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[rami]

Hello Everyone,

I am new to this forum and tried to know more about the time needed to walk without support/ crutches using the different techniques however it is still vague to me.

Can anyone help in summarizing the time needed to walk without crutches using all available techniques for (5, 6, 7) cm height gain.

Thank you.

[The Kaiser]

Hello Everyone,

I am new to this forum and tried to know more about the time needed to walk without support/ crutches using the different techniques however it is still vague to me.

Can anyone help in summarizing the time needed to walk without crutches using all available techniques for (5, 6, 7) cm height gain.

Thank you.

There are some nails you can walk without crutches in less than 2 months, but of course not normally.

[rami]

Thank you for your reply.

Can you please say what nails are you talking about and who are the doctors using these nails?

(and yea sure i am not expecting normal walk, but to be able to walk without support or crutches.)

One more question, what are the techniques available to walk during the consolidation phase without support (without external as well), if internal this is fine but having external will make your surgery obvious to everyone and i am sure that most people here do not wish that to happen.

[LLSouthAmerica]

For Precise (Dr. Paley, Dr Rozburch, Dr Pili) and Fitbone (Dr Monegal, Dr Baumgart) which are partial weightbearing you need to wait for 2-3 months on a wheelchair then 4 additional months in crutches until being able to walk without support. However I know Dr Monegal prefers lengthening in 2 steps, first one leg then the other. In that case, his patients could tell you the details. But I believe you walk with crutches earlier that way.

For Guichet Nail (Dr Guichet) and Betzbone (Dr. Betz), I know only the first, and in my case I used crutches immediately after surgery for 2 months and then started walking without support (even before stopping lengthening).

If you do external (Russian doctors, Dr Catagni), then you can opt for LON or LATN which limit your amount of time with frames however there is a real issue about permanent knee pain. There are some external devices which allow you to walk after lengthening (weightbearing). Again I don't know detail about these, I think TSF?

[rami]

Does LATN technique insert the nail immediately after lengthening is completed or do they give it some time before that?

And do you now other good doctors doing LATN?

Thanks in advance.

[LLSouthAmerica]

In LATN they place the nail at the same time they remove the frames so post lengthening I think.
I'd say forget about LATN and LON, no amount of gain and secrecy are worth having pain for the rest of your life. Do internal on femur and pure external on tibia. Can't really recommend a doctor. I haven't seen the procedure and I've never done it and never will.

[rami]

I sent several email with the doctor last week up till this moment, he told me that he is doing internal (Precise) - 20000 euros and external - 9300 euros. Also I do LATN (16000) eurosand LON, and then sent the general information he sends for every patient.

However he recommends his external over all other options, and i am not sure but i feel he is getting away from other options by making them less appealing. For example he said that for LATN although i want to increase height for 5 cm only he sen me this: "Cost of LATN is 16000 euros. After the first operation you will use crutches 6 months and then to walk without crutches. External removal and internal fixation is 5 months after the first operation."

So i replied to him by this email: "I wonder why it is 5 months for external removal while i only want to increase my height 5 cm. Is this case for 5 cm height increase as well??
I only want 5 cm height increase therefore (0.066 - 0.1) mm/day leaves you with (50 to 75 days of lengthening) aren't we supposed to insert LATN nail after lengthening is completed?"

and he replied: "ealing is completed after 7-9 months. New bone is very soft after 2 months and better to wait until 4.5-5 months and then to use internal. At 4.5-5 months healinh still not completed. If put internal then it should be removed 2 years later with operation. So you can  conclude that beter to have external 7-9 months and remove it in outpatie t clinic without anaesthesia as it is painless, then to put internal and to have additional operation after 2 year. Only advantage is to be with external 2-5 months but all other is disadvantage. If I were you I would finish averything with external only. It is the safest, the qickest, the easiest and the cheapest."

Therefore i am not sure if this is correct, as i read you say that LATN nail is inserted immediately after lengthening and can make you walk without crutches. Please correct me if i am wrong and weather or not the doctor is making it look more difficult to work on his external technique.

[LLSouthAmerica]

Yes in LATN the intramedullary nail is inserted after the lengthening phase and at the same time the frames are removed. This doesn't mean you have full weightbearing (walk with crutches) as this depends on your bone formation, usually 2-3 months after placement of the nail. So in total, 2 months in frames + 2 months more to full weight bearing. This of course does not mean normal walking. Normal healing time for tibia with externals is 7-9 months as the doctor said.

[KrP1]

For internal femurs with fitbone , around 4 months for 6,5cm , but not to walk normal.

[rami]

Can we walk with crutches immediately after lengthening phase with precise? and how long does it take to walk without crutches? (for 5 cm lengthening)

[onemorefoot]

Can we walk with crutches immediately after lengthening phase with precise? and how long does it take to walk without crutches? (for 5 cm lengthening)

2 months more or less, Paley says that.

[LLSouthAmerica]

So it would be 2 months of lengthening for 5 cm, then you immediately start crutches? and then 2 months more to walk without crutches. But by then you would be almost fully consolidated so maybe you don't have any restrictions of movements and would be able to take stairs and run?

[onemorefoot]

I read 2 months of lengthening, And after 2 months full weight bearing can be done.

[LLSouthAmerica]

I think a Precise patient maybe could clarify this as "full weight bearing" is not the same as walking without crutches and much less running, going up and downstairs, etc.

[programdude]

For 8 CM it took me ages to walk without crutches, let alone normally. It did take me longer than the average though.

[LLSouthAmerica]

Hi programdude! How long did it take you to walk without crutches and normally? How long is the average for Precise patients?

[The Kaiser]

For 8 CM it took me ages to walk without crutches, let alone normally. It did take me longer than the average though.

Do you think with full weight-barring it would be much less time to walk? because that what we see from other patient.

[Conan]

With mitkovic external device ( 5.4 cm in tibia ) it tooks me almost 9 months however I could walk before but not correctley.

[rami]

When did you remove the external frame?

[programdude]

Hi programdude! How long did it take you to walk without crutches and normally? How long is the average for Precise patients?

It was a long while. Without crutches I think maybe 3 months. And normally a lot longer. I honestly eventually lost track. It was a LONG process though to be able to present myself normally, and a little but longer to feel it as well.

Most seem to be walking not long after and normal after just a couple months. But my case shows that even with the best doctor and proper protocol it can take a long time.

This is why I heavily advise planning for the absolute worst when setting aside time off of work etc. You can check my journal for a better idea about specifics and time frame.