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[Want More]

They're always hiring on fish processors in Alaska. Most places start at $8.75 Alaska minimum wage but once you hit 40 hrs you work overtime and get a little over $13 USD hourly. If you work offshore your food and room is free, and you work 16 hrs per day 7 days a week as long as fish are coming in, so you hit overtime on your 3rd day of the week in most cases. You could save a pretty penny if you work hard for a few seasons. I was able to pay off hefty credit card bills doing it.

Also Norway has crazy high wages, get a job at an oil platform. Though right now there isn't much demand for workers I'm afraid.

If you really want to do this try to move to another country, the wages in Swizerland are incredible, but the rest of europe

Working fish processors is rough.  I worked on fishing boats in AK, WA, and CA.  Also rough work but better money.

Once you have a job in a western country, even internals shoudln't be a huge problem in terms of money I think.

Thank you guys for your advice,i have plan to go with student organization in april and back after 4 months to USA,becuse it's realy hard to go anywhere with Serbian passport.So i am not sure that i will get USA visa,but hope i will.
Anyway can we back to topic?
Does your height neurosis gone after LL? Any veterans?

[jfk]

Once you have a job in a western country, even internals shoudln't be a huge problem in terms of money I think.

Thank you guys for your advice,i have plan to go with student organization in april and back after 4 months to USA,becuse it's realy hard to go anywhere with Serbian passport.So i am not sure that i will get USA visa,but hope i will.
Anyway can we back to topic?
Does your height neurosis gone after LL? Any veterans?

I was 164 cm, now I am 172 cm. I still compare my height with others and still put in some insoles (less than before). Not much has changed. The only thing that changed is that I feel a little better around people because I am not that short anymore. Nothing changed the way people treat me. Not more interest from girls.

And I still want to be taller...

That is why I dont understand people who want to do 5 or 6 cm. Nothing will change for them in my opinion. Not even for me and I did 8 cm. At least that is my experience.

[microman]

how strange, i wore lifts to 170 before and was totally happy with my height.

[theuprising]

I was 164 cm, now I am 172 cm. I still compare my height with others and still put in some insoles (less than before). Not much has changed. The only thing that changed is that I feel a little better around people because I am not that short anymore. Nothing changed the way people treat me. Not more interest from girls.

And I still want to be taller...

That is why I dont understand people who want to do 5 or 6 cm. Nothing will change for them in my opinion. Not even for me and I did 8 cm. At least that is my experience.

People want to do less because of bio-mechanics, proportions etc. Proportions is not just about looks but how your body functions e.g femurs that are too long put a person at higher risk of arthritis. It's also how you compare to those naturally your height, say you are now 172 cm tall after LL but your knees are now as high as a guy who is naturally 180 cm for example. This disproportion is more unattractive than a guy who is shorter than average as he looks weird.

I remember a quote about LL saying how it's like a weapon that when used well it is invaluable but when used incorrectly has devastating long term consequences as we can't go back and do less once consolidated. 

[Cartman]

In my opinion, 50% of problems with height are real, 50% psychological. After a single surgery, a person could gain from 5 to 8 cm, which is not a lot, but these extra cms will give to that person the boost to overcome his problems (both real and psychological). Obviously, if a man is 160-165 cm he's really short, but I wrote in another post: if you feel short, you'll be short FOREVER, even if you are 190 cm tall!
For me, +8 cm means to become 173-174 cm tall... and that will be absolutely enough for me at the moment: at this height a man is not short and, if he wants to look taller, he can use small lifts in particular events (a night in a club, a marriage, job interview, ecc...) 

[endomorphisme]

There is no difference between 164 and 172 cm because you just go from very short to solid short, you re still short
Someone who is 183 cm and gain 5 cm will move from strong average to tall, the benefits are more noticeable

[jfk]

People want to do less because of bio-mechanics, proportions etc. Proportions is not just about looks but how your body functions e.g femurs that are too long put a person at higher risk of arthritis. It's also how you compare to those naturally your height, say you are now 172 cm tall after LL but your knees are now as high as a guy who is naturally 180 cm for example. This disproportion is more unattractive than a guy who is shorter than average as he looks weird.

I remember a quote about LL saying how it's like a weapon that when used well it is invaluable but when used incorrectly has devastating long term consequences as we can't go back and do less once consolidated.

I dont have any bio-mechanics problem nor any proportions problem. And not an arthritis problem...

You say a disproportionate person is unattractive but I think as long as it is not extreme no one will notice.
But I tell you what is definitely unattractive: Being short.

People here on this forum always talk about how it is not possible to go back and do less.
But I would like to go back and do more

[jfk]

There is no difference between 164 and 172 cm because you just go from very short to solid short, you re still short
Someone who is 183 cm and gain 5 cm will move from strong average to tall, the benefits are more noticeable

Yes that could be true. Any veteran here who could tell us more about that?

[jfk]

how strange, i wore lifts to 170 before and was totally happy with my height.

Good for you! But I would never feel really happy with my height unless I have really good height.
Of course I feel better with 172 cm. But lets be honest. It is still short.

With 180 cm I could say I am happy with my height

With shoes that would be 6 feet. That is a good height!

Good for your career, good for girls, good for everything

[Want More]

180cm now and 5cm more willl make me 185cm,with that i will be average in my country.And for sure i will not feel like shortest guy at night club and other similar event,becuse for sure always will be guy  shorter than me. And when i see girl 187(with heels)that will not be so bad becuse  she will be only 2cm higher than me,and i will not feel so much short. That is my opinion.

[microman]

Good for you! But I would never feel really happy with my height unless I have really good height.
Of course I feel better with 172 cm. But lets be honest. It is still short.

you are entitled to your opinion but 172/5 8 is the 25th percentile. so are you saying that if you are a room with 20 men that 5 of them are short (which seems too high a number to me), and you also saying that 1 in 4 men are short, if so then by that definition a lot of men are short, 170 seems perfectly fine to me, never been 172 myself yet but after my op i can wear lifts to that height to see what it's like.

i defenetily felt 10x more normal when i wore 4cm lifts to go from 165 to 169, beyond that not sure how much i cared about being taller, not a whole lot but would like a couple more cms

[Want More]

With 180 cm I could say I am happy with my height
With shoes that would be 6 feet. That is a good height!

Good for your career, good for girls, good for everything
[/quote]

Why you think that your carer will be better if you are taller? unless you are basketball or volleyball player?
Nicolas Sarkozy,Vladimir Putin,Tom Cruise,Kevin Hart,Bernie Ecclestone,they are all short,look Nick Vujacic.
Then you will realise that for good career you don't need height,just need good brain

[Want More]

Good for you! But I would never feel really happy with my height unless I have really good height.
Of course I feel better with 172 cm. But lets be honest. It is still short.

With 180 cm I could say I am happy with my height

With shoes that would be 6 feet. That is a good height!

Good for your career, good for girls, good for everything

Why you think that your carer will be better if you are taller? unless you are basketball or volleyball player?
Nicolas Sarkozy,Vladimir Putin,Tom Cruise,Kevin Hart,Bernie Ecclestone,they are all short,look Nick Vujacic.
Then you will realise that for good career you don't need height,just need good brain

[Uppland]

There is no difference between 164 and 172 cm because you just go from very short to solid short, you re still short
Someone who is 183 cm and gain 5 cm will move from strong average to tall, the benefits are more noticeable

In a sense I agree because the closer you are to average the more men you will "pass" by lengthening. Say a majority of average men a clumped around 180 then going from 177 to 183 would have you pass more men than going from 167-173 even though you'd be moving up the percentiles faste in the latter case.

Still I think it'll have a larger real life impact to go from short to "below average", men between 175-185 are all over the place but short men stand out.

Also to be "tall" you will have to clear that clump around the average, in a country where the average is 180, 185+ would be the bare minimum to be considered tall but after that the number of men your height will shrink quickly.

[Want More]

to be honest being in serbia sucks for me.. because i feel shorter here at 185 than i use to back home at 181. because everyones so tall.. but it doesnt bother me cause this is only temporary being here. It depends what ur use to.. ill only know for sure once i get back to my hometown if its gone or not.. id say it will as il be 3inches taller than averge.. in serbia im in the 50th percentile at 185 lol.. when i was probably in 70 percentile back home at 181.. id say if ur use to being below average where u live and will become average than it will go.. but i cant say for sure..

If you were Serbian with 185cm,would you consider second surgery?

[Descreteuser]

In a sense I agree because the closer you are to average the more men you will "pass" by lengthening. Say a majority of average men a clumped around 180 then going from 177 to 183 would have you pass more men than going from 167-173 even though you'd be moving up the percentiles faste in the latter case.

Still I think it'll have a larger real life impact to go from short to "below average", men between 175-185 are all over the place but short men stand out.

Also to be "tall" you will have to clear that clump around the average, in a country where the average is 180, 185+ would be the bare minimum to be considered tall but after that the number of men your height will shrink quickly.

i think u have to be 3 inches above the average of ur country to feel and look noticeably tall to be honest..otherwise ull just look kinda average.. im dead on average in serbia i feel..it kinda feels like ive spent 6 months of my life and have lost an inch and half of height lol..ill be 3 inches above average in my country.. which is 3 inches lower than the average height here in serbia. depends what ur expectations are aswell.. if u come into this expecting to feel tall afterwards, which is my case, than unless u r well clear of the average in the area u r located u will be dissapointed.. im sure if i lived my life in serbia at my original height i would have felt short, and now id be happy with feeling average..which would be 'want more's' case... it all depends on ur life experience, and also what ur expectations are afterwards.. But i believe for 'want more' that if he wants to feel average afterwards in his country, than he will definitely achieve that getting to 185..

[Descreteuser]

If you were Serbian with 185cm,would you consider second surgery?

if i had to live here for the rest of my life and could never go anywhere else.. than yeah if i had the money and the time, id probably do it..cause i just feel way to average here.. and it would have defeated the purpose of doing the originaly surgery.. but remember u being 5'11 in serbia would be like me being 5'8 5'9 from where im from..so if what u want is to feel average.. than ull be satisfied..

[jfk]

Why you think that your carer will be better if you are taller? unless you are basketball or volleyball player?
Nicolas Sarkozy,Vladimir Putin,Tom Cruise,Kevin Hart,Bernie Ecclestone,they are all short,look Nick Vujacic.
Then you will realise that for good career you don't need height,just need good brain

It is senseless to mention examples of people who are short and successful. It is like saying you can be a bad player and still win the world cup. Of course not all the winners of the world cup are exceptional players. Or it is like mentioning 3 guys who are shorter than their beautiful girlfriends and say: You dont need to be tall to get a good girlfriend. Of course there are exceptions. There will always be exceptions. But if you think all the CEOs in the world got in their position because of their brain then you are very naive. 

There are studies that the taller you are the more you earn. Unfortunately that is a fact. Yes there are exceptions of course and yes you can have a good career without being tall but it is highly more likely if you are tall. Fact.
Just look at the average height of CEOs and dont tell me it is a coincidence that most of them are tall.

Or look at where you work. Is your boss really the guy who is the smartest of all the workers? There you have your answer.

[theuprising]

I dont have any bio-mechanics problem nor any proportions problem. And not an arthritis problem...

You say a disproportionate person is unattractive but I think as long as it is not extreme no one will notice.
But I tell you what is definitely unattractive: Being short.

People here on this forum always talk about how it is not possible to go back and do less.
But I would like to go back and do more

Every person on these forums who do big lengthening always believe they are the exception to the rule. What is your sitting knee height after doing 8cm on tibia? My point is compared to a guy who is naturally 172cm you are proportionally smaller in all your other bones and body parts even more so compared to the 180cm guy. Being short is unattractive but having that body on stilts look is even worse. There is no way I'd view some awkward looking taller guy as being more dominant than a guy who is shorter than him. 

[jfk]

Every person on these forums who do big lengthening always believe they are the exception to the rule. What is your sitting knee height after doing 8cm on tibia? My point is compared to a guy who is naturally 172cm you are proportionally smaller in all your other bones and body parts even more so compared to the 180cm guy. Being short is unattractive but having that body on stilts look is even worse. There is no way I'd view some awkward looking taller guy as being more dominant than a guy who is shorter than him.

Of course my knee height is more compared to a guy who is 172 cm! This is just logical The point is: No one in the real world notices! But people notice my height. That is for sure. If any veteran on this forum got rejected from a girl or did not get a job or a promotion because of his knee height/weird proportions then I will say you are right! I highly doubt that something like this ever occured. But ask how many people got bad comments about their height or did not get a girl because of his height.

My point is: As long as you dont overdo it no one ever notices your proportions. Height wins over proportions as long as you dont overdo it.

There are some people with naturally weird proportions but NO ONE ever noticed that outside of this forum.

[Uppland]

Of course my knee height is more compared to a guy who is 172 cm! This is just logical The point is: No one in the real world notices! But people notice my height.

They do notice they just don't mention it, just like you don't tell a person who is kind of ugly that "hey, you got a weird face, your proportions are all off". Sure they won't deduce that you've had surgery done and they might very well view you as normal but you won't look as good as someone who naturally grew to your new height.

If your face became slightly more assymetrical right now would peaople call you out on it? No, but they would notice, if only subconsciously.

[theuprising]

They do notice they just don't mention it, just like you don't tell a person who is kind of ugly that "hey, you got a weird face, your proportions are all off". Sure they won't deduce that you've had surgery done and they might very well view you as normal but you won't look as good as someone who naturally grew to your new height.

If your face became slightly more assymetrical right now would peaople call you out on it? No, but they would notice, if only subconsciously.

^This^

Once again it's only on LL forums that people think that the rest of the world is oblivious to the fact they look different to a person naturally their post LL height. Women in particular notice these things and if they think people aren't noticing it's delusional. The people who have naturally weird proportions may have really long arms for example. LL patients tend to have bodies in a category all their own. I've seen patients go from 165cm to 180cm and that type of body simply doesn't happen in nature.

The trade off with LL is looking more like a person who is naturally taller but gaining less height or gaining more height but looking further from what is a normal human body.

[jfk]

They do notice they just don't mention it, just like you don't tell a person who is kind of ugly that "hey, you got a weird face, your proportions are all off". Sure they won't deduce that you've had surgery done and they might very well view you as normal but you won't look as good as someone who naturally grew to your new height.

If your face became slightly more assymetrical right now would peaople call you out on it? No, but they would notice, if only subconsciously.

You are right I would not say anything. But if you ask someone you trust they would tell me.

How often did you look at someone who had LL and thought he looks as if he never has done LL? I do, very often! What I want to say is if you do not even see that someone had LL how could other people? Most people I saw after LL look pretty normal to me.

So you say they do notice. I say they dont. That is why I asked people who know about the surgery and would tell me if the proportions were off. They say it looks pretty normal to them. Do all of them lie? I say they dont notice. Most of it happens in YOUR head.

Before you knew about this operation and site, how often did you see someone and thought: He has strange proportions?
I never have. Not a single time.

People just dont pay attention that closely to these things. 

[jfk]

^This^

Once again it's only on LL forums that people think that the rest of the world is oblivious to the fact they look different to a person naturally their post LL height. Women in particular notice these things and if they think people aren't noticing it's delusional. The people who have naturally weird proportions may have really long arms for example. LL patients tend to have bodies in a category all their own. I've seen patients go from 165cm to 180cm and that type of body simply doesn't happen in nature.

The trade off with LL is looking more like a person who is naturally taller but gaining less height or gaining more height but looking further from what is a normal human body.

I can only repeat: Normal people dont notice and even if they do you would not see you any different.

I have a friend who I know for a long time. Since I knew about this site and read about proportions I noticed that he has pretty long arms. He is 186 cm and has very very long arms in my opinion. I never noticed that before. It is because I never paid attention to it. It is not delusional. How do you know people notice? Tell me one example how you know.

It is true that we are trading off. I gained 8 cm and my knee height is unusually high. But that is a trade off I love to do for more height

[Want More]

I can only repeat: Normal people dont notice and even if they do you would not see you any different.

I have a friend who I know for a long time. Since I knew about this site and read about proportions I noticed that he has pretty long arms. He is 186 cm and has very very long arms in my opinion. I never noticed that before. It is because I never paid attention to it. It is not delusional. How do you know people notice? Tell me one example how you know.

It is true that we are trading off. I gained 8 cm and my knee height is unusually high. But that is a trade off I love to do for more height

No one except us(LL forum) will not care about proportion. But i think it is better to be average height for your region and 15cm shorter armspan than be 15cm under average with great proportion.

[Penguinn]

After a certain point of lengthening your proportions become noticeable.

As in I'm 5'2, have kinda short legs. I'll look fine lengthening to 5'5, but 5'8? Come on, I'm not that naive.. I'd look like a dwarf on stilts lol. After 5'5 my proportions start going downhill. Be honest and find the right mark for yourself.

[Want More]

After a certain point of lengthening your proportions become noticeable.

As in I'm 5'2, have kinda short legs. I'll look fine lengthening to 5'5, but 5'8? Come on, I'm not that naive.. I'd look like a dwarf on stilts lol. After 5'5 my proportions start going downhill. Be honest and find the right mark for yourself.

No man,don't have  problem with proportion becuse my armspan is 9cm longer than my height,and have short legs.

[Penguinn]

No man,don't have  problem with proportion becuse my armspan is 9cm longer than my height,and have short legs.

Lucky you. Everyone has a mark beyond which they look weird though.

[Medium Drink Of Water]

I think the mindset of the height neurosis lives on even after LL.  I'm still comparing myself to other peoples' heights and still jealous of or even intimidated by taller people.  However, it's gotten much better because there are fewer people taller than me now.  I'm not always the shortest person around anymore.

[Want More]

If you live in USA,that mean that you are average?
Does your life improve,mean dating with girls and other thing?

[Uppland]

I think the mindset of the height neurosis lives on even after LL.  I'm still comparing myself to other peoples' heights and still jealous of or even intimidated by taller people.  However, it's gotten much better because there are fewer people taller than me now.  I'm not always the shortest person around anymore.

You need to reach a height that you are comfortable with, if I were 185CM it wouldn't bother me if some people were taller because I'd know that my height isn't objectively short. Height in a social setting and in life is about meeting a threshold -after that returns diminish rapidly. I would say that threshold is usually slightly above average like 3-4CM or so.