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[Del]

I have two main options: Dr. Mangal Parihar and Dr. Dror Payley. I'll list the pros:

Dr. Mangal Parihar
-In my city! I get to go home! No air travel, hassles etc.
-Good doctor. KiloKhan had a good experience with him.
-Less than half the price of Paley.

Dr. Dror Paley
-Best or one of the best doctors for LL.
-Parents ready to pay.

[drewicz]

Hah.. if parents can pay. go to Paley.

[Del]

Hah.. if parents can pay. go to Paley.

That's what I was thinking. I just need to ask when he'll let me go home. Staying in Florida for weeks/months is a giant task because of the hotel prices and neither my mom or dad being able to stay with me.

[crimsontide]

this  has to be a joke

Unless you wanna be wearing cages around your legs for a year, go to Paley

India has some very beautiful women, good food, and friendly people, but it's a third world nation

Go to Paley

[Del]

this  has to be a joke

Unless you wanna be wearing cages around your legs for a year, go to Paley

India has some very beautiful women, good food, and friendly people, but it's a third world nation

Go to Paley

That doesn't mean all doctors are bad. A bit of generalization there.

[Sean Connery]

I will play devil's advocate and say you should go with Dr Parihar. It's not like you are asking if you should go with Sarin vs Paley lol.

If you look at Parihar's page it says he has been lengthening since 1992. That is 23 years experience. For fun, after you made this topic I looked up Parihar's curriculum vitae online and his cv from years back shows that he is constantly involved in leg lengthening lectures and workshops.

http://www.oocities.org/capecanaveral/lab/4597/cv_20081023.pdf

So as to qualifications there should be no worry that you're going to a doctor who knows what he's doing.

As you said, Kilokahn's diary is positive about him.

You don't have to go externals with Parihar. You can do LON for 6 cm and only need to wear the frames for 3 months or so. Or on Parihar's page it says he offers Precice now so you don't even have to wear cages at all.

Also consider cost. The price difference is enormous. Not only are you paying a **** ton of money for the actual procedure with Paley, but physiotherapy is gonna be really pricey. Plus you have to consider how much Paley will charge you for fixing complications, as well as paying for where your family will stay. Your family may also have to apply for a visa just to get into the USA too.

Another question with cost, just because your family can afford Paley does that mean that they should pay all that extra for Paley? It's going to be a much bigger financial burden on your parents when they could possibly use that money for other things like emergencies or whatever.

Location also matters. Parihar is right where you are. Paley is an 18 hour flight away from you. When you fly home still unable to walk because Precice isn't weight bearing, it's going to suck major and be really uncomfortable for you.


Personally I'm not too big a fan of Paley. At first I was on the Paley bandwagon but the more I read about him the more I disliked. He comes off as a total jerk and the greatest self promoter out of any doctor you could possibly choose...

Who exactly declared him the best orthopedic surgeon in the world? Was there a board of doctors that decided this?

Nobody on a forum is qualified to declare "world's best doctor" so those who say he is on here are basing it on what? Sure Paley is technically one of the most experienced, even though he hasn't even been lengthening the longest because Dr Catagni in Italy taught him things, but there is more to it that makes a great doctor. Paley gets a lot of positive reviews, but take a look at all the really bad reviews of Paley on Vitals about the kind of crap you might have to put up with if you see him.

Here's a few examples...

"STAY AWAY FROM THIS DOCTOR. The biggest mistake of me seeing Dr. Paley trying to make myself walk better. First visit wait 9 hours to see him and he spent 10 mintues with me about one surgery to fix my problem. I had 5 surgeries with him and am worst. The worst mistake I ever made in my life. He missed up my bones that I'm unable to walk now."

"I'm not sure where to start, as I do not wish to disclose too many details of my case, in fear of litigation.But I would never recommend this doctor to anyone.Expect to wait 3 hours, minimum, for your visit, especially if you go in the summer. On Mondays, during clinic, the reception looks like a third world hospital, with patients being seen as late as 9 pm. All of us knew to pack lots of food and all of our prescriptions - this was tough to learn the first time around. Not at all comfortable if you're in a cast, in a wheelchair, etc.There are two PAs here, and one has an atrocious bedside manner. He has made horrible comments to me and most of the patients I knew felt similarly. One of the ortho techs made several inappropriate comments to me. The front receptionist is a barracuda - very rude. Emailing any of the staff for insurance questions, general questions, whatever - it's like emailing a black hole. Not very responsive.Again, I can't go into details, but what I witnessed while undergoing treatment...it was by far the worst time of my life. My trust in the doctor was severely violated. I saw serious violations of ethics. I saw gross ineptitude. Was it all worth it? I don't know. I still have severe pain and severe problems, and the original problem I sought help for wasn't alleviated. I will be searching out doctors elsewhere."

"Instead of informing us of the proper device that could have fixed my daughter's knee contracture which was due to his over-lengthening her leg, this "brilliant genius" wasted my time and money by prescribing two different costly braces over the span of a year that he clearly must have known were useless for patients with her condition, then finally had his tech attempt to make one that didn't work and didn't fit and sent us home without even checking it properly. The only knee brace that works for contractures was created by his former associate, Anil Bhave, in Baltimore at the RAIO PT clinic. Bhave has successfully treated thousands of patients with lengthening complications, including Dr. Paley's, with his Custom Knee Device. Dr. Paley neglected to inform us of this simple and obvious fact that could have saved us years of my daughter's young life and thousands of dollars to insurance and out of my own pocketbook. As it is, he pretty much ruined our lives."

"He schedules surgeries one on top of the other and is never around for the aftercare. I would never recommend anyone here. 8 months later and still too much pain and my knee doesn't bend as it used to. They promised me miracle results and said they wouldnt promise anything they couldn't deliver. Post surgery, he did not deliver and the staff just turned their backs when I had complaints. This guy needs to be knocked off his pedestal. Searching out other doctors."

"This doctor wouldn't even look at me when I spoke. I asked a question and he interrupted me, mam I need you to stay quiet because I am trying to talk to the patient. And I explained, I am his wife and I will be taking care of the patient, my husband, and he doesn't make decisions without me. I told my husband, something is wrong with this guy and we left and found a new doctor to fix my husband's ankle."

Etcetera, etcetera...

Basically you are going to be paying enough to buy a house in the USA for the Paley name, and that's still not going to guarantee good results. There's a guy on this forum who almost died with Paley because of fat embolism, so the notion that Paley is the be all end all choice is incorrect I think.

Yeah you can probably have complications with Parihar too but why pay more than double for Paley when there's the same sort of risk?

ANYWAY... rant over.

Edit: Just read that your family can't stay with you if you go with Paley. Yeah that's a no brainer for me if I were you. Don't choose him.

[Del]

Thanks, Sean. That was a bit too passionate of a rant. 

I don't buy the seriously negative reviews about Paley messing up bones. I agree with a lot of stuff you said though, like just because my family can pay a certain amount don't mean they should. Having family close to me and surgery in my city is priceless but I need to be 1000% sure that I'm going to be not in good, but phenomenal hands. Which is why I face self-doubt regarding anyone but the highly reputed doctors.

KiloKahn is one of the most legitimate and sincere people I've seen here but he could just be a good case. It's the only case I've seen from Parihar.

[Del]

Unless you wanna be wearing cages around your legs for a year, go to Paley

For the record I'd get PRECICE from Parihar if I picked him.

[crimsontide]

Parihar has never performed a surgery with PRECICE as far as I know

I would not wanna be the first patient for any DR.

[Del]

Parihar has never performed a surgery with PRECICE as far as I know

I would not wanna be the first patient for any DR.

He's done LON before multiple times. A nail is a nail..

[jfk]

For the record I'd get PRECICE from Parihar if I picked him.

What is his price for Precice?

[crimsontide]

no, a nail is not a nail

there are subtle differences between the two operations, and    a subtle  difference can have a major impact

If you don't mind being the first, that's fine... I wouldn't do it, especially in a third world nation

[Medium Drink Of Water]

Go to Paley if you can afford it, is what I think.  I went to the best clinic I could afford and think that should be what everyone does.

Even if both are skilled surgeons using the same device, the hospital and other amenities you'll get in the USA are going to be superior.

[Del]

What is his price for Precice?

"It's the cost of the nails plus surgery fee. I think you pay Ellipse Technologies directly after Parihar confirms with them that he needs them ordered. From what I last heard, it's roughly $30,000 USD for the Precice nails. Parihar might have a cheaper price for the surgery fee because you're local, but if it's the same it would probably be around 800,000 INR on top of whatever the nails cost."
-KiloKahn


800,000INR = $12,000 approx.

I like adding amounts for miscellaneous purposes so I would say $45K or so. A good hotel in India at about Rs.1500 a day, say $3K. Anywhere from 45 to 50K dollars, which is half the amount Paley and others charge.

If it worries you, Parihar is a phenomenal doctor. I think the amount is low because hardly anyone in India could pay $100K here except the very privileged. The only thing that's slightly off-putting is what Crimsontide said, it feels uneasy being the first to do Precice with Parihar.

[KrP1]

Let me think.... paley or parihar?  What the fk man! Go to paley right now!
If you dont want to pay that much you have some good doctors that use internals for half of his price. But if you could afford paley is the best option for LL

[KiloKAHN]

I don't think Parihar not having used the Precice before is as big a deal as one may think.

1) There was a Dr Birkholtz patient on here who was his first cosmetic Precice case. Seemed to turn out just fine.

2) Parihar isn't the type to experiment on people with things he's unsure about. As an example, I asked him if he would consider lengthening and then plating instead of LON so I could take the frames off earlier w/out the knee pain risk, but he said there wasn't enough data for plates in cosmetic use and he wouldn't experiment on me that way. He also won't do cross-lateral lengthening, won't do cosmetic forearm lengthening, and is very reluctant to do any cosmetic femur lengthening with externals. He also won't use the ISKD internal device because it's known for problems.

Point being that if Parihar were unsure about using Precice, he wouldn't offer it at all. He's a conservative doctor.


As for who you go to, I think either would be fine. The hospital will be nicer for sure with Paley, and he's had a lot of Precice patients. But there are some extra things to consider going to a foreign country without any family with you. That's a hurdle in itself because the whole lengthening process is largely mental.

[Del]

I think I'll make my decision after I meet Dr. Parihar. I know Paley is the second coming of Jesus with LL but the luxury of recovering at home with a lot of family members and saving half the money is just as good, if not better.

[aspirant185]

Keep in mind that the Indians are among the most intelligent people in the world, getting into medical school there is extremely competitive and only the best among the already very smart ones succeed.

Just because India is a ''third world nation'', based on the huge population and wealth inequalities, does not mean that the doctors are highly professional and competent.

Go to Parihar and then with your new height go on vacation to Miami

[Del]

Go to Parihar and then with your new height go on vacation to Miami

10/10

[Del]

Keep in mind that the Indians are among the most intelligent people in the world, getting into medical school there is extremely competitive and only the best among the already very smart ones succeed.

Just because India is a ''third world nation'', based on the huge population and wealth inequalities, does not mean that the doctors are highly professional and competent.

Go to Parihar and then with your new height go on vacation to Miami

I don't think it "means" anything though. We can speculate all we want but for these things statistics and factual data is very important. There are frauds like Sarin, then there's Parihar whom I've heard good things from multiple people and has videos on YouTube. Admittedly I don't understand what he says in those videos but he handles things like a boss...

I agree with you about the competence level of studies in India. I would wager the students here are more competent than ones abroad, but most of them leave India for US because of the economy. I don't blame them, I'd rather hold greenbacks in my hand than Gandhi's face too.

[Deepak Chopra]

Go to Paley. Parihar would practice in UK or USA if he was qualified in same way.

[KiloKAHN]

Parihar would practice in UK or USA if he was qualified in same way.

TIL that good doctors don't exist outside the USA or UK.

Also this: https://www.facebook.com/events/429262343888745/

Whose name do you see next to Dr Paley?

[aspirant185]

Go to Paley. Parihar would practice in UK or USA if he was qualified in same way.

What a piece of utter rubbish.

Parihar was born in India, went to school in India and is licensed to work in India. You cannot just go and work in the US or UK unless you either go to school there or pass thousands of certificates, which is absolutely pointless for him because obviously he makes good money and more or less is supposed to be able to live like a king in India.

I dont see any difference anyway between living in India or in the OK. The people you encounter on the street look the same way, just the ones in the UK are Pakistani (not Indians) and significant number of them are radical muslims.

Bottom line, if you find a way to make a tons of money in your native country, there is no really a reason to go abroad (especially to the UK )

[Penguinn]

What a piece of utter rubbish.

Parihar was born in India, went to school in India and is licensed to work in India. You cannot just go and work in the US or UK unless you either go to school there or pass thousands of certificates, which is absolutely pointless for him because obviously he makes good money and more or less is supposed to be able to live like a king in India.

I dont see any difference anyway between living in India or in the OK. The people you encounter on the street look the same way, just the ones in the UK are Pakistani (not Indians) and significant number of them are radical muslims.

Bottom line, if you find a way to make a tons of money in your native country, there is no really a reason to go abroad (especially to the UK )

Deepak Chopra holds a bias against non UK/US surgeons. I don't think he's going to change his mind anytime soon.

[aspirant185]

No doubt surgeons in this countries have access to outstanding education and technology. This is not to say that the ones in other parts of the globe are lagging behind.

P.S

I traveled from Greece to Los Angeles to have LASIK at one of the most famous surgeons in the world, that did the thing to so many celebrities and I am beyond happy with the results. The price tag for the best LASIK surgeons cannot exceed 10 000$ though (both eyes)...in contrast to the LL ones