opinions from a long-term perspective.

[everythingbutheight]

I'm not an expert on LL; you may know more than me about certain technical details.  I had the surgery in 2007 and can provide a recovered patient's insights and opinions from a long-term perspective.

Thanks for doing this. I'm 168cm (5'6) and 22 years old, which may be similar to your situation back in 07.

1) It's been 14 years since you've done this. Most that do this, never come back to this forum. You're still here though. Is it just to genuinely help others on here or do you still have height on your mind?

2) From your perspective, do you think your experience would of been more successful by any metric (less pain, less complications, more height) if you would of done it today vs 07?

3) Diminishing returns. As I'm 5'6, I've heard this surgery is life changing for someone my height. As for someone who is let's say 5'9, not so much. Do you agree with this statement? How satisfied are you at 5'10 and how has it changed your life around work, women, friends, family?

4) Put yourself in my shoes. 5'6. 22. WFM. Healthy weight and flexible. Have more than enough money for 10+ surgeries. Willing to spend a lot more money on the best full-time PT, caretakers etc and pick the best of the best surgeons. My femurs are naturally short (same length as tibia). Is this a no-brainer surgery to be 5'9 or 5'11?

5) How are you mobility wise now? 14 years later? from 0-100% (100% being your mobility pre-surgery), where are you on this spectrum?

I appreciate you doing this!

[Medium Drink Of Water]

1) It's been 14 years since you've done this. Most that do this, never come back to this forum. You're still here though. Is it just to genuinely help others on here or do you still have height on your mind?

I enjoy hanging out with my people.  I've never been happier than when I was living with other LL patients in the Nis Vojna Bolnica and Guang Ji Hospital.  We all had so much in common personality- and experience-wise even if we were so different in other ways.  A small flock of other black sheep to belong to briefly.

Of course I wish I could be 6'.  Who under that height doesn't?  But there's no way I will ever get femur LL.  I'd considered it in the past but that door is now closed permanently.  5'10 is plenty anyway.

2) From your perspective, do you think your experience would of been more successful by any metric (less pain, less complications, more height) if you would of done it today vs 07?

Assuming I would be in the same financial situation now as I was then, no.  I think things are worse now for budget LL'ers than they were 14 years ago.  Imagine a clinic that charges $33,000 (that's what 14 years of inflation did to the $25,000 I paid) all-inclusive for LL (Ilizarov frame with a proprietary spring-loaded heel attachment to stretch the Achilles tendon while you lengthen) and five months of hospitalization with Denny's- or mediocre Chinese restaurant-quality meals, caretakers, a physical therapy gym (sometimes staffed, sometimes not), and at least one doctor on duty 24/7.  I don't even know where I would go with that budget today.

People with a lot of money are certainly better off now with more doctors to choose from and better internal nails, though.

3) Diminishing returns. As I'm 5'6, I've heard this surgery is life changing for someone my height. As for someone who is let's say 5'9, not so much. Do you agree with this statement? How satisfied are you at 5'10 and how has it changed your life around work, women, friends, family?

It's been a huge change in all aspects of life.  Probably a combinaiton of more respect from others just because of stature alone, and internal self-confidence from knowing I'm taller.  And the respect and self-confidence then interact and keep boosting each other in a virtuous cycle.  I've never been a 6' alpha chad so I can't be sure getting that tall wouldn't be just as life-changing.

4) Put yourself in my shoes. 5'6. 22. WFM. Healthy weight and flexible. Have more than enough money for 10+ surgeries. Willing to spend a lot more money on the best full-time PT, caretakers etc and pick the best of the best surgeons. My femurs are naturally short (same length as tibia). Is this a no-brainer surgery to be 5'9 or 5'11?

I think a femur surgery is a no-brainer for you.  For an internal tibia surgery, a slit is cut into the patellar ligament and the nail is inserted and then removed through it.  My patellar ligament didn't react well to this and I've had mild tendonitis there ever since.

A lot of people don't get this problem and many doctors say they've never heard of it, so you might consider going for two surgeries.  Splitting up the height increase between femurs and tibias may help you avoid the issues I mention in the next question.  Lengthening three inches on the tibias alone wasn't ideal.

5) How are you mobility wise now? 14 years later? from 0-100% (100% being your mobility pre-surgery), where are you on this spectrum?

Mobility is pretty good.  My estimate overall is about 90%.  I used to be able to put my palms on the floor with my legs straight.  Now I can get the palms 3" from the floor.  Leg strength seems to be the same as before.  Balance is something that doesn't seem to improve with time because the center of gravity is higher and won't change no matter what; I notice I'm more wobbly and sometimes need to pay attention to balance, especially when I'm getting up or walking through cramped spaces with a lot of obstacles to avoid and turns required.  Before, balance was nearly perfect and automatic.  Same with agility; it seems to have a lower ceiling for what's possible now.  Moving a long leg is always going to be more difficult and slower than moving a short leg.

[indication]

How private have you kept this procedure?

And at what point did you think it's your new normal height and felt you no apprehension while meeting old acquantainces?

[Highest]

Why femur lengthening no longer an option mdow? Is it an age thing?

[Medium Drink Of Water]

How private have you kept this procedure?

And at what point did you think it's your new normal height and felt you no apprehension while meeting old acquantainces?

I kept it absolutely as private as I could.  I only told close family I actually lived with at the time.  They would certainly know something was up if I mysteriously disappeared for five months and came back taller and in a wheelchair.  I planned to tell everyone else that I grew.  However, those family members told other family members.  The secret was contained to just that side of the family though.

This did not seem like my new normal height for 3-4 years.

I made it my business to never meet old acquaintences.  From 2007 I sought to define myself to the world as a 5'10 guy, not a stretched out short guy.  If anyone found out about LL I'd failed.

Why femur lengthening no longer an option mdow? Is it an age thing?

I could still physically do it.  It's a private reason that has nothing to do with age or the surgery/recovery itself.

[dexter1930]

I'm not an expert on LL; you may know more than me about certain technical details.  I had the surgery in 2007 and can provide a recovered patient's insights and opinions from a long-term perspective.

if you could go back in time, would you still lengthen 3 inches?

[Medium Drink Of Water]

if you could go back in time, would you still lengthen 3 inches?

I would do only two.

[TakingAction]

I would do only two.

So would you use a sentence or two to describe the benefits and costs of the three following height increase to your life?
1. Increase 3 inches
2. Increase 2 inches
3. Increase 1 inch.

Do you really think that the benefits of 2 inches would outweigh the costs? Why didn't you say 1.5 inches or not doing it at all?

[Medium Drink Of Water]

So would you use a sentence or two to describe the benefits and costs of the three following height increase to your life?
1. Increase 3 inches
2. Increase 2 inches
3. Increase 1 inch.

Do you really think that the benefits of 2 inches would outweigh the costs? Why didn't you say 1.5 inches or not doing it at all?

Every inch matters and is progressively tougher on the body, not in a linear way.  Hard to know exactly how much tougher though.  I don't bother thinking in half inches or lower increments because there's not much difference between one number and the next with intervals that small.

I think 5'10 is certainly better than 5'9.  Even a 5'9 guy might be seen as short in some situations involving taller people wearing thicker shoes than he is.  Still better than 5'8; that's a huge mental jump to 5'9 in my opinion even though it's the same distance apart.

I think two inches would outweigh the costs.  I thought of doing 2" even back then but went for 3" because a lot of other people were doing that much or in some cases even more, and the price was the same.  8-9 cm was a range of lengthening several foreign Beijing patients were doing.  And the domestic Chinese patients' lengthening ranges varied even more than that.  Some only wanted 4 cm, one girl wanted 14 cm.   They got charged by length and didn't have package deals offered to them.

[indication]

I read your novel and it was the most extreme approach at privacy I had ever read: which was to change your name after surgery. Did you actually do that? Obviously you don't have to answer if you don't feel comfortable.

What are some important steps you think one should take to protect his privacy apart from the obvious stuff like not telling people you are getting this done?

[TheDream]

Do you think that lengthening both segments (i.e. both tibia's and femurs) with smaller increments, instead of just one segment with a large increment is wiser?

As an example: if you wanted to lengthen 7.5 cm would it be better to lengthen tibia's by 3.5 cm and femurs by 4 cm rather than going for the full 7.5 cm on one of them?

[Medium Drink Of Water]

I read your novel and it was the most extreme approach at privacy I had ever read: which was to change your name after surgery. Did you actually do that? Obviously you don't have to answer if you don't feel comfortable.

Then I won't. It's entirely up to you what you do.  It wouldn't make a difference if I did it or not.

What are some important steps you think one should take to protect his privacy apart from the obvious stuff like not telling people you are getting this done?

Get it done while you're still young enough that people will believe that you grew.  I got my 5'7 driver's license when i was 18.  When it expired I went back to the DMV to get a new one and there was no issue at all with the different height.

Get scar revision and then tattoos over the scars so nobody will find out you had surgery.

Do you think that lengthening both segments (i.e. both tibia's and femurs) with smaller increments, instead of just one segment with a large increment is wiser?

Probably, but you're adding multiple additional major surgeries to spread out the length, so it's definitely not a black and white issue.

[173to187USTORUSSIA]

Did you find your dating, romantic and career prospects changed significantly after the surgery?

If you could gain 6 inches and be reborn as the same man, only taller and more confident, would you do it if it meant leaving behind your old friends and an ex?

I appreciate you taking the time to comment in the thread I made with my ex.

[Medium Drink Of Water]

Did you find your dating, romantic and career prospects changed significantly after the surgery?

Definitely, women look at me as a potential partner instead of, to quote The Great Oudoors, a rack of yard tools at Sears.

Not so much in terms of career prospects though.  Height only makes a difference in some professions.

If you could gain 6 inches and be reborn as the same man, only taller and more confident, would you do it if it meant leaving behind your old friends and an ex?

Already did that for 3.

[SpeedDialer]

What are the biggest cons to doing precise 2 tibias up to 6 cm with Parihar?

Aside from possible knee pain from internal tibia

[Medium Drink Of Water]

What are the biggest cons to doing precise 2 tibias up to 6 cm with Parihar?

Aside from possible knee pain from internal tibia

I have no experience with the device or doctor.

[ilovescience]

Dear Sir,

Have you participated in any kinds of sports or activities for hours since the surgery in 2007? Legs feeling ok to do any prolonged activities that required hours to complete?

[Medium Drink Of Water]

Dear Sir,

Have you participated in any kinds of sports or activities for hours since the surgery in 2007? Legs feeling ok to do any prolonged activities that required hours to complete?

I can play a full basketball game.

[ilovescience]

I can play a full basketball game.

Wow, that's cool. Can you dunk with ease?

[TakingAction]

Every inch matters and is progressively tougher on the body, not in a linear way.  Hard to know exactly how much tougher though.  I don't bother thinking in half inches or lower increments because there's not much difference between one number and the next with intervals that small.

I think 5'10 is certainly better than 5'9.  Even a 5'9 guy might be seen as short in some situations involving taller people wearing thicker shoes than he is.  Still better than 5'8; that's a huge mental jump to 5'9 in my opinion even though it's the same distance apart.

I think two inches would outweigh the costs.  I thought of doing 2" even back then but went for 3" because a lot of other people were doing that much or in some cases even more, and the price was the same.  8-9 cm was a range of lengthening several foreign Beijing patients were doing.  And the domestic Chinese patients' lengthening ranges varied even more than that.  Some only wanted 4 cm, one girl wanted 14 cm.   They got charged by length and didn't have package deals offered to them.

You said "I think 5'10 is certainly better than 5'9." But you also said that you'd "do 2 inches" (5'9) instead of 3 (5'10) if you can go back in a time machine. You were 5'7 before surgery, correct? If yes, then is the "better" life quality from 5'9 to 5'10 not strong enough for the negative effect of that additional inch? How would you know for sure that you wouldn't get the negative effect had you chosenn to do 2 inches instead of 3?

[MakeMeTallAF]

Wow, that's cool. Can you dunk with ease?

Dude he's like 5'10 now and had LL

Most 5'10 dudes who never had LL can't dunk, let alone one who had LL.

[Medium Drink Of Water]

You said "I think 5'10 is certainly better than 5'9." But you also said that you'd "do 2 inches" (5'9) instead of 3 (5'10) if you can go back in a time machine. You were 5'7 before surgery, correct? If yes, then is the "better" life quality from 5'9 to 5'10 not strong enough for the negative effect of that additional inch? How would you know for sure that you wouldn't get the negative effect had you chosenn to do 2 inches instead of 3?

Yeah, I think that extra inch on the tibias only probably wasn't worth it.  The issues I have are biomechanical.  My tibialis anterior muscles have to work so hard when I walk that walking is pretty tough workout (for those muscles only).  After several months of rehabilitation they couldn't grow anymore; they had reached their limit but they still needed to be bigger to do what they needed to do.  This caused a condition called exertional compartment syndrome, which is when too much blood goes into a muscle when you use it, and pressure builds up inside.  To fix this, a fasciotomy was performed, which is cutting a small slit in the fascia of the muscle so blood can drain out of it.  The skin on top of that area now has very few hairs on it for some reason.  The muscle feels a little bit unnaturally soft and springy when I press on it with my fingers, kind of like a water balloon.  This is because it's got blood draining out of it interstitially in that area.  Normally a muscle is hard and resistant when you press on it because you're reducing its volume without changing the amount of tissue contained within the fascia, which raises the pressure.  And it feels even harder and more resistant when you flex it because you're raising its internal pressure further by doing so.  You can't raise the pressure on something if it has a pressure release valve, which is what my tibialis anterior muscles now have.

Another issue I've noticed is that when I lie on my side with my knees bent I have to be careful where I put my feet because it's easier with long tibias to get your foot to go higher than your knee, which when lying on your side can put sideways force on the knee joint.  Thinking about the physics of this, a naturally taller person could easily have this issue as well, but the longer femurs they have give them a little more range of tibia positioning possibilities.

[Medium Drink Of Water]

Why femur lengthening no longer an option mdow? Is it an age thing?

Never mind.  I just decided I'm definitely getting internal femur LL.

[MakeMeTallAF]

Never mind.  I just decided I'm definitely getting internal femur LL.

Wait are you serious?

[pandemic_exploiter]

Never mind.  I just decided I'm definitely getting internal femur LL.

Beast

[Medium Drink Of Water]

Wait are you serious?

Yes.  I'm moving to northern Europe and don't want to go back to being short again.

[MakeMeTallAF]

Yes.  I'm moving to northern Europe and don't want to go back to being short again.

What technique (precice?) and also how many cm are you aiming for?

What is your current height and the avg height in the country you are moving to?

[Medium Drink Of Water]

I'm currently 178 cm, will lengthen at least 5 cm so I can get to 6', maybe more if I decide that it'll be proportionally acceptable.

I'll use Stryde if it's back by the time I get it done, otherwise Precise.

No comment on the country.

Guess I'd better get back to work on that novel so my 2nd LL can be written about concurrently.

[SpeedDialer]

What are the pros and cons of leaving in internal nails for years? I get scared when I read diaries of people who had bad complications after a nail removal surgery

[Unknown]

Never mind.  I just decided I'm definitely getting internal femur LL.

Why would you do that? 5'10 is really pretty good height already. At worst at tall places u will be slightly shorter but still, u will be way taller than girls and still be regarded as a man.