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[..]

I made a mistake in the past and now I am paying for it for the rest of my life. I keep thinking that what I did was unforgiveable.

[TemakiSushi]

You are still young and have time to save money for much safer LL
Seems you are getting sicker than the last year I’m worried

[Bruno Mars]

What did you do?

[Sanity]

I did the same, but now there is no recompense for that, I did LL but it still cannot give me what I couldve gotten from natural growth ofcoarse. You see the natural growth is very proportional. I did about 2.2inches ll and i believe I lost around 2.5-3inches in my growing years definetely. Loosing more than that doesn't make sense to me because my genetic potential was around 5'11 max anyways but i ended up 5'8.

I did gain back through ll and its unproportional(concentrated in lower limbs) but hey atleast it got me taller. The main culprits during the puberty years and throughout teenage were 4 factors. Mediocre Nutrition, Poor sleep, minimal exercises and stressful environment. Stress and nutrition has the biggest role, it basically suppresses the testosterone levels by producing more cortisol. And lower T-levels mean lower bone growth because lower growth hormones factors influenced.

The biggest regret is missing out on natural growth. yea ll may have given me back 80% of my missed vertical growth but thats the thing, growth energy isnt all targeted at height only. the hormones/energy is utilized for lengthening arms, fingers, feet, spine, clavicle, shoulders, ribcage everything at the same time and height is just a part of it. so basically it just grows the whole frame proportionally, even growing facial bones and improving the facial symmetry and aesthetics. It growns the organs, brains, hearts etc aswell. its not overhauled.

Loosing 2-3 inches may not sound much, but considering its a result of loosing bone/muscle mass proportionally throughout the human frame, not just the vertical length of bones. Its like a 10 year old boy vs a 25y old man. he aint just taller but bigger overall.

gaining back something from cll be it unproportional atleast mends the wound caused by missed growth during teenage based on genetic potential. thts y i always advice growing youngsters to not make the same mistakes.

What you said is deep and profound u might or might not've realised. Forgiving is really difficult, but you must forgive yourself and accept this fate. I forgave myself long ago i remember even before i ever planned on cll but now even after cll, sometimes, the past still haunts me. But what is the only recompense is I pour this knowledge to the teenagers who matter to me and save them especially in this electronic and stressful era. The regrets grow less on me every year and I accept who I am.

[IwannaBeTaller]

...

Do you actually have solid indication that you've stunted your growth by 2.5-3 inches, other than just your feeling? I'm talking about stuff like pediatrician's growth charts. Eating little is not a proof you've stunted your growth, I was long convinced I did stunt my growth until I went to my old pediatrician and he showed me my growth chart. At 2 years I was half my current height, if you multiply a child's height at 2 years by 2, you get a good prediction of their adult height.

[Sanity]

Lol r u kidding me. Is it a trol. Ive seen kids who were tiny during childhood, who grew to be 6'6-6'7 giants. Most of their growth came during puberty. Wth u talking abt. Those ppl must be 4 times smaller when they were at 2. Lol

[IwannaBeTaller]

Outliers always exist, but usually, tall children become tall adults and short children do not become tall adults. Look at Trump's son, he was very tall for a 10 year old kid, when he was 10, and he's going to be a very tall adult. Taking a kid's height at 2 and doubling it a well-known  method for predicting height for pediatricians. Source

Do you have access to your growth charts, Sanity?

[..]

I did the same, but now there is no recompense for that, I did LL but it still cannot give me what I couldve gotten from natural growth ofcoarse. You see the natural growth is very proportional. I did about 2.2inches ll and i believe I lost around 2.5-3inches in my growing years definetely. Loosing more than that doesn't make sense to me because my genetic potential was around 5'11 max anyways but i ended up 5'8.

I did gain back through ll and its unproportional(concentrated in lower limbs) but hey atleast it got me taller. The main culprits during the puberty years and throughout teenage were 4 factors. Mediocre Nutrition, Poor sleep, minimal exercises and stressful environment. Stress and nutrition has the biggest role, it basically suppresses the testosterone levels by producing more cortisol. And lower T-levels mean lower bone growth because lower growth hormones factors influenced.

The biggest regret is missing out on natural growth. yea ll may have given me back 80% of my missed vertical growth but thats the thing, growth energy isnt all targeted at height only. the hormones/energy is utilized for lengthening arms, fingers, feet, spine, clavicle, shoulders, ribcage everything at the same time and height is just a part of it. so basically it just grows the whole frame proportionally, even growing facial bones and improving the facial symmetry and aesthetics. It growns the organs, brains, hearts etc aswell. its not overhauled.

Loosing 2-3 inches may not sound much, but considering its a result of loosing bone/muscle mass proportionally throughout the human frame, not just the vertical length of bones. Its like a 10 year old boy vs a 25y old man. he aint just taller but bigger overall.

gaining back something from cll be it unproportional atleast mends the wound caused by missed growth during teenage based on genetic potential. thts y i always advice growing youngsters to not make the same mistakes.

What you said is deep and profound u might or might not've realised. Forgiving is really difficult, but you must forgive yourself and accept this fate. I forgave myself long ago i remember even before i ever planned on cll but now even after cll, sometimes, the past still haunts me. But what is the only recompense is I pour this knowledge to the teenagers who matter to me and save them especially in this electronic and stressful era. The regrets grow less on me every year and I accept who I am.

You're wrong. Losing 2-3" is a world difference. That's about how much people are willing to through ridiculous surgery like LL for.

I would regret so much even if I only lost 1" (not that I'm suggesting I only lost 1")

It has been 10 years for me. And my anger just keeps cultivating.

[soitchi]

How does one figure out what height they were supposed to be? Is there a formula or something for it that we know to correctly calculate it with high accuracy?

[..]

How does one figure out what height they were supposed to be? Is there a formula or something for it that we know to correctly calculate it with high accuracy?

The question is not "How do you know that you stunted your growth?" but "How do you know that you didn't?

All I know is that the things I did (which I could have not done) could stunt my height and there's no scientist that I can invalidate it and that's good enough for me.

[soitchi]

The question is not "How do you know that you stunted your growth?" but "How do you know that you didn't?

All I know is that the things I did (which I could have not done) could stunt my height and there's no scientist that I can invalidate it and that's good enough for me.

But I never asked that. If you believe your height was stunted, that would mean you know what height you were supposed to be which is what is what I'm asking.

Imagine being asked "how do you know that you're not gay?" and having to provide evidence that you're not, because I don't care what you say, you're gay until you prove otherwise. That's not the way it works, someone makes a claim, they have to back it up, burden of proof is on you to prove that you stunted your height. So, exactly how tall were you suppose to be? If you can't answer that then you don't obviously don't truly believe your height was stunted. Also don't just throw out a number, also provide the details, research and whatever else is required on how you came to your conclusion. It wouldn't require scientists or doctors to invalidate your claims if your reasoning fails to have logic.

[..]

But I never asked that. If you believe your height was stunted, that would mean you know what height you were supposed to be which is what is what I'm asking.

Imagine being asked "how do you know that you're not gay?" and having to provide evidence that you're not, because I don't care what you say, you're gay until you prove otherwise. That's not the way it works, someone makes a claim, they have to back it up, burden of proof is on you to prove that you stunted your height. So, exactly how tall were you suppose to be? If you can't answer that then you don't obviously don't truly believe your height was stunted. Also don't just throw out a number, also provide the details, research and whatever else is required on how you came to your conclusion. It wouldn't require scientists or doctors to invalidate your claims if your reasoning fails to have logic.

I don't know the exact number, but taller than now.

But as you wish.

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/how-much-of-human-height/

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0021755718310192

https://kidshealth.org/en/teens/sleep-growth.html

https://www.parentune.com/parent-blog/how-does-sleep-deprivation-impact-your-childs-growth/4633

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/sleep-deprivation_b_3536674

[Sanity]

I don't know the exact number, but taller than now.

But as you wish.

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/how-much-of-human-height/

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0021755718310192

https://kidshealth.org/en/teens/sleep-growth.html

https://www.parentune.com/parent-blog/how-does-sleep-deprivation-impact-your-childs-growth/4633

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/sleep-deprivation_b_3536674

the 1st one says 20% of anything over average is nutrition so basically average would be around 5'9-5'10 so if ur 5'8 so its 5cm and and 20% of 5cm is  1cm. So according to this lost amount is only 1cm and u need not worry.

another 1 of the research article says actually sleep deficiency has nothing to do with height or at the least there ar'nt any studies that state that. thts the only ncbi/nih research uve shown the one tht says isnt really a scienmtific research just a claim by somone.

I want to know is there a proper scientific research on this things like they have on diseases and stuff. just curious.

[soitchi]

I don't know the exact number, but taller than now.

But as you wish.

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/how-much-of-human-height/

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0021755718310192

https://kidshealth.org/en/teens/sleep-growth.html

https://www.parentune.com/parent-blog/how-does-sleep-deprivation-impact-your-childs-growth/4633

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/sleep-deprivation_b_3536674

By taller than now, that could mean a fraction of a fraction of a centimeter which would practically make no difference. In fact let's go back to the same reasoning and way of asking a question you presented, what if you were asked "how do you know you didn't have excessive growth?" and had to prove that statement wrong? As far as anyone's concerned, they may as well believe you were suppose to be 4'10 but you managed to grow up to 5'5 and nothing you can say can invalidate that.

Also those articles shows zero empirical data and not a single one conclusively and explicitly states height would be stunted in the scenarios presented and one even goes to say and I quote, "However, more evidence is needed to establish an association between insufficient sleep duration and height growth deficit."

[Sanity]

Outliers always exist, but usually, tall children become tall adults and short children do not become tall adults. Look at Trump's son, he was very tall for a 10 year old kid, when he was 10, and he's going to be a very tall adult. Taking a kid's height at 2 and doubling it a well-known  method for predicting height for pediatricians. Source

Do you have access to your growth charts, Sanity?

honestly no man i dont have access to that. but according to the calculations based on my genetic height (parental height) ive lost around atleast 2inches if not more. also that is comparing to all my relatives in my gene pool.  also i was the one of the tallest kids in my grades for quite a while during my childhood if that helps u with the growth prediction thing. the growth slowed down from 13-16 the years when it was all bad.

[wants2growtaller]

I did the same, but now there is no recompense for that, I did LL but it still cannot give me what I couldve gotten from natural growth ofcoarse. You see the natural growth is very proportional. I did about 2.2inches ll and i believe I lost around 2.5-3inches in my growing years definetely. Loosing more than that doesn't make sense to me because my genetic potential was around 5'11 max anyways but i ended up 5'8.

I did gain back through ll and its unproportional(concentrated in lower limbs) but hey atleast it got me taller. The main culprits during the puberty years and throughout teenage were 4 factors. Mediocre Nutrition, Poor sleep, minimal exercises and stressful environment. Stress and nutrition has the biggest role, it basically suppresses the testosterone levels by producing more cortisol. And lower T-levels mean lower bone growth because lower growth hormones factors influenced.

The biggest regret is missing out on natural growth. yea ll may have given me back 80% of my missed vertical growth but thats the thing, growth energy isnt all targeted at height only. the hormones/energy is utilized for lengthening arms, fingers, feet, spine, clavicle, shoulders, ribcage everything at the same time and height is just a part of it. so basically it just grows the whole frame proportionally, even growing facial bones and improving the facial symmetry and aesthetics. It growns the organs, brains, hearts etc aswell. its not overhauled.

Loosing 2-3 inches may not sound much, but considering its a result of loosing bone/muscle mass proportionally throughout the human frame, not just the vertical length of bones. Its like a 10 year old boy vs a 25y old man. he aint just taller but bigger overall.

gaining back something from cll be it unproportional atleast mends the wound caused by missed growth during teenage based on genetic potential. thts y i always advice growing youngsters to not make the same mistakes.

What you said is deep and profound u might or might not've realised. Forgiving is really difficult, but you must forgive yourself and accept this fate. I forgave myself long ago i remember even before i ever planned on cll but now even after cll, sometimes, the past still haunts me. But what is the only recompense is I pour this knowledge to the teenagers who matter to me and save them especially in this electronic and stressful era. The regrets grow less on me every year and I accept who I am.

I dont think short people should blame  feel shame for oerhaps stunting their height. How could have they know that heightism is such a big problem in the world. In fact its mostly ignored, and accepted. If shortadults would have know the prejudice they would face because of their short stature, they would have prevented. Plus.. i think that heightism has only been a major problem in the last decade. Before that it wasnt such a big deal.

[IwannaBeTaller]

honestly no man i dont have access to that. but according to the calculations based on my genetic height (parental height) ive lost around atleast 2inches if not more. also that is comparing to all my relatives in my gene pool.  also i was the one of the tallest kids in my grades for quite a while during my childhood if that helps u with the growth prediction thing. the growth slowed down from 13-16 the years when it was all bad.

I understand you. Naturally, we all compare ourselves to our parents and relatives. But keep in mind that calculating your predicted height based on your parents is not an errorproof method. Just think of kids with short parents who become tall, like a 5'8'' dad and a 5'4'' mom having a son who grows up to be 6'3''. His predicted height based on his parents would've been much lower, but he had genetics for a different adult height, so logically, there must also be some kids who are genetically destined to be shorter, even in perfect environments.

Just look at the Hemsworth brothers, Chris and Liam are 6'3'' yet their third brother is 5'9'', despite growing up in the same household with the same parents. He was most likely given the same food, experiened the same social circumstances and a similar amount of stress, but got a different set of genes. It's possible to experience situations that might be detrimental to your growth, but having tall parents or even a tall family are not proof that you stunted your growth. It's also not conclusive evidence of how much your growth was altered.

Being one of the taller kids at a certain age, and not being a tall adult might give you more indication, but that requires expertise I do not have. My doctor once told me if you don't cross certain percentile ranges over a short time, it's not an indication of affected growth (or something like it).

[Sanity]

I dont think short people should blame  feel shame for oerhaps stunting their height. How could have they know that heightism is such a big problem in the world. In fact its mostly ignored, and accepted. If shortadults would have know the prejudice they would face because of their short stature, they would have prevented. Plus.. i think that heightism has only been a major problem in the last decade. Before that it wasnt such a big deal.

yea i blame this sick media. always showing that taller equals more intelligent,smart, ethical, etc and every great and shorter equals everything bad and ugly that exists in the society. the media is brainwashing ppl to insanity.

[Sanity]

I understand you. Naturally, we all compare ourselves to our parents and relatives. But keep in mind that calculating your predicted height based on your parents is not an errorproof method. Just think of kids with short parents who become tall, like a 5'8'' dad and a 5'4'' mom having a son who grows up to be 6'3''. His predicted height based on his parents would've been much lower, but he had genetics for a different adult height, so logically, there must also be some kids who are genetically destined to be shorter, even in perfect environments.

Just look at the Hemsworth brothers, Chris and Liam are 6'3'' yet their third brother is 5'9'', despite growing up in the same household with the same parents. He was most likely given the same food, experiened the same social circumstances and a similar amount of stress, but got a different set of genes. It's possible to experience situations that might be detrimental to your growth, but having tall parents or even a tall family are not proof that you stunted your growth. It's also not conclusive evidence of how much your growth was altered.

Being one of the taller kids at a certain age, and not being a tall adult might give you more indication, but that requires expertise I do not have. My doctor once told me if you don't cross certain percentile ranges over a short time, it's not an indication of affected growth (or something like it).

if u look at their eyes they have very similar eyes but when u look at 3rd brothers eyes, u will see something doesn't add up. if u know wat i mean. so probably not a solid example yet still i get ur point man. but i think i personally did stunt atleast around 2 inches that i couldve gotten in very good conditions. although there is no way to prove it for me but then there is no solid way for any1 to prove it.

[wants2growtaller]

yea i blame this sick media. always showing that taller equals more intelligent,smart, ethical, etc and every great and shorter equals everything bad and ugly that exists in the society. the media is brainwashing ppl to insanity.

You are correct. Heightism is a big fking problem. But its only experienced and no one takes short people seriously when they talk about it . Its like a secret. Its a prejudice everyone does but doesnt wanna admit or talk about.

[IwannaBeTaller]

if u look at their eyes they have very similar eyes but when u look at 3rd brothers eyes, u will see something doesn't add up. if u know wat i mean. so probably not a solid example yet still i get ur point man. but i think i personally did stunt atleast around 2 inches that i couldve gotten in very good conditions. although there is no way to prove it for me but then there is no solid way for any1 to prove it.

So you're saying his mother cheated and had a kid with another man? Cut it out, you know as well as me that's nonsense.

[Sanity]

even if he is the real brother, we cant be perfectly sure the environmental factors were the same, its just best guess. and r there more such examples where we can explicitly identify that environmental factors were not variable. There was a study where twins separated at birth and one was taken into different country had a significant difference in the final height. Usually twins dont have much of a difference not even in face and that one really intrigued the researchers.

[soitchi]

even if he is the real brother, we cant be perfectly sure the environmental factors were the same, its just best guess. and r there more such examples where we can explicitly identify that environmental factors were not variable. There was a study where twins separated at birth and one was taken into different country had a significant difference in the final height. Usually twins dont have much of a difference not even in face and that one really intrigued the researchers.

Despite nothing is absolutely certain, that's still no excuse to make arguments from ignorance. If everyone were to entertain the least probable scenarios then everyone on this board should be prepared to be crippled or dead when going to do CLL before thinking they will lead regular healthy lives. Twins can look completely different or very similar including height, twins are just offspring produced by the same pregnancy, there's no rule where it says twins must look and act the exact same.

[YourSpaceBoyfriend]

Oh sweet LL Forum, u never change lol

[ZUCC420]

I was born premature in a δhit-hole country, so if anyone is justified to claim stunted height it's me.