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[chasing_higher_dream]

Thanks so much! How goes your recovery? I noticed my leg strength has returned remarkably.

My recovery is going on well. Just after 5-6 days post stopping lengthening, the tightness in my muscles has reduced by roughly 40-50%. Also, sleep is way better now.
In terms of leg strength, I did not see much of a difference yet. I will be starting strength training exercises for my leg from the start of October to build back the lost strength and almost non-existent leg muscles.
Also, I have started to gradually phase out pain killers, muscle relaxants and blood thinner tablets. Since then, I have noticed that I am having some knee pain in my left leg when I walk with full weight-bearing. I assume I did not realize about this pain till now, since pain killers were doing their job well.
The path to recovery is a slow and gradual process, so I am keeping my expectations low.

[SirStretchAlot]

My recovery is going on well. Just after 5-6 days post stopping lengthening, the tightness in my muscles has reduced by roughly 40-50%. Also, sleep is way better now.
In terms of leg strength, I did not see much of a difference yet. I will be starting strength training exercises for my leg from the start of October to build back the lost strength and almost non-existent leg muscles.
Also, I have started to gradually phase out pain killers, muscle relaxants and blood thinner tablets. Since then, I have noticed that I am having some knee pain in my left leg when I walk with full weight-bearing. I assume I did not realize about this pain till now, since pain killers were doing their job well.
The path to recovery is a slow and gradual process, so I am keeping my expectations low.

Fabulous about getting more sleep. I've noticed the same. I think if you tried to walk more, the strength will return by themselves. It's really the glutes that need strength training if you have a strange gait.

Oh by the way, do you have an anterior hip tilt (duck ass)? I have one when I narrow my legs and it is difficult to stretch. How would you stretch yours out?

[chasing_higher_dream]

Fabulous about getting more sleep. I've noticed the same. I think if you tried to walk more, the strength will return by themselves. It's really the glutes that need strength training if you have a strange gait.

Oh by the way, do you have an anterior hip tilt (duck ass)? I have one when I narrow my legs and it is difficult to stretch. How would you stretch yours out?

Yes, I am trying to walk as much as I can, as it would also help in bone consolidation.

Luckily, I do not have any duck ass. Throughout the lengthening journey, for hip flexors, I did either of the below stretches:
1. Kneeling hip flexor stretch with help of Wall bars (image link) - This was my primary stretch for hip flexors.
2. Standing hip flexor stretch (image link) - Crutches can also be used when you are leaning forward to be safer.

I presume because of these stretches I did not develop any duckass.

[SirStretchAlot]

@chasing_higher_dream
Thanks! I've been doing those stretches and they seem to be quite effective. Another one I did is simply lie on my chest with my legs closed. Compressing my butt downwards seem to cause a lot of pain/stretching on the legs, which I assume means it's working.

Post-lengthening Week 1
Hey guys, it's been a week since I ended lengthening. Overall I see minor improvements on discomfort/sleep, duckass/wide leg, and strength. However, the pace of recovery is slower than I expected. My duck ass is especially severe, but am working on it!

[I want 8,07 cm]

congratulations for everything you have been achieving.  You have been brave but in the end it seems that everything has been worth it.  I see that your experience has gone through many difficulties in just 4 and a half months and I wonder if many of Dr. Betz's patients went through the same thing.  I am almost 100% sure that within two years I will undergo a leg lengthening process but I am still hesitating between Dr Betz or Halil Buldu from Turkey.  I live in the Netherlands so dr Betz could be a better option in terms of location.  I really appreciate your information as it has given me a general idea of ​​the lengthening process.

[Roger1300]

Hey man, congrats on the 10 cm ! I'm scheduled for surgery this winter with Betz and I hope to be as successful as you :-)

I have one question for you (and also for other people who lengthened):

Pre-op, what are the most important muscles to strengthen ?
ie: what muscle did lose the most strength after the operation ? And what muscle you wish would have more strong right now ?
What weak muscles are preventing you from having a normal gait?

Thx

[SirStretchAlot]

@I want 8,07 cm
Betz and Buldu really can't be any more different. Betz uses Betzbone and doesn't do ITB release, while Buldu uses Precise and does ITB release. However, they are both known to provide little aftercare. I believe Giotikas is probably a stronger choice, as he does both Precise and Gnail, and isn't that much more expensive than Buldu. Since you're a European citizen, I'd also probably just stay in Europe (Betz/Giotikas), as your insurance will probably cover more and you have more legal recourse should things go wrong.

@Roger1300
Thanks. I wouldn't consider myself a success yet, haha. Maybe after when my walking completely recovers
1) Strengthening muscles pre-op is pointless as more muscles means less flexibility, and more muscles to stretch.
2) Glutes are the main muscles you lose through lengthening and what will affect your gait. However, you will lose them regardless, so I'd focus much more on stretching your hip flexors, quads, hamstrings and ITB pre-surgery.

[SirStretchAlot]

Recovery Week 2

Hey guys, the second week has been so much better!

1) Significant leg strength recovery. I can now stand for significant amount of time and walk 50% more before tiring.

2) Stretching progress has been slower. While the legs can narrow almost completely, the duckass has only improved a moderate amount.

Now that I've stretched my legs into a better shape, I will likely move to targeted glute strength training so I can stop swinging when I walk.

[SirStretchAlot]

Recovery Week 3

1) Steady progress. Legs narrowed. Discomfort reduced. Can stand-up from chairs without arm assistance, though still a struggle.

2) Duckass or anterior pelvis tilt is still apparent, especially when legs are closed. Trying various hip flexor stretches and glute strengthening exercises. I see some result, but it is very slow. In retrospect, I should have stretched harder during lengthening so it would not have progressed to this stage.

[Antonio111111]

Wow congrats on 10 cm man! Can you show us video of your walking gait?

Did 10 cm alter your squating motion?

How much percentage do you think you lost in sprinting speed?

Thanks!

[Roger1300]

thanks for the update and congrats on the recovery. I'm pretty sure that the strength of your glutes (both medium and long) is as important as the flexibility of your hip flexors to prevent duck ass...

btw, people: my surgery with Dr. Betz is scheduled at the very beginning of December.
If anyone has a date with Betz before December and wants to switch with me, I'm open to it! DM me.

[KillerShark]

Reading through this diary just gave me confirmation bias that Dr. Betz is either too old to be conducting this procedure or just flat out does not care about his patients at all. The man is like 70 or 71 for Christ sake. His earlier reports have been good but he’s been on the downhill slope for the past year. You claim to have gone through (3!!!!?) surgeries total? Along with that what kind of doctor that cares about his patients allows them to lengthen 10cm with a 12cm max? You said after you left Germany he stopped responding to your messages? Marvelous. As of rn I have looked into manhoubian, giotikas, or even Paley as the main players that everyone has to go to right now, if any of these doctors have bad reports link me please I’d like to read them. But I’m sorry man you went through hell and back and I commend your perseverance through all the pain.

[SirStretchAlot]

@Antonio111111
I'll probably record something once I'm better, but right now my gait is still noticeably abnormal.

@Roger1300
So after a full doctor checkup, it was determined that my anterior pelvis tilt (duck ass) was due to tight TFL muscles, not hip flexors, as most people would presume. What this means is that you should definitely have your IT band released, or risk major deformities later on.

@KillerShark
I believe Betz is just too busy to worry about patient after care. My left leg feels slightly mechanically loose/shaky when I pivot on it. I'd say Giotikas or Payley would be great bets. I have not read much about Manhoubian.

Recovery Week 5
Hi guys, sorry I've skipped out for 2 weeks. Have just started work in another city, and had to settle a lot of admin. Regardless going forward, as changes become incremental, I think my updates will become less frequent, until my gait completely recovers.

1) The great news is that my leg strength has almost completely recovered. I can walk for up to 20 minutes quickly without much fatigue. I remember struggling with 10 minutes during the last few weeks of lengthening. Your strength will return quite quickly after lengthening stops.

2) Widelegs/duckass are still here, manifesting in the form of a very ugly anterior pelvis tilt. As I mentioned to Roger1300, this is due to very tight TFLs, that are difficult to target-stretch. This is  compounded by the fact that I lengthened 10cm. My physiotherapist assured me that I will return back to normal eventually, but most likely by the end of the 7th month post-op (I'm on my 6th).

Hence I would like to ask everyone to not underestimate your recovery time. Expect at least 5-7 months of recovery time depending no your age and lengthening goal. Plan your life around it.

[BetzLandLiberator]

So after a full doctor checkup, it was determined that my anterior pelvis tilt (duck ass) was due to tight TFL muscles, not hip flexors, as most people would presume. What this means is that you should definitely have your IT band released, or risk major deformities later on.

I disagree. The majority of Betz patients do not do IT band release and we are fine. I'm fine 9 years later after 9,5cm.
What most Doctors that do IT band release don't tell you is that your IT band won't ever be as strong again if you release it and this can give you knee problems later.

You had your surgery with Betz, then follow his advice which is to not do IT band release unless you're an extreme case.

[SirStretchAlot]

I disagree. The majority of Betz patients do not do IT band release and we are fine. I'm fine 9 years later after 9,5cm.
What most Doctors that do IT band release don't tell you is that your IT band won't ever be as strong again if you release it and this can give you knee problems later.

You had your surgery with Betz, then follow his advice which is to not do IT band release unless you're an extreme case.

I did my ITB release seperately with Giotikas. I've advocated for it so much that Betz is now making exceptions for patients who want it done.

Tight ITB is actually the usual cause for knee problems. In fact most atheletes with tight bands eventually get them released when physio fails.

Remember, the TFL is only 15cm long. Stretching it by 10cm or 66% of its original length will have severe reprocussions when it's injured.

Cutting the ITB saved me 2-3cm of TFL lengthening. You're essentially trading the safety of your fibrous tissues (ITB), for an actual soft tissues (TFL). I'd make that trade any day. Betz is the only one who doesn't perform ITB, and even that is changing.

[BetzLandLiberator]

I did my ITB release seperately with Giotikas. I've advocated for it so much that Betz is now making exceptions for patients who want it done.

Tight ITB is actually the usual cause for knee problems. In fact most atheletes with tight bands eventually get them released when physio fails.

Remember, the TFL is only 15cm long. Stretching it by 10cm or 66% of its original length will have severe reprocussions when it's injured.

Cutting the ITB saved me 2-3cm of TFL lengthening. You're essentially trading the safety of your fibrous tissues (ITB), for an actual soft tissues (TFL). I'd make that trade any day. Betz is the only one who doesn't perform ITB, and even that is changing.

Yes, Tight ITB band can cause knee problems, but a harmed/weak IT band can cause problems too. There are tons of papers about that. Just google it.

You were just impatient and harmed your body for no reason, unlike dozens of other Betz patients who took their time and went back to normal without IT band release.

[KillerShark]

I disagree. The majority of Betz patients do not do IT band release and we are fine. I'm fine 9 years later after 9,5cm.
What most Doctors that do IT band release don't tell you is that your IT band won't ever be as strong again if you release it and this can give you knee problems later.

You had your surgery with Betz, then follow his advice which is to not do IT band release unless you're an extreme case.

It’s insane how “being busy” is an excuse to not check up on your patient in which you mangled his legs with 2 surgeries. You could have been left with lifelong pain, I just think betz only cares about 1 thing and 1 thing only: money. He took your money and did not follow up, he’s old and should be retired but he’s preying off people like us with mental illness, along with allowing you to get 10CM!!!!!! 10 CM bro. Your legs are gonna most likely recover at 75% 3 years post op, no real doctor would allow that, no way in fk all paley, mahb or even giotikas would allow that medical malpractice to occur. I do not hate any doctor in any way, but just from this journal and other journals in the last year, it seems Betz just stopped giving 2  s and an Indian doctor doing LON would do a better job than he aims to do.

[LegendKiller]

Lol just because SOME patients lengthened a lot and didn't have ITB issues doesn't mean that in most cases it's not absolutely required! Why would you let patients potentially run around with duckass deformity and wide legs for months and months on end? what good does that do?do you know what kind of chain reaction running around like that is produced in your body? Instead of doing a very simple procedure upfront that prevents all of that bull  youre basically playing Russian roulette with them and give them potential disabilities that keeps them from walking permanently if not addressed later on in another surgery. Betz is against releases and has No valid reason to show for that. "not wanting to harm healthy tissue" is pointless when that "healthy" tissue is producing major deformities during and after lengthing. Even a child would understand that concept. Reading through diaries on this forum clearly shows how many patients got this problem and how careless he reacted to most of them. But I guess all these patients are wrong and just "aren't doing enough PT" or even funnier "don't stretch out their ITB enough" right? But hey at the same time they are gladly allowed to lengthen 8,9,10,11cm right?
Ehh....

[Limblengtheningwarrior]

Dear buddy,

I booked my surgery with Dr.Betz in Jan 2022. So with regards to the tight IT bands, intensive physio sessions and stretching won't solve out the problem when it comes to the IT band tightness?" Did Dr.Betz tell you other ways to get rid of it other than doing IT band release surgery? (I know that he refuses to do the extra surgery for IT band release).

[LegendKiller]

Dear buddy,

I booked my surgery with Dr.Betz in Jan 2022. So with regards to the tight IT bands, intensive physio sessions and stretching won't solve out the problem when it comes to the IT band tightness?" Did Dr.Betz tell you other ways to get rid of it other than doing IT band release surgery? (I know that he refuses to do the extra surgery for IT band release).

Well it depends on how much you will lengthen but in general the ITB is known to be Ver very stubborn to stretching hence why most well known docs do an ITB release profilactically, if you want to lengthen a certain amount.
Betz always tells his patients with ITB problems to do more PT or train harder which is straight up insane considering how many of his patients suffer with these issues and they can't do anything about it except go for a release surgery later on. He didn't tell me anything about potential ITB issues upfront and when I told him about the problem via WhatsApp he straight up ignored me.
I'm 4 months into consolidation, wasn't able to walk one step unassisted due to this issue until I had my release surgery on monday. Today I was walking outside WITHOUT crutches for the first time so since the surgery on Monday I made more progress than the past 7 months with the tight ITB hindering my walking gait. GO Figure. makes me angry when people on here downplay this as if it's not that important or it's just something you can "stretch out" like a muscle. IT'S NOT THE SAME AT All.
Who wants to lengthen for 3 months and do up to 1 year of daily intense PT on your itb just to be able to (maybe!) walk again?this is totally unnecessary suffering that could easily be prevented and betz has NO valid reason to not lengthen the ITB, a lot of his patients suffer from duckass/wide legs and he straight up ignores them or even worse blames them for the issue.
Hope that answers your question.

[LU213]

I have an email from Dr. Betz's wife where I write in detail about the complaints on ITB release and she says, if you want it released, just ask for it and he will do it no problem.  When I consulted with him, he said it's unnecessary but he will do it if you request it prior to the surgery.  I believe this is new and he didn't do this before.

[LegendKiller]

I have an email from Dr. Betz's wife where I write in detail about the complaints on ITB release and she says, if you want it released, just ask for it and he will do it no problem.  When I consulted with him, he said it's unnecessary but he will do it if you request it prior to the surgery.  I believe this is new and he didn't do this before.

Ah okay interesting. but still... Him saying it's "unnecessary" is a flat out lie.I mean HE should guide his patients regarding that based on how much length they want to go for, not leave the choice up to unexperienced potential patients and let them decide, after all he is the expert and he needs to know when a release is necessary and when it's maybe optional. Damn,so backwards. I really liked betz at first but his behavior as a surgeon is straight up shady and dishonest in a way.

[DonBones]

Well it depends on how much you will lengthen but in general the ITB is known to be Ver very stubborn to stretching hence why most well known docs do an ITB release profilactically, if you want to lengthen a certain amount.
Betz always tells his patients with ITB problems to do more PT or train harder which is straight up insane considering how many of his patients suffer with these issues and they can't do anything about it except go for a release surgery later on. He didn't tell me anything about potential ITB issues upfront and when I told him about the problem via WhatsApp he straight up ignored me.
I'm 4 months into consolidation, wasn't able to walk one step unassisted due to this issue until I had my release surgery on monday. Today I was walking outside WITHOUT crutches for the first time so since the surgery on Monday I made more progress than the past 7 months with the tight ITB hindering my walking gait. GO Figure. makes me angry when people on here downplay this as if it's not that important or it's just something you can "stretch out" like a muscle. IT'S NOT THE SAME AT All.
Who wants to lengthen for 3 months and do up to 1 year of daily intense PT on your itb just to be able to (maybe!) walk again?this is totally unnecessary suffering that could easily be prevented and betz has NO valid reason to not lengthen the ITB, a lot of his patients suffer from duckass/wide legs and he straight up ignores them or even worse blames them for the issue.
Hope that answers your question.

I am more conservative than you of course but I had no wide legs. Like none whatsoever. Therefore I am glad Betz didn't cut any more of my soft tissue than needed, and so I agree with him that ITB release needs to be specifically requested by whoever wants / needs it, and definitely shouldn't be the default course of action. So yeah, there are different points of view

Good luck!

[BetzLandLiberator]

I did 10cm and I didn't need IT band release. Most Betz patients don't need it. He's correct in not suggesting this for the majority of patients. It's always better to not have unnecessary extra surgeries.

Legendkiiller stop generalizing - your case is not the norm for most Betz patients, including the ones that did 9cm or 10cm. You needed IT band release, most of his patients don't.

[LegendKiller]

I did 10cm and I didn't need IT band release. Most Betz patients don't need it. He's correct in not suggesting this for the majority of patients. It's always better to not have unnecessary extra surgeries.

Legendkiiller stop generalizing - your case is not the norm for most Betz patients, including the ones that did 9cm or 10cm. You needed IT band release, most of his patients don't.

LOL that not true at all. It's not like I was one only case needing it, some don't but a lot of people do and that's why he's unprofessional in letting THEM decide now whether or not they want to have that done. He should tell them based on their goals and their individual flexibility! He didn't even tell me about that potential issue during the consultation or after at all! Not one word. When I told him about me having wide legs and itb issues even months after lengthing asking him for a release he simply ignored me and one time even told me to "stop texting me because he had other clients to answer". You think that is professional?? I paid him 52K and he couldn't even respond to texts and basically told me to not write him anymore.
I talked to other people and a buddy of mine who had surgery on the same date and he also ghosted them later on. You talk about me generalizing but that blind betz statement "it's not needed/unnecessary" is a slap in the face for every patient who needed it later on and we'll you should read a few diaries or talk to a few people outside and you'll find out that quite a lot of people had these issues and had it fixed later on. Get out of your bubble just because YOU didn't need it. You were lucky then.
Defend him all you want but even aside all of that his behavior as a surgeon and his noncare afterwards is something potential patients need to know about because it's really a shame and sadly quite "the norm.".
Btw: didn't you have surgery with him like 9 or 10 years ago? he might have been different then with keeping up with clients when he was a little younger but right now it's totally gone downhill. You can't tell people who paid you over 50k for surgery to shut up and ignore their issues. I really hope that's at least a point we both agree on dude!

[SirStretchAlot]

Hey guys, sorry for the lack of updates. Work has been consuming. I thought it's time for a big update considering it has been over 7 months.

1) I can now walk for about 20 minutes at a normal pace, twice a day without crutches.

2) My gait has improved significantly, in that I think it will be unnoticible within a month time.

3)
i)  I still have duckass, or anterior pelvis tilt. Narrowing my legs makes the tilt more severe. My back is sore after long walks as it tries to curve backward, in an attempt to compensate for my hip tilting backwards.
ii) While BetzLandLiberator and DonBones have never had a problem with it, myself and LegendKiller suffer greatly from it. I think it is also somewhat correlated with knee pain while clicking.
iii) I have been doing many quad and hip flexor stretching exercises, but they have not been effective in combating my duckass. Emails to Betz/Danielle have been met with "just do the stretches on the package." At this point, I wonder if my pelvis will ever be put back into shape. Does anyone else have good recommendations for good stretches against anterior pelvis tilt / duckass?

Thanks!

[thankscience]

Do you think if you lengthened, say, 2cm less you would not have as severe duckass?

[Roger1300]

to fight duck ass, I think stretching hip flexors is important but even more so is to have strong glutes. Both gluteus medium and Maximus. When you contract them, they are the muscles that get your pelvis from anteriorly tilted to normal position. If your glutes are very strong, your gait will be straight without anterior tilt.

[SirStretchAlot]

@thankscience
Lengthening less always helps. I think everyone will eventually stretch back in place, but the last 2cm, especially the last 0.5cm really complicated the healing process

@Roger1300
Yeah, I've seen many explainations online about it being short hip flexors and/or weak glutes. However, when I do contract my glutes, my TFL or the side of my pelvis, connected to my ITB is clearly blocking the hip-forward motion. The cause of the tilt is ITB for LLers, which is different for normal people who sit too much.

[thankscience]

Did you contact Giotikas to see what he recommends for this issue? Hope your recovery is going well now!

[LegendKiller]

Hey guys, sorry for the lack of updates. Work has been consuming. I thought it's time for a big update considering it has been over 7 months.

1) I can now walk for about 20 minutes at a normal pace, twice a day without crutches.

2) My gait has improved significantly, in that I think it will be unnoticible within a month time.

3)
i)  I still have duckass, or anterior pelvis tilt. Narrowing my legs makes the tilt more severe. My back is sore after long walks as it tries to curve backward, in an attempt to compensate for my hip tilting backwards.
ii) While BetzLandLiberator and DonBones have never had a problem with it, myself and LegendKiller suffer greatly from it. I think it is also somewhat correlated with knee pain while clicking.
iii) I have been doing many quad and hip flexor stretching exercises, but they have not been effective in combating my duckass. Emails to Betz/Danielle have been met with "just do the stretches on the package." At this point, I wonder if my pelvis will ever be put back into shape. Does anyone else have good recommendations for good stretches against anterior pelvis tilt / duckass?

Thanks!

Hey man I just read this and since you mentioned my name I Wanted to share a few points on here. As you probably know I had pretty severe ITB and wide legs issues as well, even 5-6 months post finished lengthing. Betz simply ignored my issues and didn't help at all. I finally made my own choice and got my ITB released in November with another surgeon. It made a huge difference in my recovery and as of right now I'm back to walking normally without any wide legs or duckass. I want to make it crystal clear that without and ITB release now almost 1 year after LL surgery I would still be suffering with wide legs and duckass/Anterior pelvic tilt. My ITB simply failed to get accustomed to my lengthing process and I'm pretty sure that would NOT have changed significantly on its own. There's a reason why almost all surgeons do an release, especially with the lengthing amounts betz allows his patients to do. It blows my mind that he simply doesn't do it and then leaves his patients to their own devices. Maybe some of them are lucky and don't need it but at least he should offer it for patients like me and maybe you who do indeed need to get their ITB lengthened in order to not walk like an idiot for months and months on end. Not to mention all the joint and muscular issues that come from walking with wide legs and duckass for that long.
So IMO if you waited for months post lengthing and issues still prevail you should think about a release rather than wasting more time on stretches, of course stretching is super important but it won't cut it when it comes to these ITB issues. Watching myself being able to walk normally a few weeks post release was eye opening in how important It is for recovering your gait and making atequare progress like you should.