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[Zeo]

Being less than average and think that as a problem is reality, not bdd.
I don't want to comvince anyone, people at about my height know the truth amd thats why the majority of them has a problem with that height which is not bad bad not enough either to feel completely ok.
When I was shorter, like you, I thought that being 1.74-5 would lose all my problems and yes is it a much much better height than 1.68 but still you face problems on dating.
Only after 1.78-80 that kind of problems stop. And this is the harsh reality, not bdd.

So how much percentage of women would have to not reject you for your height for you to be ok with it? 90%? 100%?

So you are 5'9 and you say you don't have BDD, would you think that someone that is 5'10 and wants to lengthen has BDD?

I mean at 5 feet, one can argue that it is reasonable for a women say she rejects a man for his height. No one would call her overly shallow. But at 5'10 I think that most people will agree that if a women says hes too short then shes just being shallow and unreasonable. I would even say at 5'9.

the literal definition of BDD is "a body-image disorder characterized by persistent and intrusive preoccupations with an imagined or slight defect in one's appearance."

At 5'9 your height disadvantage can be considered minor. But you are still getting LL. This is why I say you have BDD.

Nothing wrong with that. I have BDD too. I am getting LL to get rid of my BDD and move on with my life.

[jexus]

That's because those are women from some of the tallest countries in the world. At 175cm/5'9, you'll be taller than the majority of women in the streets, even in those countries, and even if only by a few centimeters. 5'9 can't, by definition, be short, that being the case. Posts like "In my opinion anything above 5'10 is acceptable" only serve to feed into the height dysphoria of the majority of the members here, the most part who are 5'6 and below. In my opinion, anything above 6'1 is acceptable, as then you'll finally stop having problems not feeling tall compared to the women of the Dinaric Alps.

Are Turkish males taller now too? 175cm seems like a perfectly good height for the country. Do you still get height dysphoria?

I absolutely agree with you.

I believe the Turkish male average is really somewhere between 1.72-1.74 as the statistics show but it might be higher in big cities like Istanbul also young generation appears to be taller.

[Mw1245]

It does not have so much to do with the topic but mann i just saw it to many times today too many times i am really thinking i dont know anymore man saw to many tall guys with pretty girls tall girls short girls average girls while the average or short guys sucked dude just thinking about my prevous life where i thought u need to be gentle u need to be that to let the girl fell in love with u while the short guys thinked just about being loved and loved and the girls gucled at that time spribged from bed to bed being honest it makes me just bummm

[Body Builder]

So how much percentage of women would have to not reject you for your height for you to be ok with it? 90%? 100%?

So you are 5'9 and you say you don't have BDD, would you think that someone that is 5'10 and wants to lengthen has BDD?

I mean at 5 feet, one can argue that it is reasonable for a women say she rejects a man for his height. No one would call her overly shallow. But at 5'10 I think that most people will agree that if a women says hes too short then shes just being shallow and unreasonable. I would even say at 5'9.

the literal definition of BDD is "a body-image disorder characterized by persistent and intrusive preoccupations with an imagined or slight defect in one's appearance."

At 5'9 your height disadvantage can be considered minor. But you are still getting LL. This is why I say you have BDD.

Nothing wrong with that. I have BDD too. I am getting LL to get rid of my BDD and move on with my life.

Imo if more than 10-20% max of women reject for one and only specific trait then this trait is a major drawback that must be solved (if it could).
And an 5.9 (5.85 to be more specific as this is my evening height) is being rejected for his height for at least 30-40% of women and for the majority of the other percentage he should be really good to being prefered than an average tall man.

So I insist that I don't have bdd, I just face the reality where being not taller than average makes your dating life much harder than it should.
You don't need to be tall, you just need to be completeley average and a little more to never have any problem with height again.
And for my country that height is 1.78 which trust me, it has a big difference compared to my 1.74 for women.
Believe it or not that almost 2 inches are changing the game between strugling with women due to your height and have almost any woman you want never think again about your height. So yes, hiting a solid 1.80 is really lifechanging amd thats the reality, not a kind of bdd.

It is different to not like your body when it is fine than not like your body when it gives you troubles. The first IS bdd, the second is consciousness.
And my case, as the majority of cases of men less than average height, is clearly the second.

[The Dreamer]

Imo if more than 10-20% max of women reject for one and only specific trait then this trait is a major drawback that must be solved (if it could).
And an 5.9 (5.85 to be more specific as this is my evening height) is being rejected for his height for at least 30-40% of women and for the majority of the other percentage he should be really good to being prefered than an average tall man.

So I insist that I don't have bdd, I just face the reality where being not taller than average makes your dating life much harder than it should.
You don't need to be tall, you just need to be completeley average and a little more to never have any problem with height again.
And for my country that height is 1.78 which trust me, it has a big difference compared to my 1.74 for women.
Believe it or not that almost 2 inches are changing the game between strugling with women due to your height and have almost any woman you want never think again about your height. So yes, hiting a solid 1.80 is really lifechanging amd thats the reality, not a kind of bdd.

It is different to not like your body when it is fine than not like your body when it gives you troubles. The first IS bdd, the second is consciousness.
And my case, as the majority of cases of men less than average height, is clearly the second.

This is bullsh-it
You're experiencing BDD like all of us.Don't think you're special or different.
BDD is psychological and is almost all caused by an absurd view of society.
You had a perfect functionally body and choose to do LL for achieving social "benefits".Which almost all of users here are seeking it.Not because someone is saying himself at mirror and thinking "what an ugly body"

[Android]

I would like to point out that BDD isn't something we all have just because we're on a forum about CLL. A lot of us here could happily live with short stature, but believe that CLL would make life even better.

BDD is debilitating, it's related to OCD (the clinical kind, not the "oh man, I'm so OCD about arranging my movie collection" type of casual OCD). Case in point, a person with BDD will avoid social situations or obsess about their features throughout the day without a break. They may wear clothing to cover up their bodies, get multiple cosmetic surgeries, and still feel miserable. There are people spending hundreds of thousands to look like celebrities, basically other people, so that they feel comfortable in their skin.

This is unlike most people who get surgeries and forget that they ever got it done (like some of our veterans here, along with many who get Botox injections, breast implants, liposuction, hair transplants, etc.). In contrast, BDD is believed to be incurable even with treatment -- you scrutinize the results or move onto a new "problem."

If you're curious, take the test here. You can also take a test in which you can get a personalized reply from a researcher as well.

I'm not certain but I don't think that Body Builder has BDD. He has strong dislike for short stature and thinks a lot about it, but I doubt he's turning down hanging out with friends because he's afraid that they're going to judge his height, face, bicep size, etc.

Just wanted to share my two cents as to not dilute the weight of real BDD, as is the case for OCD. Let's remember that we have a word just for us, a condition that's a lot milder in comparison: height neurosis. There's a good chance that we all share this one!

[Body Builder]

I would like to point out that BDD isn't something we all have just because we're on a forum about CLL. A lot of us here could happily live with short stature, but believe that CLL would make life even better.

BDD is debilitating, it's related to OCD (the clinical kind, not the "oh man, I'm so OCD about arranging my movie collection" type of casual OCD). Case in point, a person with BDD will avoid social situations or obsess about their features throughout the day without a break. They may wear clothing to cover up their bodies, get multiple cosmetic surgeries, and still feel miserable. There are people spending hundreds of thousands to look like celebrities, basically other people, so that they feel comfortable in their skin.

This is unlike most people who get surgeries and forget that they ever got it done (like some of our veterans here, along with many who get Botox injections, breast implants, liposuction, hair transplants, etc.). In contrast, BDD is believed to be incurable even with treatment -- you scrutinize the results or move onto a new "problem."

If you're curious, take the test here. You can also take a test in which you can get a personalized reply from a researcher as well.

I'm not certain but I don't think that Body Builder has BDD. He has strong dislike for short stature and thinks a lot about it, but I doubt he's turning down hanging out with friends because he's afraid that they're going to judge his height, face, bicep size, etc.

Just wanted to share my two cents as to not dilute the weight of real BDD, as is the case for OCD. Let's remember that we have a word just for us, a condition that's a lot milder in comparison: height neurosis. There's a good chance that we all share this one!

Very well said.
Some people here think that the fact that we don't like our heights due to the problems that cause to our social life (epsecially on dating) mean that we are some crazy weirdos that have bdd and are miserable and hate ourselves.

Thats bs.
I just hated my initial height and still think my current height as a drawback. I am completely ok with myself, I am very social and I like and care a lot about my body amd I don't want to change anything else except from my height, which is still less than average by 3-4 cm.
So only a fool would believe that someone who wants to change something in his appearance, even height which is so extreme but so important too, suffer from bdd.

The fact that we want to fix something in our appearance which is not as good as it should (or as we wanted to be) is healthy and means that we are not delusional or pessimistic but we fight for the best.
The majority of short LLers have not bdd, they have an objective drawback that they want to fix.
Nothing more sensible than that.

[extremis]

I would like to point out that BDD isn't something we all have just because we're on a forum about CLL. A lot of us here could happily live with short stature, but believe that CLL would make life even better.

BDD is debilitating, it's related to OCD (the clinical kind, not the "oh man, I'm so OCD about arranging my movie collection" type of casual OCD). Case in point, a person with BDD will avoid social situations or obsess about their features throughout the day without a break. They may wear clothing to cover up their bodies, get multiple cosmetic surgeries, and still feel miserable. There are people spending hundreds of thousands to look like celebrities, basically other people, so that they feel comfortable in their skin.

This is unlike most people who get surgeries and forget that they ever got it done (like some of our veterans here, along with many who get Botox injections, breast implants, liposuction, hair transplants, etc.). In contrast, BDD is believed to be incurable even with treatment -- you scrutinize the results or move onto a new "problem."

If you're curious, take the test here. You can also take a test in which you can get a personalized reply from a researcher as well.

I'm not certain but I don't think that Body Builder has BDD. He has strong dislike for short stature and thinks a lot about it, but I doubt he's turning down hanging out with friends because he's afraid that they're going to judge his height, face, bicep size, etc.

Just wanted to share my two cents as to not dilute the weight of real BDD, as is the case for OCD. Let's remember that we have a word just for us, a condition that's a lot milder in comparison: height neurosis. There's a good chance that we all share this one!

This is more or less accurate.

First, BDD is an overdiagnosed umbrella term that is handed out like candy to everyone who shows up to a psychiatrist's office with a complaint about their looks, which in many cases is justified. Most people who are diagnosed with "BDD" regarding a particular physical feature (facial aesthetics, large nose/ears, baldness, short stature, etc) really ARE unattractive because of that feature.

Actual "BDD" wherein the person's "dysmorphia" is unfounded - i.e. the person actually DOESN'T have the flaw they perceive themselves to - is basically UNHEARD OF.

That isn't the case here. There's nobody on this board who is 6'5", but when they look in the mirror they see a 5'2" guy. The problem people have here is they're 5'5" (for example) and when they look in the mirror they see a guy who's 5'5", and when they go out with their friends or just alone they get treated like a guy who's 5'5" (i.e. like a walking punch line, butt of people's jokes, etc).

The problem with all these "psychology" terms like height neurosis or BDD or whatever is that they take the focus off of HEIGHTISM, which is what is actually causing people to perceive their short stature as a flaw and creating the "neurosis" in the first place. People don't just randomly start hating themselves because of a feature and develop mental illnesses for it. It's OTHER people's treatment of them that causes it.

[Android]

People don't just randomly start hating themselves because of a feature and develop mental illnesses for it. It's OTHER people's treatment of them that causes it.

Very true, everything is relative, many of our emotions are reactions to how others perceive us. Some of the most beautiful fashion models have self-image issues since they constantly look at themselves in the mirror and judge each other.

This is also why short people feel better when visiting countries with shorter people -- it's because the environment treats them much better.

[Zeo]

although the environment may play a part, honestly I think a lot of people on this forum just have a really bad victim mentality, and it gets worse when everyone here just encourages it

This place is horrible for your mental health

[Android]

although the environment may play a part, honestly I think a lot of people on this forum just have a really bad victim mentality, and it gets worse when everyone here just encourages it

This place is horrible for your mental health

Every person is different, in fact I haven't felt this good in a long time ever since becoming a contributor on the forums. Before I felt defeated, but now that CLL is within reach, I feel very much in control of my future. I no longer feel pinned by my genetics, and it's freeing.

[TIBIKE200]

This is more or less accurate.

First, BDD is an overdiagnosed umbrella term that is handed out like candy to everyone who shows up to a psychiatrist's office with a complaint about their looks, which in many cases is justified. Most people who are diagnosed with "BDD" regarding a particular physical feature (facial aesthetics, large nose/ears, baldness, short stature, etc) really ARE unattractive because of that feature.

Actual "BDD" wherein the person's "dysmorphia" is unfounded - i.e. the person actually DOESN'T have the flaw they perceive themselves to - is basically UNHEARD OF.

That isn't the case here. There's nobody on this board who is 6'5", but when they look in the mirror they see a 5'2" guy. The problem people have here is they're 5'5" (for example) and when they look in the mirror they see a guy who's 5'5", and when they go out with their friends or just alone they get treated like a guy who's 5'5" (i.e. like a walking punch line, butt of people's jokes, etc).

The problem with all these "psychology" terms like height neurosis or BDD or whatever is that they take the focus off of HEIGHTISM, which is what is actually causing people to perceive their short stature as a flaw and creating the "neurosis" in the first place. People don't just randomly start hating themselves because of a feature and develop mental illnesses for it. It's OTHER people's treatment of them that causes it.

This thread was asking about 5'7 and up and not 5'5 and down. I agree with you that 5'5 is rougher than 5'7 though..
  It is BDD when you have people 5'9-5'6 complaining that it is impossible to date and those heights (btw reddit short is full of a little below average height people complaining... Much more than shorter people).. I can sympathise with a 5'5 complaining that it is extremely tough to date or to get respect. But not with someone my height of 5'7.5 and up

[Skywalker]

My reason is my dad.  I'm 6'2", but he is 6'4".  I'm tired of him saying that I'm short (which is absurd by any metric other than his own height), and I want to be taller than him.

[Knik]

My reason is my dad.  I'm 6'2", but he is 6'4".  I'm tired of him saying that I'm short (which is absurd by any metric other than his own height), and I want to be taller than him.

wow, you're case is DRAMATIC. I advice you 15 cm in each segment to put one full head to your stupid father

[myloginacct]

wow, you're case is DRAMATIC. I advice you 15 cm in each segment to put one full head to your stupid father

Will that really be enough? At 217cm, he'll still feel short around the gigantism club.

He should do 25cm in both segments and be done with his BDD once and for all.

[myloginacct]

That isn't the case here. There's nobody on this board who is 6'5", but when they look in the mirror they see a 5'2" guy. The problem people have here is they're 5'5" (for example) and when they look in the mirror they see a guy who's 5'5", and when they go out with their friends or just alone they get treated like a guy who's 5'5" (i.e. like a walking punch line, butt of people's jokes, etc).

Isn't this reversed? There are hordes of users here who are short(er) but look in the mirror and see this 6 feet guy. You are, of course, right about the points of a man who's 5'5 and sees that in the mirror. That's someone who wants to solve a problem. However, how can we not say that all the men here who look at themselves in the mirror and don't see their "true selves" isn't partially also BDD? Think of all the comments about what height we were meant to be, the height we actually "feel" like, etc.

I'm not saying a lot of people aren't just looking at a problem and wanting to solve it, but there's also BDD involved for a lot of people here (including myself) - specially all the guys on the taller side of things. The problems their height bring to themselves are more in their heads than anywhere else.

EDIT: Fixed typos.

[Nathond1]

To be competitive.

I'm 5'8 (173 cm)

I live in the midwest, think gentrified middle class white communities all college educated 300k or more house. Think beautiful beautiful tall white girls, a model scout would have a hayday here.

The truth of the matter is, everyone in a high status environment (a nightclub, a big city, a large corporation, etc) is 6'+. Physical stature is an extremely important thing, in life, in dating, in being a man. at 5'8, 155 lbs, I'm simply too small of a male to be competitive in these environments. Sure, I can go out and have a good time, I can make it.. 5'8 isn't THAT limited, but let's be honest here and say that whatever speciousness I may possess gets the volume knob turned way down by my height.

And that's just not something I'm okay with in this lifetime. I work very hard. I have a good dating life, I'm very happy with my life.

But the simply fact of the matter is, I'm not competitive. Almost every man in these environments has atleast 3 inches and 30 pounds on me. It's not an insurmountable advantage, it's just not one I am willing to entertain when there's a solution. That's just who I am. I want to live my best life.

I don't think life is fair, and I don't think you should play by the rules. I'm actually a blessed person, I have a lot of good genetics to be thankful for, but that only in-satiates my lust to actualize some of these cosmetic, extra-curricular surgeries and pursuits. Why should I not fulfill my highest potential, if I'm so close to the top? Why should I be an unacceptable height for a certain type of beautiful women when I'm so close to being on her level or above?

I still have tens of thousands of hellos, and nice to meet yous to say. I'm 20. In double my lifetime on this earth, I'll only be a wealthier, stronger, more prime man. I'll probably even still be good looking at 55.

It just doesn't make sense to me, to choose to live an inferior life of being the same size as the beautiful girls you're trying to hook up with, to get girls, but to have them not really care about you and see you as someone valuable enough to pursue, when it's all defeated.. Completely defeated, with 3 inches, 5'11. And that's available to me with only the sacrifice of two years of my 70+ year life. That's just simply not in my nature. I want to be competitive in this lifetime.

I just honestly, all in all, believe in myself. I believe I'm worth it, and that money invested into myself will have great returns. Why shouldn't I pursue this, knowing that? Like I said, I have a lifetime of meeting beautiful like-minded people. I just want to roll up to as young and beautiful as I ever will be. If that's neurotic and narcissistic, it's ok, that's just what I'm going to do with my life.

[Nathond1]

oops

[myloginacct]

To be competitive.

I'm 5'8 (173 cm)

I live in the midwest, think gentrified middle class white communities all college educated 300k or more house. Think beautiful beautiful tall white girls, a model scout would have a hayday here.

The truth of the matter is, everyone in a high status environment (a nightclub, a big city, a large corporation, etc) is 6'+. Physical stature is an extremely important thing, in life, in dating, in being a man. at 5'8, 155 lbs, I'm simply too small of a male to be competitive in these environments. Sure, I can go out and have a good time, I can make it.. 5'8 isn't THAT limited, but let's be honest here and say that whatever speciousness I may possess gets the volume knob turned way down by my height.

And that's just not something I'm okay with in this lifetime. I work very hard. I have a good dating life, I'm very happy with my life.

But the simply fact of the matter is, I'm not competitive. Almost every man in these environments has atleast 3 inches and 30 pounds on me. It's not an insurmountable advantage, it's just not one I am willing to entertain when there's a solution. That's just who I am. I want to live my best life.

I don't think life is fair, and I don't think you should play by the rules. I'm actually a blessed person, I have a lot of good genetics to be thankful for, but that only in-satiates my lust to actualize some of these cosmetic, extra-curricular surgeries and pursuits. Why should I not fulfill my highest potential, if I'm so close to the top? Why should I be an unacceptable height for a certain type of beautiful women when I'm so close to being on her level or above?

I still have tens of thousands of hellos, and nice to meet yous to say. I'm 20. In double my lifetime on this earth, I'll only be a wealthier, stronger, more prime man. I'll probably even still be good looking at 55.

It just doesn't make sense to me, to choose to live an inferior life of being the same size as the beautiful girls you're trying to hook up with, to get girls, but to have them not really care about you and see you as someone valuable enough to pursue, when it's all defeated.. Completely defeated, with 3 inches, 5'11. And that's available to me with only the sacrifice of two years of my 70+ year life. That's just simply not in my nature. I want to be competitive in this lifetime.

I just honestly, all in all, believe in myself. I believe I'm worth it, and that money invested into myself will have great returns. Why shouldn't I pursue this, knowing that? Like I said, I have a lifetime of meeting beautiful like-minded people. I just want to roll up to as young and beautiful as I ever will be. If that's neurotic and narcissistic, it's ok, that's just what I'm going to do with my life.

Height doesn't matter that much if at 6 feet (or close to it) you're still giving off an aura of incredible, obnoxious narcissism. Just saying.

And someone tell Bill Gates he's excluded from the high status environments because he's not 6 feet.

[Nathond1]

Height doesn't matter that much if at 6 feet (or close to it) you're still giving off an aura of incredible, obnoxious narcissism. Just saying.

And someone tell Bill Gates he's excluded from the high status environments because he's not 6 feet.

You asked, I answered.

Don't be upset with me because I spoke powerfully and you couldn't relate to it.

The world isn't a fair place. Taller, better looking, narcissistic people will always have a better time than you, and they'll ignore you while they do it. So look to compete young man. There's men are willing to fk, and men women want to fk, and it's in your best interest to become the latter.

But all in all, everything is cool my man. I hope you have a good day. It's a silly measure at the end of the day, and not so serious. All will be ok either way.

[Body Builder]

To be competitive.

I'm 5'8 (173 cm)

I live in the midwest, think gentrified middle class white communities all college educated 300k or more house. Think beautiful beautiful tall white girls, a model scout would have a hayday here.

The truth of the matter is, everyone in a high status environment (a nightclub, a big city, a large corporation, etc) is 6'+. Physical stature is an extremely important thing, in life, in dating, in being a man. at 5'8, 155 lbs, I'm simply too small of a male to be competitive in these environments. Sure, I can go out and have a good time, I can make it.. 5'8 isn't THAT limited, but let's be honest here and say that whatever speciousness I may possess gets the volume knob turned way down by my height.

And that's just not something I'm okay with in this lifetime. I work very hard. I have a good dating life, I'm very happy with my life.

But the simply fact of the matter is, I'm not competitive. Almost every man in these environments has atleast 3 inches and 30 pounds on me. It's not an insurmountable advantage, it's just not one I am willing to entertain when there's a solution. That's just who I am. I want to live my best life.

I don't think life is fair, and I don't think you should play by the rules. I'm actually a blessed person, I have a lot of good genetics to be thankful for, but that only in-satiates my lust to actualize some of these cosmetic, extra-curricular surgeries and pursuits. Why should I not fulfill my highest potential, if I'm so close to the top? Why should I be an unacceptable height for a certain type of beautiful women when I'm so close to being on her level or above?

I still have tens of thousands of hellos, and nice to meet yous to say. I'm 20. In double my lifetime on this earth, I'll only be a wealthier, stronger, more prime man. I'll probably even still be good looking at 55.

It just doesn't make sense to me, to choose to live an inferior life of being the same size as the beautiful girls you're trying to hook up with, to get girls, but to have them not really care about you and see you as someone valuable enough to pursue, when it's all defeated.. Completely defeated, with 3 inches, 5'11. And that's available to me with only the sacrifice of two years of my 70+ year life. That's just simply not in my nature. I want to be competitive in this lifetime.

I just honestly, all in all, believe in myself. I believe I'm worth it, and that money invested into myself will have great returns. Why shouldn't I pursue this, knowing that? Like I said, I have a lifetime of meeting beautiful like-minded people. I just want to roll up to as young and beautiful as I ever will be. If that's neurotic and narcissistic, it's ok, that's just what I'm going to do with my life.

Good points.
I see it the same as you although my height was much worse than yours and I am just a bit taller than you after my first LL.
Now I feel normal but still not good enough to live as I 2ant to live and have the successes I want, especially on dating.
With another LL that I plan to do in maybe less than 2 years from now I'l become as you say "competitive" to all the men even of the top looks.

Anyway, well said.

[IwannaBeTaller]

The world isn't a fair place. Taller, better looking, narcissistic people will always have a better time than you, and they'll ignore you while they do it. So look to compete young man. There's men are willing to fk, and men women want to fk, and it's in your best interest to become the latter.

That's a little ridiculous. Good-looking people do not all have the dream lives you imagine them to have. They can suffer from depression, anxiety, uncertainty and catastrophic events just like regular people. A lot of women can still find shorter guys attractive, especially if they are "only" 5'8'' like you are. And the hottest girls aren't a million times better than average looking women. Like, sxx with an 8/10 isn't twice as good as sxx with a 4/10, that's not how it works (I personally don't use these number ratings, but you get what I mean).

Every successful person in the Midwest is tall? Even if that is true, it's different in different places, such as California, which, as some posters here have confirmed, is a great place for shorter guys, because of its ethnic diversity. People like Mark Zuckerberg aren't tall and have made it. I mean, I totally get where you're coming from, height has advantages and makes many things easier, but you take it way too far. It's understandable, you're very young, and it takes time to see the nuances....or not.

LL is an option, no denying that. But it carries huge risks and costs, not simply "it takes 2 years of my life and that's the only sacrifice" as you seem to believe, you can potentially cripple yourself and suffer pain for the rest of your life. Even if you go to the most expensive doctor available - look up the diary of Unicorn. If you feel "towered and dominated" by 6 feet dudes, just imagine how dominated you would feel if you knew they could beat you up and outrun you at any moment, because you have the mobility and physical condition of a 60+ year old. That might not happen, you might do fine after LL, but you might also not. Like I said, it's an option and you're free to do it. But think, think for a very long time.

[Midwest]

And someone tell Bill Gates he's excluded from the high status environments because he's not 6 feet.

Of course, you don't get excluded from high status environments simply for being short.  But it is easier to access and navigate such environments if you are over 6 feet.

[myloginacct]

You asked, I answered.

Don't be upset with me because I spoke powerfully and you couldn't relate to it.

The world isn't a fair place. Taller, better looking, narcissistic people will always have a better time than you, and they'll ignore you while they do it. So look to compete young man. There's men are willing to fk, and men women want to fk, and it's in your best interest to become the latter.

But all in all, everything is cool my man. I hope you have a good day. It's a silly measure at the end of the day, and not so serious. All will be ok either way.

It wasn't about what you said; I was merely giving you a serious tip for the future.

Of course, you don't get excluded from high status environments simply for being short.  But it is easier to access and navigate such environments if you are over 6 feet.

Heightism culture in the US is absolutely insane if people truly take this to heart. There are loads of successful American CEOs of Indian, Latino and East Asian background who aren't 6 feet. The most immediate examples of huge American CEOs that come to my mind, Jeff Bezos, Zuckerberg, and Satya Nadella aren't even in the 180cms tall. In fact, Jeff and Zuckerberg are 5'7, and Satya is 5'9.

[Midwest]

Heightism culture in the US is absolutely insane if people truly take this to heart. There are loads of successful American CEOs of Indian, Latino and East Asian background who aren't 6 feet. The most immediate examples of huge American CEOs that come to my mind, Jeff Bezos, Zuckerberg, and Satya Nadella aren't even in the 180cms tall. In fact, Jeff and Zuckerberg are 5'7, and Satya is 5'9.

No one is denying what you are saying.  Yes, Jeff Bezos is the richest man in the world, and he's only 5'7".  But he would have gotten there sooner if he was tall.

Let me put it another way.  If you were going to be making a business presentation before Jeff Bezos and other Amazon bigwigs, would you want to be 6'2" and Bezos be 5'7' or the other way around?  Of course, you would want to be the 6'2" guy if you had the choice.  And Bezos would want the reverse if he had the choice.

I don't think life is fair, and I don't think you should play by the rules. I'm actually a blessed person, I have a lot of good genetics to be thankful for, but that only in-satiates my lust to actualize some of these cosmetic, extra-curricular surgeries and pursuits. Why should I not fulfill my highest potential, if I'm so close to the top? Why should I be an unacceptable height for a certain type of beautiful women when I'm so close to being on her level or above?

There is no reason that you (or me or anyone) should not reach our highest potential, especially if we are so close to the top.  My height isn't quite as bad as yours, but I totally understand becuae I'm in a similar place.

[Body Builder]

That's a little ridiculous. Good-looking people do not all have the dream lives you imagine them to have. They can suffer from depression, anxiety, uncertainty and catastrophic events just like regular people. A lot of women can still find shorter guys attractive, especially if they are "only" 5'8'' like you are. And the hottest girls aren't a million times better than average looking women. Like, sxx with an 8/10 isn't twice as good as sxx with a 4/10, that's not how it works (I personally don't use these number ratings, but you get what I mean).

Every successful person in the Midwest is tall? Even if that is true, it's different in different places, such as California, which, as some posters here have confirmed, is a great place for shorter guys, because of its ethnic diversity. People like Mark Zuckerberg aren't tall and have made it. I mean, I totally get where you're coming from, height has advantages and makes many things easier, but you take it way too far. It's understandable, you're very young, and it takes time to see the nuances....or not.

LL is an option, no denying that. But it carries huge risks and costs, not simply "it takes 2 years of my life and that's the only sacrifice" as you seem to believe, you can potentially cripple yourself and suffer pain for the rest of your life. Even if you go to the most expensive doctor available - look up the diary of Unicorn. If you feel "towered and dominated" by 6 feet dudes, just imagine how dominated you would feel if you knew they could beat you up and outrun you at any moment, because you have the mobility and physical condition of a 60+ year old. That might not happen, you might do fine after LL, but you might also not. Like I said, it's an option and you're free to do it. But think, think for a very long time.

Having sex with an 8/10 woman is not 2 times better than doing it with a 4/10 woman, it is 100 times better.
To be more specific, having sex with a 4/10 woman is not even good most of the times for a man that respects himself and has good looks.

So no, being beautiful for a woman is much important and makes a huge differemce to be with a real good looking womam compared to a just average one.
For ugly women I don't care as I can't be attracted to them at all.
The same happens with the majority of women and really short men.

[TIBIKE200]

Having sxx with an 8/10 woman is not 2 times better than doing it with a 4/10 woman, it is 100 times better.

 This is one of the rare cases where I agree with you not 100% but 100000%.


Aside from that, you don't have to be a 10 in order to sleep with a 10. Nor do you need to be an 8 to sleep with an 8+.
 You need to look good enough. For each women it is different.
 If you are a really short man (5'5 and below) it will be very hard. If you are a little below average (bodybuilder's original height), and you have the looks, you will be able to sleep with hot cheeks no prob.

[YourSpaceBoyfriend]

If someone sex requirements towards women end at only looking good then i feel sorry for you lmao

[Body Builder]

This is one of the rare cases where I agree with you not 100% but 100000%.


Aside from that, you don't have to be a 10 in order to sleep with a 10. Nor do you need to be an 8 to sleep with an 8+.
 You need to look good enough. For each women it is different.
 If you are a really short man (5'5 and below) it will be very hard. If you are a little below average (bodybuilder's original height), and you have the looks, you will be able to sleep with hot cheeks no prob.

My original height was 1.68.
I think you mean my current height which is 1.75 (both morning heights) which is still not enough for the majority of really hot women unless you are rich and/or famous.
But yes, at my current height I can date some good looking women who I wouldn't at my initial height.
If I hit 1.80 I am sure that my pool date will be really large considering I am generally above average looking.
But I'll write my experiences when I'll do it.
For now I can only talk about the heights I've been and I am now.

Yourspaceboyfriend, attraction is the most important thing in dating and yes, a very good looking woman, unless she is dumb or have killer insticts, is what every man wants.
Not the only thing (apearance) but the most important, at least for me and the men I know.

[TIBIKE200]

My original height was 1.68.
I think you mean my current height which is 1.75 (both morning heights) which is still not enough for the majority of really hot women unless you are rich and/or famous.
But yes, at my current height I can date some good looking women who I wouldn't at my initial height.
If I hit 1.80 I am sure that my pool date will be really large considering I am generally above average looking.
But I'll write my experiences when I'll do it.
For now I can only talk about the heights I've been and I am now.

Yourspaceboyfriend, attraction is the most important thing in dating and yes, a very good looking woman, unless she is dumb or have killer insticts, is what every man wants.
Not the only thing (apearance) but the most important, at least for me and the men I know.

No. I meant that at your past height you could date hot women but it was harder than your current height. At your height I see no difficulty

[Body Builder]

No. I meant that at your past height you could date hot women but it was harder than your current height. At your height I see no difficulty

No Tibike.
At 1.68 is almost impossible to date hot women and while I had 2 really gorgeous gfs it happened because we were teens (the first I have her when I was not even 18 and the same her, for 3 years and the other one when I was 20 and she was 18 for 3 years again). If they were lets say 25yo they would never looked at an 1.68 man and even if they dud they would have been the veey rare minority.

At 1.74 (which I am most of the day) is still hard to be with a very good looking woman.
My current gf is about 6.5/10 and I like her but she can't match model looking girls I see everyday with tall men who most of the times have average looks (face and body) but they are just tall and with better than average style.

Anyway I've written all these before and my opinion is clear.
If it would have been easy to date the women I want at my height I wouldn't wanted another LL. But when many women are not attracted to me because I am not tall enough and moat of the good looking women I see everyday are with taller than average guys, things are obvious for me.