Topic: Dr Xia & Dr Li (Beijing China) Institute of External Fixation Technology (Read 92003 times)

Muse · « **on:** October 05, 2013, 07:58:55 PM »

Here's the response and updated information from Beijing Institute of External Fixation Technology, headed by Dr Xia Hetao (Director) & Dr Roger Li (Honorary Consultant Surgeon).

Note: please refer to our disclaimer about The Doctors Directory
http://www.limblengtheningforum.com/index.php?topic=55.0

Pricing

From 1 November 2015, the package price is adjusted to 25,000 Euros for 5-8 cm lengthening and 4 months hospital stay (full boarding), with additional charges at 1500 Euros/per extra cm. We require a deposit of 5,000 Euros to be paid first to secure a place and a surgery.

The cost of our service package is 25,000 Euros includes a (up to) 5-8 cm inches lengthening on both tibiae or femurs, inclusive of all the first two surgeries (the first surgery to put external frame and nails and 2nd surgery for removing the external frame), treatments and hospitalization for the entire treatment period (up to 4 months, two people to share), high speed internet, new wheelchair, all medicine and walking aids, plus regular meal (restaurant meal at extra cost). If any complication occurs during the procedure while you are in our hospital, we guarantee to treat it free of charge till the complication is completely settled.

If you would like to do more than 8 cm and stay extra time after the 4 month period, than a rate at 1,500 Euros per cm will be charged. We provide English translators for international patients and there are many patients from US, Canada, Japan, Denmark, India, etc. in our hospital receiving treatment at present. If you want to do both tibiae and femurs lengthening, then, then two separate procedures will be taken and you need to wait at least 1 year in between to allow functional recovery of the limbs. The price will double as you need to pay for separate packages.

How to pay:

The package price (e.g. 25,000 Euros) needs to be paid in two installments. First you need to pay a deposit of 5,000 Euros to secure a place; then at your arrival in Beijing, you need to pay the rest of 20,000 Euros, at the time of admission. Payment can be done in cash, traveler checks or bank transfer. No credit card payment or personal check is accepted at present. We can send you our bank details for you to set up a bank transfer arrangement with your home banks and you can transfer the fund once you are in Beijing, just before the surgery.

Amount of Lengthening

In regard to the lengthening surgery, we usually lengthen the tibiae for cosmetic purposes, as most of people with short stature have relatively short tibiae, and the lengthening of tibiae will make them look more even. The surgery on tibiae is also relatively easy and risk free comparing to femurs (as there are a lot of muscles around it and special cares are needed to keep the patients comfortable during the lengthening). In most of cases, 8-10 (3-4 inches) cm tibial lengthening is sufficient to satisfy the needs.

Timeline For Recovery

The time for hospitalization would be around 4-5 months for 5-6 cm lengthening depending on your body's recovery ability. From 2014, we have developed a new method of osteotomy, in that the bone is cut in an oblique line using multiple pinholes. The new method of osteotomy has eliminated potential risk of non-union or poor bone formation, we have performed more than 50 cases, all are successful. After the planned lengthening (e.g. 8 cm) is achieved, the external fixator will be removed and at the same time your leg will be fixed by the internal fixator (intramedullary nail) through locking screws. A few weeks after the second surgery, you can return to work and be discharged from the hospital. At early stage of the first surgery and during the lengthening, you will need working aid to walk, but once the lengthening is finished and external fixator removed, then you can work free, but you should not do competitive sport for the next 12 months to allow bone to fully recover. You can go back to normal life with the internal nails for approx. 1 year, and then you may remove the nails (this is a simple procedure and you only need to stay in hospital for around 10 days after the nails being taken out). Added together, the total time needed for completion of the entire treatment would be around 12-16 months, but you can go back to work or normal life after 4-6 months, and resume full sport activities after 24 months.

There will be some scars along the pin tracts, which can be removed after the procedure if necessary by cosmetic surgery. We could do so at a cost of about 1,500 Euros for removing all the major scars at the time of removing the intramedullary nails on both legs. As far as the long term side effect is concerned, we did not predict any if the procedure is done correctly, as this is just like a fracture repair by tissue regeneration, we create a situation that stimulates your own growth potentials which has ceased early, so that we consider the LL procedure is a natural process, hence with less harmful consequences anticipated.

Our surgery team is headed and performed in person by Prof. He-Tao Xia, who is very experienced orthopaedic surgeon specialized in leg lengthening cosmetic surgery, who have carried out more than 1,800 cosmetic leg lengthening procedure with great success. Dr. Xia will explain everything clearly to patients, and we will sign an agreement with patient to clearly outline the responsibilities and risks of each party.

Summary of our clinical experience

Till now, we have performed leg lengthening surgery for more than 1,900 cases. Patients were from USA, Italy, Canada, Singapore, Hong Kong, Taiwan and all over China. Most of the patients are suffers of short stature and 80% of the patients have postgraduate degrees, aged between 14-52 years, (average age: 22.6 years). The height before surgery was between 117-175 cm (average 152 cm); the average increased height was 8.6 cm (3-33 cm). Among the patients, there are three cases of serious complications, bone nonunion 2 cases (1 case was caused by fast lengthening rate; another was due to diet problem, lack of nutrition), ankle joint deformity 1 case (the patient was 52 years old and has other medical conditions). All the three cases were treated by secondary surgery with satisfactory outcomes. Overall, 99% of the patients were very satisfied with the outcome of their treatment. At present, serious complications such as bone nonunion have been completely avoided by using Xia's leg-lengthening technique, only minor complications such as mild pinhole infection (in less than 0.5% patients) are occasionally seen and are dealt with easily.

It is not necessary to have a pre-surgery consultation and checks, as we can do this one go before the surgery when you are here in our hospital. Please check if you meet the conditions for cosmetic leg lengthening on our website: http://www.leg-lengthening.com/advice.html and if you are, then you can decide a time and book your flight and let me know in 2-3 weeks advance, then we can arrange your hospitalization and treatment accordingly, we can also assist with your visa application and arrange your airport pickup (these are all included in the price of the package). Of course, you can visit our hospital in Beijing first, to see in your own eyes and then decide from there. Please let me know if you need more information.

For Chinese visa, please go to nearest Chinese embassy to apply for a tourist visa, and it is easy to get and you can stay for up to 3 months. Once you are in China, we can help to extend the visa for you if needed. Once you got the visa and booked the flight, please let me know so that we can arrange airport pickup, your hospital stay and surgery time accordingly.

Many interesting patients would always request to have one to one telephone consultation or speak to our in-patient. Although we understand your feeling and concern, but it is not possible for us to give telephone consultation due to medical legal reason, and we have signed contract with every single patient that we are not in a position to dishcloth patient’s private information, let alone to allow strangers to talk to our patients. We have tried our best to address the frequently asked questions and these can be found at our website under FAQs and Answers. If you are still unsure and want to have a private visit prior to making up your mind, then you are welcome to visit our hospital for a one to one consultation with Dr. Xia and see the hospital facilities, and you may have a chance to talk to the patients in our hospital there. For such visit, the cost is 500 Euros including consultation with Dr. Xia and guided hospital tour. If you have decided to come to our hospital for a surgery within 3 months of the consultation, then the fee is refunded from the total package cost.

What kind of physical therapy is assigned or provided to the patient?

No special ones, patients shall do the walking following our instructions.

What maximum amount of lengthening do you recommend per segment, regarding patient safety? What is the daily rate of lengthening?

8 cm is pretty safe in our hand. The usual daily rate of lengthening is 0.5-1 mm, this can be adjusted according to your healing by the doctors.

What is your opinion regarding the weightbearing of the patients?

Patients will need to do the weight bearing exercise daily from day one of surgery.

How often will you follow up with patients during lengthening?

Monthly r-ray and daily check by doctor when you are in hospital.

Don't hesitate to get in touch with me if you need further clarification.

All the best wishes

Contact Info
Dr. Roger Li, MD, PhD
Senior Consultant
Beijing Institute of External Fixation Technology
www.leg-lengthening.com
info@leg-lengthening.com

KiloKAHN · « **Reply #1 on:** October 07, 2013, 07:04:22 PM »

Wow, China's leg lengthening clinics have raised their prices at an alarming rate. Dr. Xia would be a great deal if you are a Chinese local. You'll pay about a third of the price that they advertise on their site.

Time4LL · « **Reply #2 on:** October 08, 2013, 02:00:08 AM »

Is anyone planning on going to China soon. I am strongly thinking about it!! I haven't seen a diary in awhile, are they still a solid option?

TomD · « **Reply #3 on:** October 08, 2013, 02:30:01 AM »

Hey time4all

I wish we could get more patient diaries but we are just startin up. We have to be patient.

Sweden · « **Reply #4 on:** October 08, 2013, 03:23:59 AM »

My personal opinion about China is that it's too expensive now.
They absolutely get the job done and the care seems to be better than in India but with that price I'd rather save a little bit more and do internals with Dr Jamal.

It's also been reported that the IM-nail they use is of poor quality. A patient who lengthened his femurs with Dr Sarin did his tibia in China and he managed to bent his one nail so he had to go back to China and change it.
That scared the cr*p out of me.

The part where they charge 3 times more for foreigners makes me a little sick, but business is business and I think they have the greatest track record of all the doctors who perform LL.

Medium Drink Of Water · « **Reply #5 on:** October 08, 2013, 04:49:25 AM »

Quote from: orlandoflorida on October 07, 2013, 01:59:41 PM

Apparently Dr Xia no longer does the surgery, he is like a Director of the hospital who oversee things generally and trained several doctors who do the surgery.

This has been true since 2007. I met with Dr. Xia once for my initial consultation (at my insistence) and that was the last I saw of him except seeing him walking by in the courtyard one other time. Dr. Li came to visit me twice during the five months I was there. He did (and I think he still does) spend most of his time in the UK. Those two are really just figureheads at this point. They haven't updated their website or sales pitch since 2007 except for the prices.

Dr. Aimin Peng is the surgeon there. If there's a good argument to go to China, it's that nobody and I mean nobody does more LL surgeries than Dr. Peng. That place was like a factory assembly line with multiple surgeries a day the whole time I was there. Foreign patients get priority for morning surgeries, so if he's tired at the end of the day it's a Chinese patient who's paying the price.

NBW · « **Reply #6 on:** October 08, 2013, 10:18:55 AM »

You'd think the cost in China would depreciate after all these years since the introduction of the precise nail, internal methods and other advances, but sadly, it hasn't changed one bit.

Medium Drink Of Water · « **Reply #7 on:** October 08, 2013, 03:00:07 PM »

Quote from: NBW on October 08, 2013, 10:18:55 AM

You'd think the cost in China would depreciate after all these years since the introduction of the precise nail, internal methods and other advances, but sadly, it hasn't changed one bit.

A major reason why they've been raising their prices is because the Chinese Yuan has been increasing in value relative to pretty much every other country's currency.

I paid 25000 USD for the operation in 2007. Adjusted for CNY appreciation/ USD depreciation, the current price would be 31000 USD. Now it's 33000 USD. So they have only raised their prices by 6% over the last 6 years when you take currency appreciation/depreciation out of the equation.

Time4LL · « **Reply #8 on:** October 08, 2013, 05:16:27 PM »

Has anyone else heard that the Chinese IM nails are of lesser quality? I have read a few diaries on old forum and have never come across anyone saying this.

I think the price is reasonable considering how good there track record seems to be. They seem to be the place with the least amount of risks and the most experience.

@Sweden
How did he bend the nail? That is very concerning if there IM nails are of lesser quality than other places.

Medium Drink Of Water · « **Reply #9 on:** October 08, 2013, 09:22:27 PM »

Quote from: Time4LL on October 08, 2013, 05:16:27 PM

Has anyone else heard that the Chinese IM nails are of lesser quality? I have read a few diaries on old forum and have never come across anyone saying this.

I think the price is reasonable considering how good there track record seems to be. They seem to be the place with the least amount of risks and the most experience.

@Sweden
How did he bend the nail? That is very concerning if there IM nails are of lesser quality than other places.

I know two Beijing patients who've had problems with the IM nail. I don't think that the nails themselves were to blame in either case though. Both times it had to do with the screws that attached the nail to the bone coming loose. The first case was caught early by the doctors before the guy left the hospital; they did another operation to correct it and his departure had to be delayed for two weeks. He later had some minor problems with the screws again, but nothing that required an additional surgery. The second person did have to fly back to Beijing and get it fixed.

I never had a problem with my IM nails from Beijing, and I know two other patients who didn't have problems with theirs either. The three of us who didn't have problems with the IM nail had really good bone growth the whole time we were there, and the two with the nail problems had less than stellar bone growth. That might explain the reason for the problems, or it might just be a coincidence.

Still, I think it's a legitimate concern to have about their program. If you're thinking of going there, you might ask them for more information about their IM nails and the screws they use, and why some people have been experiencing problems.

Taller · « **Reply #10 on:** November 23, 2013, 01:22:41 AM »

Obviously LL prices change to certain level based on supply and demand. Pre-2007 and following old forum A's positive experience in Beijing, a lot of foreigners got their LL done there and prices shot up from ~$20,000 USD to over $30,000 USD. Since 2009, the dollar's value has increased but Beijing's LL price remains high. However, seeing as how the admin of the other site is actively trying to market Dr. Sringari in India, is foreign interest in Beijing, which uses similar LL technology to India (the clear difference being the level of CLL expiriemce of the doctors as well as level of attention toon from doctors and staff), starting to wane? If more people are drawn to India, for better or worse, why do Beijing's prices continue to increase for foreigner's. Does anyone know if they plan on continuing to increase prices? Seeing as Doctor M offers CLL with Taylor Spatial frames for 45,000 USD, they may soon price themselves out of the foreign market at this rate. Does anyone else this will be the case? I certainly hope it won't be since I think Beijing is still the best place to go for externals, yet the fact that there are no 2013 diaries for Dr. Xia doesn't look good. Any thoughts?

Also, I am not the same person as Tall on the other site. I did think he had an awesome username (the first word I think of when I think of CLL) and wanted it for myself, so this new LL site has already made some of my dreams come true haha.

Medium Drink Of Water · « **Reply #11 on:** November 23, 2013, 05:23:07 AM »

They probably did about 40-50 foreign LL cases in 2007. As people came and went, I don't remember the hospital's foreign population ever dropping below 20 the first time I was there. There were 5 foreigners when I went back for my IM nail removal in December 2008. They don't seem to be interested in competing with other clinics, either higher-end or lower-end. They could easily lower their prices (they make an absurd amount of profit on foreign patients) but they don't. They could move their clinic out of the Feng Tai slums but they don't. It's illegal for them to import foreign internal nail technology and they either can't or won't make their own. With China's reputation for industrial/intellectual piracy I expected a cheap knock-off Chinese internal nail to be offered there eventually, but it's just never happened, possibly due to the Chinese government's cracking down on counterfeiting of all kinds.

Dr. Xia is an old man who wasn't doing much at the clinic even in 2007. Dr. Li spends most of his time in England. Dr. Peng is doing most of the work in the operating room but he's still the #3 doctor there officially. I'm not sure he's the ambitious guy who's going to take over and become the new face of LL in China. Two young rookies, Dr. Han (a different Han not Lianyi Han on the website) and Dr. Zhou started working at the clinic when I was there and now have ~6 years of experience if they're still there. Maybe one of them will be bold enough to do something in the coming years, or maybe they're happy just working there and will fade into obscurity when Dr. Xia dies.

The dollar might buy you more in some places than it did in 2009, but that's not true in China. The Yuan has continued to appreciate, and the planned deregulation of its exchange rate could cause its value to skyrocket. The Beijing Institute of External Fixation is a microcosm of what's going on in China as a whole now. The days of cheap LL, and cheap everything else for that matter, might be coming to an end in China. But if it's not the place where you can get everything cheaply and do whatever you want with your business, what's its new identity?

Thegosis · « **Reply #12 on:** December 08, 2013, 02:07:33 PM »

I am a current overseas patient in Beijing. My operation to put on the fixators was 27 September this year. That was day one. On day nine I commenced lengthening at .667mm per day and I have missed one day due to illness. Today I was sent to the parent hospital for investigations due to my persistent diahorrhea, and I had vomiting a couple of nights before. I have a strong persistent cough and voice hoarseness.

Dr Peng Aimin was my operating surgeon. I have not seen Dr Xia or Dr Li except where there are pictured and listed on the staff directory.

There is another foreign patient here who has finished lengthening: a female who goes home to Europe later this month. I'm not sure there is a male, but two males are coming soon: an American, an Australian. Other patients come from at times far parts of China and they are correcting abnormalities of leg length and range of motion. Small kids, middle aged and between.

I am perturbed by this: there's not a pet cat or dog or bird around here.

Start me a diary, can you?

Medium Drink Of Water · « **Reply #13 on:** December 08, 2013, 02:42:44 PM »

This isn't old forum . You can start your own diary here. Just go to the Patient Experiences subforum and click on "NEW TOPIC".

Muse · « **Reply #14 on:** December 08, 2013, 03:28:33 PM »

@Thegosis, you can start the diary by clicking "New Topic" in the section to discuss your experience in China.

anonymous · « **Reply #15 on:** February 10, 2014, 07:12:23 AM »

Can anyone explain why there are so few foreign patients with Dr. Xia? There were no diaries for Dr. Xia in 2013 on old forum , whereas there was always 1-7 diaries for the preceding years. Also, I've seen comments on the large number of foreign patients there.

When I last communicated with Ronne last month, she said there were about 5 patients.

I am considering going there in May 2014.

Medium Drink Of Water · « **Reply #16 on:** February 10, 2014, 04:21:52 PM »

They raised their prices. Then raised them again. And then again...

OverrideYouGenetics · « **Reply #17 on:** February 10, 2014, 10:18:49 PM »

Quote from: anonymous on February 10, 2014, 07:12:23 AM

Can anyone explain why there are so few foreign patients with Dr. Xia? There were no diaries for Dr. Xia in 2013 on old forum , whereas there was always 1-7 diaries for the preceding years. Also, I've seen comments on the large number of foreign patients there.

When I last communicated with Ronne last month, she said there were about 5 patients.

I am considering going there in May 2014.

they increased their prices, the greedy bastards. One price for locals, another price for naive foreigners. By increasing the prices they moved to middle-tier range on the price chart. So all the low-budget patients ran off to sarins and sringaris, while mid-budget patients can now afford internal LL in ukraine.
The high end patients are with betz, guichet, donghoon, paley etc.

so the winners here are everyone bar the greedy punk Dr. Xia.

KiloKAHN · « **Reply #18 on:** February 10, 2014, 10:30:17 PM »

Quote from: kusop on February 10, 2014, 10:18:49 PM

they increased their prices, the greedy bastards. One price for locals, another price for naive foreigners. By increasing the prices they moved to middle-tier range on the price chart. So all the low-budget patients ran off to sarins and sringaris, while mid-budget patients can now afford internal LL in ukraine.
The high end patients are with betz, guichet, donghoon, paley etc.

so the winners here are everyone bar the greedy punk Dr. Xia.

From five months spent living in China, it seems that there's a mentality over there that it's good to try and get as much money out of foreigners as possible because it's more money that's being put into the country. It's like a China pride thing. Dr Bai that supplies the micro-wound fixators in Chongqing does the same thing. He has an $8,000 USD price for locals and $33,000 for foreigners.

Taller · « **Reply #19 on:** February 10, 2014, 10:36:56 PM »

If you were a person of foreign birth (and obviously non-Chinese appearance aka black or white etc), but lived and worked in China, would you be allowed to pay the locals' price or would you still be made to pay the foreigners' price? Would the ability to speak Mandarin affect the price paid at all?

KiloKAHN · « **Reply #20 on:** February 10, 2014, 10:55:01 PM »

I don't think speaking Mandarin would influence the price at all. I speak it with high proficiency but people in China still tried to sell me things at highly inflated prices. The only thing I think would influence it were if you had proof that you were a resident of China and were employed there. That's something that would be interesting to see.

Thegosis · « **Reply #21 on:** February 11, 2014, 02:00:22 AM »

When I paid last year it was at the rate of $EUR25000/$USD33000, and I'm not aware of a raise subsequent to that. There are presently 4 foreign patients undergoing lengthening here. The fifth we had went home before spring break and he was in just for the removal of a rod. Rumour is that we should be getting two more now that Spring Festival has passed. I think I am the only person here with an entire room for myself to that puts things very close to capacity. Before SF they let go of the cook delivering the foreign menu here, so now there is just one menu and one cook for all patients here.

If you have a foreign passport I think there is nil chance you will qualify for a local patient price, no matter how well you speak Chinese.

Medium Drink Of Water · « **Reply #22 on:** March 07, 2014, 10:42:16 PM »

The website has been updated. They're back to offering 10cm again.

Thegosis · « **Reply #23 on:** April 14, 2014, 09:30:22 PM »

Quote from: Thegosis on December 08, 2013, 02:07:33 PM

I am a current overseas patient in Beijing. My operation to put on the fixators was 27 September this year. That was day one. On day nine I commenced lengthening at .667mm per day and I have missed one day due to illness. Today I was sent to the parent hospital for investigations due to my persistent diahorrhea, and I had vomiting a couple of nights before. I have a strong persistent cough and voice hoarseness.

Dr Peng Aimin was my operating surgeon. I have not seen Dr Xia or Dr Li except where there are pictured and listed on the staff directory.

There is another foreign patient here who has finished lengthening: a female who goes home to Europe later this month. I'm not sure there is a male, but two males are coming soon: an American, an Australian. Other patients come from at times far parts of China and they are correcting abnormalities of leg length and range of motion. Small kids, middle aged and between.

I am perturbed by this: there's not a pet cat or dog or bird around here.

Start me a diary, can you?

My operation was on 27 November, not September. I've stated that wrong above.

LittleLiam · « **Reply #24 on:** April 15, 2014, 11:17:21 AM »

Thanks to advice from you folks I have discarded India for my LL. Recent diary on Harbin, China looks interesting (fewer patients) however Bejing seems best for me now in terms of price/reputation. Only concern is that I want femur as mine are short and not many diaries of Femur external LON ?

I have sent three emails to the 'info' address for Beijing over the past two weeks but no reply. Can anyone suggest another email address ?

Regards

Liam

Time4LL · « **Reply #25 on:** April 15, 2014, 08:29:35 PM »

Has anyone heard of the price change and them moving to a new hospital?? I have heard they moved to a new hospital in the last month.

Medium Drink Of Water · « **Reply #26 on:** April 15, 2014, 10:36:04 PM »

It's the same hospital, but they built a new building where one of the courtyards used to be.

Time4LL · « **Reply #27 on:** April 16, 2014, 08:21:23 PM »

I don't think so. I have been in contact with Ronne and she has sent me pictures of a new hospital they have moved to. It looks much nicer than the one they are currently in.

Medium Drink Of Water · « **Reply #28 on:** April 16, 2014, 09:30:17 PM »

Okay I found out what's been going on. They still have Guang Ji Hospital, which has a new building, and they're also sending some patients to a different hospital.

LittleLiam · « **Reply #29 on:** April 17, 2014, 04:13:19 AM »

Hi Time4LL

Can you give me contact details for Ronnie please?

Cheers

LittleLiam

jerry · « **Reply #30 on:** April 17, 2014, 04:22:57 AM »

Does anybody know if they changed their price?

Limb Lengthening Forum

Author Topic: Dr Xia & Dr Li (Beijing China) Institute of External Fixation Technology (Read 92003 times)

Muse

Muse