Topic: Are There Any Safer Ways To LL (Read 13241 times)

mackmack · « **on:** March 20, 2014, 06:06:54 AM »

Are There Any Safer Ways To LL without the external or internal methods? If so are there any upcoming breakthoughs in the LL world regarding this? What is the safest way to gain 8cm?

Polycrates. · « **Reply #1 on:** March 20, 2014, 06:38:47 AM »

What type of response are you expecting? Some sort of genetic exploitation to induce natural growth? I'm sure that's possible and will be available some time far down the line (I personally hope all matters of physical deformity/insufficiency correction are eventually subsumed by a genetic assurance program utilized prior to conception), but until then the only options are clearly either external AND/OR internal combinations. There is no other logical means to lengthen a limb otherwise.

mackmack · « **Reply #2 on:** March 20, 2014, 07:42:12 AM »

That would be cool if it was close to coming out? I am just wondering if there are any new type of methods coming out that would make LL safer. I am considering the PRECISE 2 but not sure how I feel about having a metal rod in me for 1 year and then having to await the removal for 1 whole year.

ChrisIsaak · « **Reply #3 on:** March 20, 2014, 08:04:27 AM »

Newer technology doesn't necessarily mean safer, it might be quite the opposite. For safety, you need a track record. I've heard from my doctor that two Precice nails in the US have recently been broken. I don't know if these are cosmetic lengthenings or not though. External methods have certain downsides like pin site infection risk, but with proper care everything should be fine. Overall, I think external methods are safer because of their track record, but they're not the most comfortable methods for sure. You always have to be prepared for something to go wrong when you undergo something like LL. Complications might happen - with any doctor, with any method. Therefore, you need a doctor who will be prepared to treat potential complications and fix them.

BullSurfer · « **Reply #4 on:** March 20, 2014, 08:16:42 AM »

You can invent a time machine. Go back and instruct your younger self to eat more better nutritional foods, lots of slerp, water, exercise. If that failed, go back again and inject your younger self with growth hormone.

Cheers!

TRS · « **Reply #5 on:** March 20, 2014, 08:46:26 AM »

If your growth plates haven't fused then you may try HGH and gain about 1-10cm with increased chance of diabetes, cancer and/or high cholestrol levels.
If your growth plates have fused then your ONLY option is LL (both internal/external) and don't bother with other preposterous pseudoscientific height increase claims. You must accept the inherent risks associated with LL (worst being amputation/death) and that there is NO such thing as safe LL.

mackmack · « **Reply #6 on:** March 20, 2014, 07:29:05 PM »

Thank you all for your responses! (except BallSurfer)

mackmack · « **Reply #7 on:** March 20, 2014, 07:30:51 PM »

@TheRisingShorty

Do you recommend any brands? Or recommend any ways of approaching HGH? I think my growth plates are still open but not sure how long? Im 21 1/2 years old currently and growing very very slowly. Not sure if I should wait the growth plates fuse and stretch and exercise or just get LL done. But I am scared to of surgery it is could be life changing procedure if something goes wrong.

BilateralDamage · « **Reply #8 on:** March 20, 2014, 07:40:24 PM »

Quote from: BullSurfer on March 20, 2014, 08:16:42 AM

You can invent a time machine. Go back and instruct your younger self to eat more better nutritional foods, lots of slerp, water, exercise. If that failed, go back again and inject your younger self with growth hormone.

Cheers!

That's funny, I was actually thinking about how much different my life would have been if I had taken HGH when I was a kid. Then I thought about doing some time traveling..

TRS · « **Reply #9 on:** March 21, 2014, 03:20:22 AM »

Quote from: mackmack on March 20, 2014, 07:30:51 PM

@TheRisingShorty

Do you recommend any brands? Or recommend any ways of approaching HGH? I think my growth plates are still open but not sure how long? Im 21 1/2 years old currently and growing very very slowly. Not sure if I should wait the growth plates fuse and stretch and exercise or just get LL done. But I am scared to s**t of surgery it is could be life changing procedure if something goes wrong.

The best way to approach HGH is by consulting an endocrinologist.

KiloKAHN · « **Reply #10 on:** March 21, 2014, 03:39:31 AM »

From what my doc told me back when I was 15, if your growth plates are almost fused then there's virtually no point in doing HGH injections. It only really helps if you start early enough and get the injections for years, and the end result is usually around a 2 inch gain. At this late in the game HGH would just be wasted money.

mackmack · « **Reply #11 on:** March 21, 2014, 07:01:18 AM »

Thanks for your response guys. HGH is officially thrown out the window now. I am going to try to stretch a lot and maybe exercise to see if it can help. I think I grew like 1 inch in 3 years! Which is slow

Not sure if it was from my stretching or just natural growth either.

Has anyone else heard of any LL horror storys leading to amputation, paral, or even death?

Polycrates. · « **Reply #12 on:** March 21, 2014, 09:29:41 AM »

I've never heard of a reported death or even amputation from LL, but I'm sure it's happened in some dark corner of the Earth. The main things to worry about are damage to the nerves and vessels. Dr. Parihar told me no matter how fked up your bones might end up, if everything remains intact, it is ultimately a correctable case. The extra time, costs, and distress involved in correction means you'd be wise to choose a doctor who is proven reliable from the get-go. If a blood vessel becomes ruptured then you may bleed out or be required to amputate the limb. Blood vessel damage seems very rare, even in the instances of butcher practices. If a nerve is severed, you can be paralysed. I myself might have a paralysed toe. Damage to the peripheral nerve system is correctable to a certain degree. There are nerve grafts available for worst case scenarios and many types of damage correct on their own.

It's probably hypocritical of me to tell you this since I wagered on a bargain in India, but I think I'll still come out relatively unscathed. I've earned more than enough the past three years to do Paley twice over, but I squandered my money on senseless things, and food-- and I couldn't bring myself to terms with parting with that much money to do a surgery. Thanks to this board, there is a plethora of doctors at more reasonable prices becoming available to the users of this site. Had I known of Dr. Birkholtz, I would've held off and went with him, but it's all in the past now.

Moubgf · « **Reply #13 on:** March 21, 2014, 12:04:07 PM »

Polycrates bro, pay for half my external tibia expense and i keep you company while lengthening.

Polycrates. · « **Reply #14 on:** March 21, 2014, 02:54:53 PM »

Sorry bud,

I'm as broke as the average Indian now... Gotta get back to work ASAP!

mackmack · « **Reply #15 on:** March 22, 2014, 04:32:07 AM »

Polycrates your response are really helpful! I hope your LL goes as planned and you get or got everything you wanted from it!

I am considering Paley purely because he is supposedly the best in the states?

I saw this gruesome story about LL with paley though but it was from 2002 and 12 years is a lot of time to hone your skills in LL.
https://sites.google.com/site/mycrippledleg/home/dr-paley-2-html

Not sure. In your experiences what is the safest way to LL? Externals require only 1 surgery. Internals Precice requires 2 surgerys and the scared feeling of anticipating the removal is going to be in the back of my mind for 1 year+?

TRS · « **Reply #16 on:** March 22, 2014, 04:58:42 AM »

Quote from: mackmack on March 22, 2014, 04:32:07 AM

Not sure. In your experiences what is the safest way to LL? Externals require only 1 surgery. Internals Precice requires 2 surgerys and the scared feeling of anticipating the removal is going to be in the back of my mind for 1 year+?

External requires two surgeries: 1st) Initial osteotomy and fixing the external/ilizarov apparatus to the
bone
2nd) Removal of the apparatus
(3rd) (Only if you do LON/LATN then an additional surgery will be done
to remove the intramedullary rod appox. a year later after the
removal of the apparatus)

Internal nail: 1st) Insertion of nail
2nd) Nail removal approx. a year later

Additional surgery from complications should also be taken into account.

Safest way to lengthen? No method is completely safe but if you ask me or most of the members/LL veterans they will almost certainly tell you that for femur lengthening only consider doing Internal Nails. External fixation on femur is not recommended due to high complication rates.
For tibia lengthening, you can consider external fixation, LON/LATN/LATP or internals, they all have advantages and disadvantages. It is best to do more research on this and make a choice that you feel comfortable with. The following topic on tibia lengthening should be very helpful to you http://www.limblengtheningforum.com/index.php?topic=342.msg5561#msg5561.

mackmack · « **Reply #17 on:** March 22, 2014, 07:54:15 AM »

Quote from: TheRisingShorty on March 22, 2014, 04:58:42 AM

External requires two surgeries: 1st) Initial osteotomy and fixing the external/ilizarov apparatus to the
bone
2nd) Removal of the apparatus
(3rd) (Only if you do LON/LATN then an additional surgery will be done
to remove the intramedullary rod appox. a year later after the
removal of the apparatus)

Internal nail: 1st) Insertion of nail
2nd) Nail removal approx. a year later

Additional surgery from complications should also be taken into account.

Safest way to lengthen? No method is completely safe but if you ask me or most of the members/LL veterans they will almost certainly tell you that for femur lengthening only consider doing Internal Nails. External fixation on femur is not recommended due to high complication rates.
For tibia lengthening, you can consider external fixation, LON/LATN/LATP or internals, they all have advantages and disadvantages. It is best to do more research on this and make a choice that you feel comfortable with. The following topic on tibia lengthening should be very helpful to you http://www.limblengtheningforum.com/index.php?topic=342.msg5561#msg5561.

That slide show is really helpful!! A lot to think about! I need to think it over. Seems like external the whole time seems the safest route but its going to be no walk in the park for a whole year. I looked in that slide show there was 1 case of polio??? I have no idea what that is about. Maybe even more better to do the precise2 or 1 might be the most comfortable route but safety i am not so sure. The whole LATN is kind of obsolete? Because if your going to get a nail might as well just do it once and get precise or other internal. Instead of the LATN putting yourself throught 3 surgerys. Putting external, remove external, add nail, remove nail.

My worry with picking a doctor that is old is maybe when come time for me to have my final surgery he will retire and I might have to use someone else which could lead to higher rate of complication.

I see your deciding to do femurs and tibia? WOW that is alot of surgery. I hope everything works out for you too! You are one tough trooper to even consider that!

Polycrates. · « **Reply #18 on:** March 22, 2014, 11:07:10 AM »

Quote from: mackmack on March 22, 2014, 04:32:07 AM

Polycrates your response are really helpful! I hope your LL goes as planned and you get or got everything you wanted from it!

I am considering Paley purely because he is supposedly the best in the states?

I saw this gruesome story about LL with paley though but it was from 2002 and 12 years is a lot of time to hone your skills in LL.
https://sites.google.com/site/mycrippledleg/home/dr-paley-2-html

Not sure. In your experiences what is the safest way to LL? Externals require only 1 surgery. Internals Precice requires 2 surgerys and the scared feeling of anticipating the removal is going to be in the back of my mind for 1 year+?

Paley should have referred her to Sarin.

Disobedient · « **Reply #19 on:** March 22, 2014, 01:30:22 PM »

Quote from: mackmack on March 22, 2014, 04:32:07 AM

Polycrates your response are really helpful! I hope your LL goes as planned and you get or got everything you wanted from it!

I am considering Paley purely because he is supposedly the best in the states?

I saw this gruesome story about LL with paley though but it was from 2002 and 12 years is a lot of time to hone your skills in LL.
https://sites.google.com/site/mycrippledleg/home/dr-paley-2-html

Not sure. In your experiences what is the safest way to LL? Externals require only 1 surgery. Internals Precice requires 2 surgerys and the scared feeling of anticipating the removal is going to be in the back of my mind for 1 year+?

so 14 yrs ago Paley was just like any other Indian doctors ..!
hang on Indian docs you'de be like paley after some yrs ..

Polycrates. · « **Reply #20 on:** March 22, 2014, 02:20:42 PM »

No, diso. Paley is a made surgeon whereas Indian docs are born for it. I'm sure the Indians will pitch their precocious 4 year olds in a battle of surgical skill against Paley, expecting the child's intuition to guide him to overwhelming superior performance. Remember, in India, there is no such thing as a complication. Could Paley ever claim the same?

BilateralDamage · « **Reply #21 on:** March 22, 2014, 02:37:17 PM »

Quote from: mackmack on March 22, 2014, 04:32:07 AM

https://sites.google.com/site/mycrippledleg/home/dr-paley-2-html

I saw this site before choosing Paley too. Keep in mind, this was for a deformity she had and not any sort of cosmetic leg lengthening. I really hope she's doing better today, I couldn't imagine being in her position.

Disobedient · « **Reply #22 on:** March 22, 2014, 04:59:05 PM »

Quote from: Polycrates. on March 22, 2014, 02:20:42 PM

No, diso. Paley is a made surgeon whereas Indian docs are born for it. I'm sure the Indians will pitch their precocious 4 year olds in a battle of surgical skill against Paley, expecting the child's intuition to guide him to overwhelming superior performance. Remember, in India, there is no such thing as a complication. Could Paley ever claim the same?

why on the earth, every time I read this man's comment it looks to me as

!@#$%^&*(*&^%$#@#$%^&*&^%$# indian @#$%^&*()(*&^%$#@#$#$#$%^&*( serin *&^%$#$%^&*&^%$#$$$$India$$$^&*(*&^%$#@#$%^&*@#$%India^&**((^^^^%$#

Thanks God that I have an engineer's brain , so I could predict that he is making fun of indian docs ..

* this comment though, was quite easy to understand, except "precocious" , but his other comments are defiantly #$%^&*(&^%

RGKEY · « **Reply #23 on:** March 22, 2014, 05:18:36 PM »

Quote from: Disobedient on March 22, 2014, 04:59:05 PM

why on the earth, every time I read this man's comment it looks to me as

!@#$%^&*(*&^%$#@#$%^&*&^%$# indian @#$%^&*()(*&^%$#@#$#$#$%^&*( serin *&^%$#$%^&*&^%$#$$$$India$$$^&*(*&^%$#@#$%^&*@#$%India^&**((^^^^%$#

Thanks God that I have an engineer's brain , so I could predict that he is making fun of indian docs ..

* this comment though, was quite easy to understand, except "precocious" , but his other comments are defiantly #$%^&*(&^%

lol u funny

Polycrates. · « **Reply #24 on:** March 22, 2014, 06:32:46 PM »

I've become well versed in the ancient rhetoric during my time spent lamenting in India. I fear I might have become too abstruse even for myself. I sometimes find that I cannot understand what I've written once it's been forged...

mackmack · « **Reply #25 on:** March 25, 2014, 06:34:16 AM »

Amen.

onedayillgrow · « **Reply #26 on:** March 25, 2014, 12:06:45 PM »

Hi can somebody tell me what is the upper and lower boundary cost for limb lengthening. I'm just curious as to what is perhaps the most you can pay for say two surgeries and what is the least amount you can pay..

Thank you in advance.

shawty · « **Reply #27 on:** March 25, 2014, 12:52:28 PM »

Quote from: onedayillgrow on March 25, 2014, 12:06:45 PM

Hi can somebody tell me what is the upper and lower boundary cost for limb lengthening. I'm just curious as to what is perhaps the most you can pay for say two surgeries and what is the least amount you can pay.. Thank you in advance.

If you look through the Doctors list on the main page, you can see some of their price quotes. My estimate would be anywhere from 20K USD (maybe less depending on the country) - 200K USD (for both femurs/tibias)

MAN-OF-STEEL · « **Reply #28 on:** March 25, 2014, 01:14:31 PM »

To answer the topic, I thought LL is rather safe albeit if you choose the right doctors

onedayillgrow · « **Reply #29 on:** March 25, 2014, 10:41:57 PM »

Quote from: shawty on March 25, 2014, 12:52:28 PM

If you look through the Doctors list on the main page, you can see some of their price quotes. My estimate would be anywhere from 20K USD (maybe less depending on the country) - 200K USD (for both femurs/tibias)

Thank you Shawty. Only question is how the hell am i gonna amass 200K USD

Well not really, i'll be considering Guichet or Franz but still, amassing such a large amount.. Any ideas from anyone on how to get it? :p

mackmack · « **Reply #30 on:** March 27, 2014, 03:56:45 AM »

Quote from: onedayillgrow on March 25, 2014, 10:41:57 PM

Thank you Shawty. Only question is how the hell am i gonna amass 200K USD
Well not really, i'll be considering Guichet or Franz but still, amassing such a large amount.. Any ideas from anyone on how to get it? :p

You can win the lottery. You can ask a billionaire to give it to you. You can get a loan. You can sell your house and everything you own. Or you can work for it. Tons of ways

Limb Lengthening Forum

Author Topic: Are There Any Safer Ways To LL (Read 13241 times)