Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Apollo676]

Could you ask him why is he so against Lon femur ? I know that's its the worst for femur but I'd like to know specifically why if it's not good for long term recovery or what

[V21]

Could you ask him why is he so against Lon femur ? I know that's its the worst for femur but I'd like to know specifically why if it's not good for long term recovery or what

As far as I know, it causes lots of complications and people lose ROM, so it's not used by European or American doctors. However, I do understand that people who can't afford internals choose to do it.

[Body Builder]

As far as I know, it causes lots of complications and people lose ROM, so it's not used by European or American doctors. However, I do understand that people who can't afford internals choose to do it.

And also it tears big muscles like quadriceps.
Lon on femurs is a very bad decision. Thats why no respectable doctor does it.

[SirStretchAlot]

By rebreaking I mean that you disturb the bone gap by doing some extreme movements to lengthen. And I don't know how your lengthening became painless after 2-3 cm but most LLers cried in pain till the very end of their lengthening phase.
Also, I've seen tehths of x rays of LL patients. Patients with albizzia had always the thinest bine bridge after lengthening which means that something was disturbing the bone gap and I am sure that it was the way it lengthens (with the extreme movements).

Anyway I find it really unacceptable for Giotikas to charge so much money for that obsolete nail and that happens only because he found a way to continue doing fully internals, now that stryde and precise are not back in europe, with earning even more money than before.
I used to respect Giotikas but that kind of decisions are not worthy of a respectable doctor.

I have Betzbone (an Albizzia derivative) in me and have had an operation with Giotikas, while you have not. So please don't pretend to be so authoritative on this matter.

My callus + bone gap are doing fantastic. I did almost cry during LL for the first 3cm, but am now clicking pain free. I lengthen both legs in 2 minutes. I do not know of any patients who experience clicking pain until the end. It always gets better.

If anything, the fact that another doctor is promoting G-nail is a validation of its merits. Betz and Guichet used to be the sole promoter of their nails, which led to conflicts of interest. Patients should now be more confident about Betzbone/G-nail, because we will be getting our data from a broader pool of doctors.

And mechanical distraction is not "out-dated". The reason why Stryde was recalled is because any non-mechanical energy source requires magnets, which exist in a vaccumed iron compartment. This leads to corrosion whenever highly acidic bodily fluids breaches the compartment during distraction. Mechanical nails made entirely of cobalt chrome are not susceptible to this problem. I would consider mechanical nails outdated only when magnetic nails fixes its own problems.

I have definitely criticized Betz for not performing ITB release but the nail itself is superior to Precise 2, simply because weight-bearing leads to superior social life during distraction, and less recover time afterwards. I found my current girlfriend during distraction, who I never would've met were I on a walker and had to stay home for 3-4 months. I and many other Betzbone patients also went back to work after 2 weeks.

The amount of social life, time, and money you lose for being on a walker is significant. Giotikas offering G-nail improves optionality for LL patients and creates competition for Stryde, which is good for all consumers.

[V21]

I have been reading old diaries with G Nail and it does not seem fair to call it a "crap nail", as people had mostly good results. However, some do talk abou "accidental clicks", so I will ask Giotikas about that tomorrow.

[RB]

I have Betzbone (an Albizzia derivative) in me and have had an operation with Giotikas, while you have not. So please don't pretend to be so authoritative on this matter.

My callus + bone gap are doing fantastic. I did almost cry during LL for the first 3cm, but am now clicking pain free. I lengthen both legs in 2 minutes. I do not know of any patients who experience clicking pain until the end. It always gets better.

If anything, the fact that another doctor is promoting G-nail is a validation of its merits. Betz and Guichet used to be the sole promoter of their nails, which led to conflicts of interest. Patients should now be more confident about Betzbone/G-nail, because we will be getting our data from a broader pool of doctors.

And mechanical distraction is not "out-dated". The reason why Stryde was recalled is because any non-mechanical energy source requires magnets, which exist in a vaccumed iron compartment. This leads to corrosion whenever highly acidic bodily fluids breaches the compartment during distraction. Mechanical nails made entirely of cobalt chrome are not susceptible to this problem. I would consider mechanical nails outdated only when magnetic nails fixes its own problems.

I have definitely criticized Betz for not performing ITB release but the nail itself is superior to Precise 2, simply because weight-bearing leads to superior social life during distraction, and less recover time afterwards. I found my current girlfriend during distraction, who I never would've met were I on a walker and had to stay home for 3-4 months. I and many other Betzbone patients also went back to work after 2 weeks.

The amount of social life, time, and money you lose for being on a walker is significant. Giotikas offering G-nail improves optionality for LL patients and creates competition for Stryde, which is good for all consumers.

Exactly. Couldn’t agree more. Mechanical nails will have their place until a safe and superior magnetic option replaces them, which seems to be a long way off.

I still don’t understand why people on this forum talk about stryde like it’s still an option. It’s best to plan your LL journey as if stryde doesn’t exist, because it no longer does and there’s a strong chance it never comes back.

[V21]

Okey guys, I just had a meeting with Giotikas. If I understood correctly, G-Nail has two sizes: the small one takes 75 kg per leg, the big one 94 (I think, my conection was bad). I have to give an answer the next days, and I strongly believe that some guys here have strong prejudice for mechanical nails, maybe because of Guichet being a problematic surgeon. I do not think they are "crap" nails, and I know a lot of Betzbone guys who have had "Stryde-like" results. However, I still think I favor Precice.

The doctor is quite honest and he does not try to sell anything, and I still have to think about it. I hope this is useful for those who wanted more information regarding G-Nail. From my meeting with Giotikas, I would summarize:

G-NAIL

Weightbearing with crutches since day 1.

You get 1 cm in surgery.

Probably more painful than Precice, but he is really confident that he has good protocols to make clicking easier.

The surgery would be 100% this month. This is important, as I must work online since beginning of October, and it's good to have a month post op before starting.

He does not have as much experience with this nail in comparison with Precice.

The rate of nail malfunction is 1.6 %, which is not much different than Precice.

PRECICE

I would probably get the big nail. He says Precice is not as fragile as we think, so I should have no issues as long as I'm compliant.

I do 5.5 cm, so probably 4 months without being able to walk without walker.

Probably less pain.

He thinks it will be back by September, but he can't confirm 100%.

Has lots of experience with this nail.

[L8GrowthSpurt]

Thanks for the info V21. Just want to confirm, Giotikas said if you go with guichet nail you get a whole cm just in surgery?? That seems wrong. You sure it wasn’t 1 mm? Good luck with the decision. I myself am likely going to just go with precice 2.2 which Will require less weight bearing rather than wait for stryde because it’s return is just too unpredictable.  But it’s a different calculus for me since I’m in the US. Whatever your decision good luck!

[V21]

Thanks for the info V21. Just want to confirm, Giotikas said if you go with guichet nail you get a whole cm just in surgery?? That seems wrong. You sure it wasn’t 1 mm? Good luck with the decision. I myself am likely going to just go with precice 2.2 which Will require less weight bearing rather than wait for stryde because it’s return is just too unpredictable.  But it’s a different calculus for me since I’m in the US. Whatever your decision good luck!

No, it's totally right, this nail allow you to get 1 cm in surgery, which sabes you 10 days. I did ask him though about how is that possible, as the normal safe rythm is 0.1 mm per day. He explained it extensively to me, and I lack a bit of English to reproduce it, but it is not problematic when it happens after cutting the bone. The rest is the same as always: 7 days rest, and lenghtening starts. I do believe him, as I know of Betzbone patients who got 0.8 cm on surgery and had no issue.

[LU213]

I think that is good news.  I am now seriously considering the G-Nail in Greece.

[V21]

I understand I'm taking the risky option, but I have strong reasons for it and for my personal situation. I will say more about that when I start my diariy. Feel free to use me as a guinea pig¡

[L8GrowthSpurt]

No, it's totally right, this nail allow you to get 1 cm in surgery, which sabes you 10 days. I did ask him though about how is that possible, as the normal safe rythm is 0.1 mm per day. He explained it extensively to me, and I lack a bit of English to reproduce it, but it is not problematic when it happens after cutting the bone. The rest is the same as always: 7 days rest, and lenghtening starts. I do believe him, as I know of Betzbone patients who got 0.8 cm on surgery and had no issue.

Wow! Thanks for verifying. I’m not up on the gnail specifics and my review of accounts for initial lengths gained just based on the initial surgery seems all over the place. Good luck!

[SirStretchAlot]

Wow! Thanks for verifying. I’m not up on the gnail specifics and my review of accounts for initial lengths gained just based on the initial surgery seems all over the place. Good luck!

Your bone canal will be milled to fit the width of the nail. The bonemeal will be a muddy form which can be used to fill the distraction gap for faster consolidation. How much of an initial gap depends on how much bone was milled. For example, I had a 6mm initial gap after milling 3mm in bonemeal. Other Betz patients have had 7mm in initial gap. Too large of an initial gap increases the likihood of non-union, hence why you don't distract 5mm a day. I'm surprised Giotikas can create a 1cm initial gap. It's not too outrageous, but if you're young and a fast bone grower, accelerating your lengthening by 10 days might be worth it.

[V21]

Your bone canal will be milled to fit the width of the nail. The bonemeal will be a muddy form which can be used to fill the distraction gap for faster consolidation. How much of an initial gap depends on how much bone was milled. For example, I had a 6mm initial gap after milling 3mm in bonemeal. Other Betz patients have had 7mm in initial gap. Too large of an initial gap increases the likihood of non-union, hence why you don't distract 5mm a day. I'm surprised Giotikas can create a 1cm initial gap. It's not too outrageous, but if you're young and a fast bone grower, accelerating your lengthening by 10 days might be worth it.

Well, he said around 1 cm, so maybe in reality it's like 0.7 or so. However, if you read old Guichet diaries, everyone says 1 full cm.

[Nyc brother]

Hey V21,

I’m also going to use Dr. Giotikas. I want to do mine in December. I have a 15 min consultation with him next week. What do you think about the Guichet nail? I definitely don’t want to be the only one doing that nail with him, as you said he doesn’t have a lot of experience with it.

[V21]

Hey V21,

I’m also going to use Dr. Giotikas. I want to do mine in December. I have a 15 min consultation with him next week. What do you think about the Guichet nail? I definitely don’t want to be the only one doing that nail with him, as you said he doesn’t have a lot of experience with it.

Well, two people do it on 24 August, and I do it 25. I will make a diary, so you will be able to have us as guinea pigs hahaha.

[pownzorgeek]

Okey guys, I just had a meeting with Giotikas. If I understood correctly, G-Nail has two sizes: the small one takes 75 kg per leg, the big one 94 (I think, my conection was bad). I have to give an answer the next days, and I strongly believe that some guys here have strong prejudice for mechanical nails, maybe because of Guichet being a problematic surgeon. I do not think they are "crap" nails, and I know a lot of Betzbone guys who have had "Stryde-like" results. However, I still think I favor Precice.

The doctor is quite honest and he does not try to sell anything, and I still have to think about it. I hope this is useful for those who wanted more information regarding G-Nail. From my meeting with Giotikas, I would summarize:

G-NAIL

Weightbearing with crutches since day 1.

You get 1 cm in surgery.

Probably more painful than Precice, but he is really confident that he has good protocols to make clicking easier.

The surgery would be 100% this month. This is important, as I must work online since beginning of October, and it's good to have a month post op before starting.

He does not have as much experience with this nail in comparison with Precice.

The rate of nail malfunction is 1.6 %, which is not much different than Precice.

PRECICE

I would probably get the big nail. He says Precice is not as fragile as we think, so I should have no issues as long as I'm compliant.

I do 5.5 cm, so probably 4 months without being able to walk without walker.

Probably less pain.

He thinks it will be back by September, but he can't confirm 100%.

Has lots of experience with this nail.

Hi v21, thanks for the info, just one question. For the gnail, the pain is more where? Only when clicking? Also could you ask Giotikas if the quality of the regenerate is as good as with precice?

[Nyc brother]

V21,

Yeah I would love to follow your diary. Excited to get this done. I heard Dr. Guichet can be a jerk, but not necessarily is nails are so bad. They are strong.

[V21]

V21,

Yeah I would love to follow your diary. Excited to get this done. I heard Dr. Guichet can be a jerk, but not necessarily is nails are so bad. They are strong.

Yeah, I would not go to Guichet. Terrible human being. However, Giotikas is a great doctor, so I think getting G Nail with him is a reasonable risk to take, specially taking into account all the advantages it presents and the fact that Precice is not 100% guaranteed to come back in September.

[Bantem]

Did he raise his prices for his other nails? They seem for costly than I remember

[V21]

Did he raise his prices for his other nails? They seem for costly than I remember

Yes he did. Luckily for me, I payed deposit on January, so I keep the "old" prices. He raised prices in like 1.5-2 K.

[173to187USTORUSSIA]

And also it tears big muscles like quadriceps.
Lon on femurs is a very bad decision. Thats why no respectable doctor does it.

Kulesh and Solomin want to give me LON Femur, are you saying it is dangerous?