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[Future Skycraper]

Do you have a reason to think doing four segments at once is less burden to the body than two at a time?

I didn't make myself clear before. I was comparing what I said above, of course that two at a time is better than 4 at a time, if it's the same amount. But 8cm at once in one segment is more burden than 4cm in two segments.

[Future Skycraper]

The difference between "2 quadrilateral and 3 bilateral procedures" surgery wise is the same: 3 surgeries, 4 if you include nail removal.

Try emailing them and asking if you can do bilateral femur 8cm and later bilateral tibia 7-8cm. But don't forget to ask the risks and possible complications. And also the difference to quadrilateral twice and 3 bilateral

[RealLostSoul]

Doctor said that 4cm both is less burden than 8cm in one segment, cause each soft tissue like muscles will be less streached. You will be streaching more soft tissue but only 4cm, with one segment you will streatch 8cm.

But if you do 4cm tibia than 4cm femur another year, it's way better than four segments at a time, for sure.

I think I didn't wrote that clear before, does it makes sense now?

(I'm not comparing 4cm tibia and 4cm femur at once to 4cm tibia and 4cm femur 1-2y apart, I was comapring 4cm tibia and 4cm femur once to 8cm at one segment.

But you have 2 major surgeries within a very close time and stretch the soft tissue more AT ONCE. It's not like your tibia soft tissue is totally disconnected from your femur soft tissue. Plus you have 6 broken bones at once.

IMO for 8cm only, do femurs only. 8cm femurs is an achievable goal for healthy adults. No need to do quadri for that it's a bad idea. 8cm longer femurs won't even screw proportions up and will safe you a lot of sufferage and money.


And also, I am not OP you don't have to recommend me anything (Thank you regardless). I won't do quadri for sure since it's too much of a burden and looking at diaries of quadri patients they seem to have a collectively harder time (by a lot!).

[Future Skycraper]

But you have 2 major surgeries within a very close time and stretch the soft tissue more AT ONCE. It's not like your tibia soft tissue is totally disconnected from your femur soft tissue. Plus you have 6 broken bones at once.

IMO for 8cm only, do femurs only. 8cm femurs is an achievable goal for healthy adults. No need to do quadri for that it's a bad idea. 8cm longer femurs won't even screw proportions up and will safe you a lot of sufferage and money.

Yeah, you're right... You will have triple times bones to heal, and more pain in more parts of the body. That makes sense. But I'm going to email a doctor to ask why quadrilateral is an option.

Yeah, 8cm is not even 20% of the femur lentgh I think. But what about the tibia/femur ratio?

[RealLostSoul]

Yeah, you're right... You will have triple times bones to heal, and more pain in more parts of the body. That makes sense. But I'm going to email a doctor to ask why quadrilateral is an option.

Yeah, 8cm is not even 20% of the femur lentgh I think. But what about the tibia/femur ratio?

I was thinking similar to you when I started looking into LL and all but after doing a lot of research I will decide to do bilateral femurs first since quadrilateral (with a 2-4 week pause between the two surgeries) seems to be way tougher than I anticipated (read diaries of quadri patients as a reference for that claim) and it's more expensive by a lot. I will much rather want to only lengthen femur as much as it's possible for my body, then see how I feel, if I want more I'll go with tibia lengthening.

If I would really only had quadri as a choice (bc of whatever reason) I would wait for stryde.


Don't worry about the femur/tibia ratio. While it is the most significant proportion thing (next to arm length which I am fortunately rather good with) you can compensate it easily. Lengthening femurs by 8cm is fine, you will have a slightly shorter tibia, no one will notice it (just look at successfull femur only LL patients). And even if you feel off, you can just wear lifts and bam you are back to normal knee height for your ratio/proportion. This is the reason why you should go femurs first, if you go tibia first you can't do that plus worse recovery and less height gain (in the end we all want as much height gain as possible let's be real).
And in the long run you can always do tibias later.
And about arthritis problems: if your axis stays stable it shouldn't matter too much, as far as I was told at least (ask your doctor about this though).

[Future Skycraper]

I was thinking similar to you when I start(...)

Well, firstly, thank you for writing it all down. I really appreciate it!

I will read it, I'm reading the barcelona one now (He seems to be having a hard recover at walking). Yes, the way you explained seems to be tougher, it's better to do what you said, get femur at max and wait.

Yeah, I think that too. But I will only do LL with stryde, cause of recovering time and time to walk normaly.

Okay, I won't, knowing the shoe lift life hack is awesome. But I do worry about the biomechanics after only femur. (I will look at those patients too for sure). I don't really care about armspan, long legs are beautiful and used at superheroes. Iwill search about doing bileteral femur first, I'm open with that option for sure.  (Yeah, we want the maximum as possible with no permanent complications and weird look)

Yes, and with a different doc if you want right?

Wht do you mean with stable axis? (I will ask one later!)

Thank you very much, I really appreciate your response!

[RealLostSoul]

Well, firstly, thank you for writing it all down. I really appreciate it!

I will read it, I'm reading the barcelona one now (He seems to be having a hard recover at walking). Yes, the way you explained seems to be tougher, it's better to do what you said, get femur at max and wait.

Yeah, I think that too. But I will only do LL with stryde, cause of recovering time and time to walk normaly.

Okay, I won't, knowing the shoe lift life hack is awesome. But I do worry about the biomechanics after only femur. (I will look at those patients too for sure). I don't really care about armspan, long legs are beautiful and used at superheroes. Iwill search about doing bileteral femur first, I'm open with that option for sure.  (Yeah, we want the maximum as possible with no permanent complications and weird look)

Yes, and with a different doc if you want right?

Wht do you mean with stable axis? (I will ask one later!)

Thank you very much, I really appreciate your response!

You are welcome .

Yes STRYDE is the best device but unfortunately it is not available now. All alternatives come  with up and downsides (precise is not weight bearing, mechanical nails are usually more painfull, externals are uncomfortable create more scars and risk infections etc)
If you can wait until next year I think it is worth waiting!

I sincerely think proportions are overrated. Even those who do a lot of lengthening (for example look at the user @jfk - he did 2 LLs and got to 16.5cm) end up looking amazing. Safety is what matters though, yes!

I think biomechanics are not much affected tbh. Unless you are an athlete or bodybuilding doing squads etc it will not make too much of a difference. Even when it does, you will only be impaired for the year gap until you get the tibia LL. Think about it that way, people who do cross lengthening (one femur and one tibia on the other side at the same time) have a much worse odd look until they get the second surgery.. but when they do it's all fine again.

I mean the mechanical axis*. Basically the alignement of the bones and how the pressure/force is distributed on the knee. If it is screwed (with internals it rather happens on the tibia) you will get arthritis due to one side of the knee being pressured way more. If it is aligned properly, you should be fine. Some argue there could be long term risks but this is debatable. Logically, being an athlete or being obese is a much higher risk for that than just a few extra inches on your bones. At least this is my opinion (and most Doctors will say that if done properly, there really shouldn't be any long term problems).

[nightstar]

So wait for Stryde to come back. Start with femur 8cm. Then 2 tibia surgeries. Sounds like it will be a 3 year process, which is okay. But over 3 surgeries the repeated risk of fat embolism makes me leery.

I can't imagine having this surgery before the weight-bearing devices were invented. Sounds terrible.

[nightstar]

From what I read here, it looks like there's been great progress towards stem cell based growth in the last 5 years. Maybe I'll hold off on that 3rd surgery and wait for those other techniques in 10 or 20 years time. Don't want to cripple myself with 2 surgeries on the same bone.

[RealLostSoul]

@nightstar

The risk isn‘t any less with quadrilateral.

Waiting for stem cell stuff is a bad idea. Stay realistic. That won‘t be a future in our lifetime. Rather do 2 lls and accept that you only got 14 instead of 16 cm. Dude it really is whatever, when you start the LL journey most people change their mind about their goal anyways..

[nightstar]

Waiting for stem cell stuff is a bad idea. Stay realistic. That won‘t be a future in our lifetime.

Almost certain to be possible within your lifetime. Very reasonable to guess, within 25 years. But that's a large part of our life. I certainly won't wait on it to begin. Then decisions can be made.

[RealLostSoul]

Almost certain to be possible within your lifetime. Very reasonable to guess, within 25 years. But that's a large part of our life. I certainly won't wait on it to begin. Then decisions can be made.

Stem cells for new options in organ transplants? Yea possible within 25 years. Stem cells to make grown organisms grow taller? that‘s on a similar sci fi level as the alcubierre warp drive imo.

[Future Skycraper]

You are welcome .

Yes STRYDE is the best device but unfortunately it is not available now. All alternatives come  with up and downsides (precise is not weight bearing, mechanical nails are usually more painfull, externals are uncomfortable create more scars and risk infections etc)
If you can wait until next year I think it is worth waiting!

I sincerely think proportions are overrated. Even those who do a lot of lengthening (for example look at the user @jfk - he did 2 LLs and got to 16.5cm) end up looking amazing. Safety is what matters though, yes!

I think biomechanics are not much affected tbh. Unless you are an athlete or bodybuilding doing squads etc it will not make too much of a difference. Even when it does, you will only be impaired for the year gap until you get the tibia LL. Think about it that way, people who do cross lengthening (one femur and one tibia on the other side at the same time) have a much worse odd look until they get the second surgery.. but when they do it's all fine again.

I mean the mechanical axis*. Basically the alignement of the bones and how the pressure/force is distributed on the knee. If it is screwed (with internals it rather happens on the tibia) you will get arthritis due to one side of the knee being pressured way more. If it is aligned properly, you should be fine. Some argue there could be long term risks but this is debatable. Logically, being an athlete or being obese is a much higher risk for that than just a few extra inches on your bones. At least this is my opinion (and most Doctors will say that if done properly, there really shouldn't be any long term problems).

True! In my case I will NEVER do with external, and I'm almost thinking to do it only with stryde or not doing it, cause stryde is a bless, weight bearing right after surgery gets a HUUUGE impact at recovery time!

Yeah, me too. long lengs don't even look bad, and arm spam not important for appearence (but important for sports). I will check him out!

Cross leghening is weird, why do they do it?? Yes, it's only for about 1-2years with a huge femur, but you can fake it until you do tibias for sure. And I don't think someone will return to a athlet state before 2-3y after the last surgery. The barcelona guy started the consolidation phase (108 days after surgery) and he's still walking weird, it will take much more time. About biomechanics, I think that Femur/tibia ratio might have a small impact, but not sure.

Ohhh gotcha!!! Yeah, I think it depends at your conditions, health, habits and the surgeon. If you don't do impact sports you're fine (my family does not like any running or etc sports, cause you get problems when you get old), so I think it woun't be a problem.

Now that you said it, I was thinking initially only 8-10max with quad once. But I'm starting to think about 8cm femur than tibia 6cm, total 14. I would like to be 6 feet tall. I'm 168, but with good posture almost 169. So 14 would be okay with bilateral after a year, right?

[Future Skycraper]

@nightstar

The risk isn‘t any less with quadrilateral.

Waiting for stem cell stuff is a bad idea. Stay realistic. That won‘t be a future in our lifetime. Rather do 2 lls and accept that you only got 14 instead of 16 cm. Dude it really is whatever, when you start the LL journey most people change their mind about their goal anyways..

Yes, true. I read some diaries and also some patient stories (some from lee) that some patients wanted 10-12 and when they got 6cm they said that was okay, and some wanted only 4 and endend up with 8. I think everyone wants the maximum, including myself. But you need to be conservative and do the maximum with safety, 14cm is already HUGE, getting problems for only 2cm more to be 16cm, it's not worth. But if you can get 16 with the same safety as 14cm, go ahead.

I think CLL with stryde is almost a nobel thing. It's a huge technology, stem cells will take years. So Stryde is the thing now.

[nightstar]

Keep in mind, already LLS is shown to be stem cell growth. Not normal bone repair. This was the conclusion of the Stanford Medicine study. To create this reaction without breaking the bone is far away, but on the horizon. Not like Alcubiere (science fiction).

[RealLostSoul]

True! In my case I will NEVER do with external, and I'm almost thinking to do it only with stryde or not doing it, cause stryde is a bless, weight bearing right after surgery gets a HUUUGE impact at recovery time!

Yeah, me too. long lengs don't even look bad, and arm spam not important for appearence (but important for sports). I will check him out!

Cross leghening is weird, why do they do it?? Yes, it's only for about 1-2years with a huge femur, but you can fake it until you do tibias for sure. And I don't think someone will return to a athlet state before 2-3y after the last surgery. The barcelona guy started the consolidation phase (108 days after surgery) and he's still walking weird, it will take much more time. About biomechanics, I think that Femur/tibia ratio might have a small impact, but not sure.

Ohhh gotcha!!! Yeah, I think it depends at your conditions, health, habits and the surgeon. If you don't do impact sports you're fine (my family does not like any running or etc sports, cause you get problems when you get old), so I think it woun't be a problem.

Now that you said it, I was thinking initially only 8-10max with quad once. But I'm starting to think about 8cm femur than tibia 6cm, total 14. I would like to be 6 feet tall. I'm 168, but with good posture almost 169. So 14 would be okay with bilateral after a year, right?

Yea me too, externals are not an option for me. Weightbearing is really important, true.

Idk too much about cross lengthening I think it's weird too.

Depending on what you wanna do in life you can get away with more or less tbh. Not being able to do any sport is not worth it but not everyone has or wants to be an athlete.

Yea 14cm in 2 LLs is fine if you are a good case.
You gotta roll the dice and pray though because with any doctor and regardless of your amount you can end up in a casket. It's the truth, there is always an unpredictable risk that when you catch it. Bingo!
You really have to be down for LL and nothing to lose in a way because it is major massive and dangerous in and of itself (obviously tripled if you go to indian butchers or so).

Yes, true. I read some diaries and also some patient stories (some from lee) that some patients wanted 10-12 and when they got 6cm they said that was okay, and some wanted only 4 and endend up with 8. I think everyone wants the maximum, including myself. But you need to be conservative and do the maximum with safety, 14cm is already HUGE, getting problems for only 2cm more to be 16cm, it's not worth. But if you can get 16 with the same safety as 14cm, go ahead.

I think CLL with stryde is almost a nobel thing. It's a huge technology, stem cells will take years. So Stryde is the thing now.

Just set a range of goals imo. In the end it will not matter if you got 13, 14, 15 or 16cm but rather that you did it.

Keep in mind, already LLS is shown to be stem cell growth. Not normal bone repair. This was the conclusion of the Stanford Medicine study. To create this reaction without breaking the bone is far away, but on the horizon. Not like Alcubiere (science fiction).

what is LLS? Do you refer to that synovial loading thing?

[nightstar]

what is LLS? Do you refer to that synovial loading thing?

Limb Lengthening Surgery

[RealLostSoul]

Limb Lengthening Surgery

oh wow my bad lol. Had you wrote LL or LLs and I wouldn't have misread that *facepalm*.

I am not sure what you are referring to though. Probably that the callous stems from the periosteum. LL in and of itself is secondary bone repair though so nothing you can trigger without breaking the bone.

[Serilium]

The action of finally being able to change and take control in your life for something you once thought you were powerless for a long time- that is the most important thing people get out of LL. People want 8cm but even at 4cm they finally feel freedom and are apathetic to lengthening more, already gaining lifetimes worth of confidence and neurosis removal. This is the magic of LL, it's an amazing phenomenon. Being able to do something about something you originally thought was God's bad destiny for you.

[Future Skycraper]

Yea me too, externals are not an option for me. Weightbearing is really important, true.

Idk too much about cross lengthening I think it's weird too.

Depending on what you wanna do in life you can get away with more or less tbh. Not being able to do any sport is not worth it but not everyone has or wants to be an athlete.

Yea 14cm in 2 LLs is fine if you are a good case.
You gotta roll the dice and pray though because with any doctor and regardless of your amount you can end up in a casket. It's the truth, there is always an unpredictable risk that when you catch it. Bingo!
You really have to be down for LL and nothing to lose in a way because it is major massive and dangerous in and of itself (obviously tripled if you go to indian butchers or so).

Just set a range of goals imo. In the end it will not matter if you got 13, 14, 15 or 16cm but rather that you did it.
what is LLS? Do you refer to that synovial loading thing?

Exactly, and also the amoount of scars ewww

Gonna search about it today

Yeah, I'm good without intense sports, they screw you kneew and back overtime, even with good shoes. Just going to the gym, yoga and walking is fine to me, acctually thats the most healthy life style.

Thats good
I agree with you! But the better the doc, the less the risk, and also the healthier and prepared you're the less risk too!
That's my case, it's LL or nothing (*funeral music*), but would never do externals or average doctor, only docs like Paley and lee.



You're clever, just do it and pput you goal, the higher you aim, the higher your shoot will be, even if you miss it.

[Future Skycraper]

The action of finally being able to change and take control in your life for something you once thought you were powerless for a long time- that is the most important thing people get out of LL. People want 8cm but even at 4cm they finally feel freedom and are apathetic to lengthening more, already gaining lifetimes worth of confidence and neurosis removal. This is the magic of LL, it's an amazing phenomenon. Being able to do something about something you originally thought was God's bad destiny for you.

This is one of the best and true quotes I read here ever! *clap!**clap!**clap!**clap!**clap!*

[AllinStryde]

Just remember, doctors set limits for good reasons...so you don't lose function and range of motion.