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[myloginacct]

That's just how the world works apparently:
Human Height Is Positively Related to Interpersonal Dominance in Dyadic Interactions

To be honest, this seems to be a very Eurocentric study. Where I live, I only notice the shorter than average people have the worst jobs. Tall men don't give me the impression of being of higher social status than slightly above average ones. It seems like it could go either way. But good to have actual data on how height functions on a daily basis in the West!

I'd be interested if you found Japanese articles about height, and compared if they differ in conclusions and presentations from their Western counterparts.

[Purushrottam]

It could be you're subconsciously carrying yourself with much more confidence and giving that vibe, or it could definitely be because of the new height.

Either way, it's the kind of qualia we can only experience and notice after something about us visibly changes.

Hmm. That might be the case. I was still subconsciously acting on my previous habits of moving out of the way. Its just that the group of people was so large that I mentally hesitated in deciding whether to go left or right. By the time I "decided", the group split up in front of me. It was pretty surreal to be honest.

That's just how the world works apparently:
Human Height Is Positively Related to Interpersonal Dominance in Dyadic Interactions

Interesting. Thanks for the article.

To be honest, this seems to be a very Eurocentric study. Where I live, I only notice the shorter than average people have the worst jobs. Tall men don't give me the impression of being of higher social status than slightly above average ones. It seems like it could go either way. But good to have actual data on how height functions on a daily basis in the West!

I'd be interested if you found Japanese articles about height, and compared if they differ in conclusions and presentations from their Western counterparts.

Thats a good question. I think the study discusses that this phenomenon is found across human cultures. In my particular example, the large group of people (who all moved out of my way) were Indian, and the group behind them (who also moved out of my way) was Caucasian. They weren't even shorter than me.

It might just be that now I look a bit scary because I grew my beard out (and have been working out intensely for 2-3 hours per day). My muscle mass is way higher and my % body fat is way lower than before. That may have had an impact as well.

[myloginacct]

Hmm. That might be the case. I was still subconsciously acting on my previous habits of moving out of the way. Its just that the group of people was so large that I mentally hesitated in deciding whether to go left or right. By the time I "decided", the group split up in front of me. It was pretty surreal to be honest.

Interesting. Thanks for the article.

Thats a good question. I think the study discusses that this phenomenon is found across human cultures. In my particular example, the large group of people (who all moved out of my way) were Indian, and the group behind them (who also moved out of my way) was Caucasian. They weren't even shorter than me.

It might just be that now I look a bit scary because I grew my beard out (and have been working out intensely for 2-3 hours per day). My muscle mass is way higher and my % body fat is way lower than before. That may have had an impact as well.

Oh, it's definitely a worldwide trend. Bigger height and mass = someone you don't wanna get into a fight with (to put a metaphorical figure literally: "someone you don't want to cross paths with").

Actually, body mass is one of the most overlooked factors when discussing anything in this forum.

It's just all the other claims in the study that get me. A study from apparently the Netherlands, the tallest country in the world. No biases there. I'm sure the results would differ a bit more if it wasn't from the country with the highest selection for height in the whole world. I'm sure the trend would continue, but I don't think it'd be as strong.

[FormerKidd]

Hey Puru,

Did you stay in WPB for consolidation or go back to Silicon Valley?  Did you continue to have PT done two or three times a week, and where do you find those PTs?

[Purushrottam]

Oh, it's definitely a worldwide trend. Bigger height and mass = someone you don't wanna get into a fight with (to put a metaphorical figure literally: "someone you don't want to cross paths with").

Actually, body mass is one of the most overlooked factors when discussing anything in this forum.

It's just all the other claims in the study that get me. A study from apparently the Netherlands, the tallest country in the world. No biases there. I'm sure the results would differ a bit more if it wasn't from the country with the highest selection for height in the whole world. I'm sure the trend would continue, but I don't think it'd be as strong.

Agreed. I'm about to travel around Europe and Asia before my new job starts. I guess I'll be able to see ( anecdotally at least) the impact of my new height.

Hey Puru,

Did you stay in WPB for consolidation or go back to Silicon Valley?  Did you continue to have PT done two or three times a week, and where do you find those PTs?

Hello FormerKidd,

 No I stayed at a different low COL location with my parents. I did the PT a few times a day (for the first month) by myself.

[miumiu145]

sry im a little bit confuse so how much does it cost for the whole LL lengthening ? 

[Purushrottam]

sry im a little bit confuse so how much does it cost for the whole LL lengthening ? 

Bilateral Femoral Surgery: $90,000
Pain meds: $40/mo x 2
Blood Thinners: $400/mo x 3
Hotel: $90/day x 70
Food: $500/mo x 2

I'm going to come back in a few months to get my rods removed. I don't remember the price for that but I think it's $17,500.

[OverrideYourGenetics]

Correct, $17,500 for femoral hardware removal per http://paleyinstitute.org/centers-of-excellence/stature-lengthening/the-paley-method/nail-removal/

Great journey, Puru! I hope you stick around for a year or two after and tell us how close to pre-op your functionality is.

[Purushrottam]

Correct, $17,500 for femoral hardware removal per http://paleyinstitute.org/centers-of-excellence/stature-lengthening/the-paley-method/nail-removal/

Great journey, Puru! I hope you stick around for a year or two after and tell us how close to pre-op your functionality is.

Thank you OYG! I've been following your blog as well. Its very informative. I will definitely post for a year or two and update everyone with my functionality.

On a side note, are you planning on writing off some of the expenses that you have incurred during your LL journey during the next tax season? The rules about medical deductions for cosmetic surgery (and associated medical expenses) are relatively ambiguous. However it can be quite a financial relief especially if you are jobless.

This is the post I made where I was discussing that.

http://www.limblengtheningforum.com/index.php?topic=5360.msg83937;topicseen#msg83937

[OverrideYourGenetics]

Thank you OYG! I've been following your blog as well. Its very informative. I will definitely post for a year or two and update everyone with my functionality.

Thanks! I need to update it some more, though I'm far less excited about LL now that I'm actually going through its pains, than I was before the surgeries.

And thanks for the research into tax write-offs! Super useful. I've bookmarked your post and will definitely look into it next year. Could save quite a chunk of money because I've been staying at Homewood Suites since March, which is in season - room prices over $200/day. Now they're back to $80, phew.

[Purushrottam]

Thanks! I need to update it some more, though I'm far less excited about LL now that I'm actually going through its pains, than I was before the surgeries.

And thanks for the research into tax write-offs! Super useful. I've bookmarked your post and will definitely look into it next year. Could save quite a chunk of money because I've been staying at Homewood Suites since March, which is in season - room prices over $200/day. Now they're back to $80, phew.

No problem.

I can totally see that. I actually didn't write that often when I was actually lengthening. The lack of sleep totally depresses you. You don't feel motivated to do anything... even physical therapy. You have to push thru. Its not really a physical thing. The majority of the process is mental (fighting your mental inertio). For inspiration, I looked at other LLers diaries to see how they were doing at that cm lengthened (I specifically was looking at DoingItFormE, ProgramDude, and Penguinn diaries).  Especially reading about peoples' lives after LL. It also helps if you hang out with other LLers.

The first 3 weeks I was really antisocial. There was one Quadrilateral patient with us at that time. He especially had trouble sleeping due to the dorsiflexion boots. Just push thru. Life at 175 cm is so different. Its very hard to quantify.

Going back to the tax write offs, keep track of all your LL related expenses (including travel, lodging, etc). You can write off about $50/day for the hotel. Even though I paid $80/day. Their criteria is that the hotel should not be 'extravagant' and 'part of your recreational activity'. Meaning, don't go on 'vacations' while you are lengthening. Goes without saying. But it looks like I'll get about $8000 back as a tax refund which will definitely help with my expenses.

[LAGrowin]

No problem.

Life at 175 cm is so different. Its very hard to quantify.

Oh yes it seems like it will be. It's exactly where I ended up.  I've only gotten a small taste of it but wow what a difference!

[Purushrottam]

I got hit with several bits of good news today.

1. I have a new job. I'll be making a lot more ($170k) than what I was making at a LOWER COST OF LIVING location. I'm going to pay my loan off aggressively (hopefully in 13 months instead of the 78 remaining). I'm trying to get at paying $4500/mo (my loan payment is about $1350/mo).

2. I got my tax refund. I had "run out" of my savings and was making minimum payments on my credit card bill for the last month. Combined with my new job, I will never "hit 0". There is no balance on my credit card now. I had withdrawn from my 401k a few months back to pay my living expenses/loan payments while unemployed. I still had a lot left in my 401k but I did not want to withdraw again as you forfeit a significant amount to early withdrawal fees.

3. Several of my co-LLers are now playing full contact sports (soccer and boxing.. with sparring). Despite my fast consolidation, my athleticism didn't come back as quickly because I wasn't as aggressive with stretching/cardio. The other guys are doing pretty well in that department. Awesome news that makes me hopeful. Once again, I'm not doing badly, but I'm not as strong/athletic as I want to be.

[lurker1]

Glad to hear the good news!

I had a question for you. Does Dr. Paley allow lengthening at home? I have family in Tampa, and it would cut down on living expenses if I could stay with them.

[Purushrottam]

Glad to hear the good news!

Thank you!

Does Dr. Paley allow lengthening at home? I have family in Tampa, and it would cut down on living expenses if I could stay with them.

Absolutely not. He will not operate on you if you are not willing to come to PT at Paley Institute. The only exception he will make is if there is a hurricane coming and we might be w.o power for a few days AND you are at risk for premature consolidation. Then he will let you lengthen at home for the duration of the storm/after effects (this really happened. I had LL in September during hurricane season). Otherwise, no.

[lurker1]

Absolutely not. He will not operate on you if you are not willing to come to PT at Paley Institute. The only exception he will make is if there is a hurricane coming and we might be w.o power for a few days AND you are at risk for premature consolidation. Then he will let you lengthen at home for the duration of the storm/after effects (this really happened. I had LL in September during hurricane season). Otherwise, no.

Good to know. Thanks for the reply.

[Purushrottam]

No update. I just can't believe how big of a freaking difference 2.7 inches makes in terms of attractiveness. I was expecting there to be some slight improvement but it's way more than I expected. I actually feel attractive now. I've never felt this way in my life before. I feel like I'm on top of the world.

I can't see why anyone who was complication free would regret doing this.

[Android]

Wow, I missed your update about your new job. Incredible salary, and lower cost of living... Congrats! Makes your decision to do CLL an even easier pill to swallow.

Glad that you're feeling good, to be on top of the world. I hope to start climbing that mountain soon.

[Zeo]

This whole diary is super inspirational. A reminder to everyone interested in this surgery to get their sh!t together if you havn't already.

You're living the dream brother

[Purushrottam]

Wow, I missed your update about your new job. Incredible salary, and lower cost of living... Congrats! Makes your decision to do CLL an even easier pill to swallow.

Glad that you're feeling good, to be on top of the world. I hope to start climbing that mountain soon.

Haha I snuck that info in a minor update. Thanks man! Blessed to have picked a profession that offers such flexibility/opportunities. Good luck on your journey, and keep us updated!

This whole diary is super inspirational. A reminder to everyone interested in this surgery to get their sh!t together if you havn't already.

You're living the dream brother

Wow, thats very flattering, thank you! Yes I do want to add, before doing this surgery, ask yourself if you have optimized your life to the fullest extent possible (job/career, personality, etc).

[FormerKidd]

Sounds like things are going well.  Puru - I sent you a PM.

[Purushrottam]

Sounds like things are going well.  Puru - I sent you a PM.

Answered!

[Purushrottam]

Small update:

Jogging no longer feels weird. Not working out as much as before due to my new job. My flexibility is getting pretty good. I walk 4-6 miles everyday (walk to and from work/etc). My next goal is to run 10 minutes nonstop on a treadmill at 6 mph with a 2.0 incline.

[FormerKidd]

Hey Puru,

I hope to begin consolidation soon.  I didn't see too much from you in the interim, do you have any advice/suggestions for that phase?  You were cleared to walk after six weeks, correct?  How long did it take you to be able to bend your knees fully again and pull them to your chest, .etc? 

[Purushrottam]

Hey Puru,

I hope to begin consolidation soon.  I didn't see too much from you in the interim, do you have any advice/suggestions for that phase?  You were cleared to walk after six weeks, correct?  How long did it take you to be able to bend your knees fully again and pull them to your chest, .etc?

Hey FormerKidd, congratulations! The biggest thing I would say is, be patient. Don't push your body more than what the doctor authorizes. I started consolidating on Dec 1 and I was walking w.o crutches on I believe Jan 24 (I don't remember exactly, I'll have to look it up on this diary itself).

I slacked a bit on my flexibility exercises. I still can't bend my knees fully (but pretty close). I still can't pull them fully onto my chest. That being said, the others in my cohort got back to full flexibility BEFORE their bones consolidated. My consolidation was relatively quick, but my flexibility recovery was not as quick.

[FormerKidd]

Good to know.

Did you use the walker/crutches for most of your lengthening, or did you have to spend any time in wheelchair?
Was your bone growth good during lengthening?
Did you stay at 4 turns/day (1mm/day) for the entirety or did they ever slow you down?

Sorry for all the questions, thanks for the answers!

[Purushrottam]

Good to know.

Did you use the walker/crutches for most of your lengthening, or did you have to spend any time in wheelchair?
Was your bone growth good during lengthening?
Did you stay at 4 turns/day (1mm/day) for the entirety or did they ever slow you down?

Sorry for all the questions, thanks for the answers!

I used the walker for most of my lengthening. I got training to use the crutches during the last 2 weeks of lengthening. During consolidation I was exclusively using crutches (because I was getting lots of visitors. I didn't want to freak them out with a walker. It makes your situation look super serious compared to just using crutches). Dr. Robbins said that my bone growth was very good during lengthening. I was using Silican 1, 2 and Boost (along with drinking logs of drinkeable yogurt). I lengthened at 1 mm/day for the entirely of lengthening except for the last week. During the last week I slowed it down to 3 turns (.75mm/day).

No problem. Ask away.

[totallyred]

Please pm me your x rays. Thanks a lot.

[OverrideYourGenetics]

I can finally touch my toes bending down with my legs straight. Still not at pre LL flexibility but it took me a long time due to me not stretching enough during my recovery. I also didn't do as many leg workouts (leg press etc). After I increased my leg workouts, the flexibility started improving relatively quickly.

Other than that, for the past 4 weeks I was doing the Hugh Jackman workout from Mens Fitness [dot] com for about 2-3 hours a day.

During the Hugh Jackman workout, what did you do for stretching? Do you remember / have a log?

[Purushrottam]

During the Hugh Jackman workout, what did you do for stretching? Do you remember / have a log?

Touching my toes down, holding for 1 minute (3 sets)

Getting a stool, putting my foot up on it (varying heights), holding for 1 minute (3 sets)

Standing knee bends, holding for 1 minute (3 sets).

This is on top of regular physical therapy exercises recommended by the Paley Center therapists.

[Purushrottam]

Update:

Just ran a mile!!!!! It didn't feel weird at all. My legs weren't tired, I just got out of breath. My stamina from lack of cardio is the limiting factor, not my legs.

I didn't time myself because I didn't want to carry my phone with me. I'm excited about this. Quite a MILEstone.