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[OverrideYouGenetics]

wow, this is valuable information.
I was hellbent on doing Betz. Now I am more in favor of Guichet.

Agree that those abruptly ending diaries on old forum  were suspicious. Especially stillyoungs last post "yes, i am here" which probably was posted by sysOP.

[FrankGarrett]

This quote is very misleading! Very few people have the bone canal to naturally support the full 13mm nail. The only way Dr. Betz can make enough room for the 13mm nail is to ream the inside of your bone far more than is recommended for someone whose bone canal should have the 11mm nail.

There are plenty of patients who have had the 13mm and still bent or broke the nails and screws. Dr. Betz simply has his patients weight bear too early and often regardless of the diameter of the nail that is used for lengthening. There are so many examples within the Dr. Betz diaries (both hidden and out in the open) and countless more when you visit Dr. Betz in Germany and talk with his patients.

How long has the 13mm nail been around for?

[Metanoia]

Hello Frank,

Betz uses his own nails since 2011. The 13mm is of course better than the 11mm, however there are still many cases with nail bending and fractions even long time after finishing clicking.

[Who]

This is getting absolutely ridiculous how many patients need to get the titanium nail replacement with Dr. Betz! Absolute rip off over there at the Betz Institute that you have to pay $25,000 because the Betzbone constantly bends and breaks!

[BilateralDamage]

This is getting absolutely ridiculous how many patients need to get the titanium nail replacement with Dr. Betz! Absolute rip off over there at the Betz Institute that you have to pay $25,000 because the Betzbone constantly bends and breaks!

Seriously.  Why spend so much on crap that you'll eventually need replaced when you can just pay more upfront to start off with titanium? (ie PRECICE).

[BilateralDamage]

God, it's scary how many broken nails are being reported with the Betzbone.

Y'know what's even scarier?  That SysOp/Apotheosis continues to push it on old forum  when he's profiting off the misery of others.

[Rivers]

God, it's scary how many broken nails are being reported with the Betzbone.

Y'know what's even scarier?  That SysOp/Apotheosis continues to push it on old forum  when he's profiting off the misery of others.

Agree 100% with you! It's disgusting to watch Apotheosis/Sysop and Dr. Betz willing to make patients guinea pigs so they can line their pockets with money!

Trust me when I say the bent and broken nails and screws with the Betzbone are only the tip of the iceberg when it comes to complications with Dr. Betz and the Betzbone...

[LLL]

Trust me when I say the bent and broken nails and screws with the Betzbone are only the tip of the iceberg when it comes to complications with Dr. Betz and the Betzbone...

Tell us everything you know!

[bumky]

hello everybody,

I have been a member of old forum  since 2009. I was there when old forum  was running the forum, and when he gave the steering wheel to SysOp. I think the forum has changed a lot since its beginning, mostly this year. Lot of suppressed post, communication between members cut off. I don't trust it anymore. But I can remember it has  not been  always like that. I think old forum  was fair, and maybe Sysop at the beginning.

Anyway, I have some questions:

1/if this forum want to be fair and honnest, how will the traffic be funded and managed? old forum  got tired to supervise teh forum and I can really unserstand it. The involvement of SysOp (he is almost always connected, as a full time job.... ) is clearly suspect.

2/could we gather our knowledge about former patient (met in REAL please, after consultation) in order to guess rough statistics about the rate of complications.

The only thing I am 100% sure about Betz is Hanna's case, because I met her after the op, and whaen I saw her, she was ok. There were two others guys, one had a complication with the nail (bend/broken I don't remember)

3/ Have you ever heard/met some cases of extremes complications, like limb loss, paralysis, or serious similar handicap...?

[Muse]

1/if this forum want to be fair and honnest, how will the traffic be funded and managed? old forum  got tired to supervise teh forum and I can really unserstand it. The involvement of SysOp (he is almost always connected, as a full time job.... ) is clearly suspect.
 

- For the server's expense, it's not a massive sum as you may be led to believe,  $10-$20 monthly. It's not necessary for anyone to donate $2500 or whatever old forum  is asking for.

- Managing this forum,  we currently have 3 moderators and may add more, it's about having a group discussion to make decisions than anything else. 

- There's no need to supervise the forum when it's about open discussion and honest information regarding LL.   I trust members will eventually settle any difference in opinions between themselves like adults. 

You can find more information in the thread (Purpose of the Forum) and (Official Forum Guidelines) 

[somecm]

3/ Have you ever heard/met some cases of extremes complications, like limb loss, paralysis, or serious similar handicap...?

No, never heard. The worst cases I've heard were bent or broken nails, that were fastly solved with a surgery. It sounds that you cant trust 100% on Betznail but you can trust 100% on Dr. Betz surgery skills.

[Metanoia]

I beg to differ

I know of cases of bone infection. Further there are severe cases of compartment syndrome with long term nerve and muscle damage. Also in cases the nail breaks there are bone fracture and soft tissue damages. I know of people sitting in a wheelchair 6 months after breaking their nail.
Dr. Betz takes on patients who have been refused by other doctors because of their bone structure or -density. These patients end up with lifelong damages.

[masche]

Hi Mime,

what kind of bone structure or -density would/could lead to being refused LL?
Please share more of your knowledge (patient complications, etc.) - thank you!

[BilateralDamage]

OldieButGoldie, patient of Dr. Betz, posted this x-ray of his Left Femur today... his left femur looks bent a few degrees.  Can and should this be corrected?  OBG, if you see this and want the picture removed, just let me know.

[Medium Drink Of Water]

This is why they don't do internals in Beijing - you can't do corrections if something goes crooked, and they fix all complications for free.

But I'm sure Betz would be happy to straighten that leg out for $25000.

[Sweden]

I saw OBG's X-ray on old forum  and can't say I would be happy to have my femurs like that.
Hopefully nothing is wrong and he won't be affected of it but for a procedure that expensive it doesn't look so good.

Maybe it's the angle in one picture but it seems like there is a screw through the bone but not through the nail. It seems to go under the nail so the nail can rest on it.....
Betz should know what he is doing so I guess it's ok.

[Medium Drink Of Water]

Yeah, that screw that isn't screwed into anything is puzzling to me too.

Also, on looking at it more closely it seems that his bone is naturally bent.  The bend doesn't start until well below the osteotomy.  Maybe Betz can't correct it but it doesn't look like he caused it, if it's even something that should be corrected.  To be honest this is the first femur x-ray I've ever looked at.  Beijing is a tibia place so I'm a tibia guy.

[Generic]

Maybe it's the angle in one picture but it seems like there is a screw through the bone but not through the nail. It seems to go under the nail so the nail can rest on it.....
Betz should know what he is doing so I guess it's ok.

I seem to recall OBG mentioning something about Betz addiing it for extra support although he doesnt normally do it for patients, I think he previously had bent screws also?

[OldieButGoldie]

OldieButGoldie, patient of Dr. Betz, posted this x-ray of his Left Femur today... his left femur looks bent a few degrees.  Can and should this be corrected?  OBG, if you see this and want the picture removed, just let me know.

Wow guys, some wild comments and speculations going on in here. So let me comment on it: almost every human femur bone is bent a few degrees.
Perfectly normal. Cannot be corrected and -of course- should not be corrected.

[OldieButGoldie]

I saw OBG's X-ray on old forum  and can't say I would be happy to have my femurs like that.
Hopefully nothing is wrong and he won't be affected of it but for a procedure that expensive it doesn't look so good.

Maybe it's the angle in one picture but it seems like there is a screw through the bone but not through the nail. It seems to go under the nail so the nail can rest on it.....
Betz should know what he is doing so I guess it's ok.

Sweden, I don´t quite get what you mean by "I can´t say I would be happy to have my femurs like that". What exactly do you mean?
You saw the full-body-pictures in my diary and made some enthusiastic comment. Now this comment... I don´t get it...Please explain.

The screw underneath the nail is for extra support. It is well documented in my diary. I had my screws broken (probably too much activity), so in september Betz had to exchange the screws (he was quite shocked about the broken screws...) and -for extra support- he inserted this extra screw. Just in case.
The nail is not resting on it. But in september Betz was afraid all my activity might -in a very very unlikely worst case- break the screws again so he wanted me to be on the safe side.

[OldieButGoldie]

Yeah, that screw that isn't screwed into anything is puzzling to me too.

Also, on looking at it more closely it seems that his bone is naturally bent.  The bend doesn't start until well below the osteotomy.  Maybe Betz can't correct it but it doesn't look like he caused it, if it's even something that should be corrected.  To be honest this is the first femur x-ray I've ever looked at.  Beijing is a tibia place so I'm a tibia guy.

All answered in my above posts... 

[OldieButGoldie]

to summarize with a few words: everything is fine, I feel like I could lift a car with my legs and surgery is only 7 and a half months ago.
I would definitely go skiing tomorrow if there was more snow in my favourite skiing resort. Just easy skiing, like cruising on easy slopes, no moguls, no jumping.
I found it interesting to read the comments of the vets on my bone consolidation on old forum  but I disagree. I feel like my bones are solid, still -of course-
I would never do any heavy impact sports for now, but everything else it totally ok in my opinion.
Peace
OBG

[handy]

Wow guys, some wild comments and speculations going on in here. So let me comment on it: almost every human femur bone is bent a few degrees.
Perfectly normal. Cannot be corrected and -of course- should not be corrected.

OBG- The problem is only ONE of your femur bones is bent to such a degree that it is noticeable on the x-ray. That's the real problem and no it's not perfectly normal and it should be corrected!

If it was normal then both of your femur bones would be bent in the same way and they are not...

[Medium Drink Of Water]

Normal or not, that's how his legs were going into the surgery.  Since the straight part is being lengthened, the overall curvature of the femur will be lessened by the LL.  A corrective surgery would be totally separate from LL.

[handy]

Normal or not, that's how his legs were going into the surgery.  Since the straight part is being lengthened, the overall curvature of the femur will be lessened by the LL.  A corrective surgery would be totally separate from LL.

This kind of bad information is dangerous to people. You really don't know what the hell you are talking about.

Here is OBG x-rays BEFORE he bent his right femur bone.




Here is OBG AFTER he bent his right femur bone.




Just another example of how dangerous it is to lengthen with Dr. Betz. To think that Dr. Betz told OBG everything is fine is down right criminal! Anybody can see there is something seriously wrong with this x-ray and his bent right femur bone. Anybody except all the corrupt veterans on old forum  who said absolutely nothing about his bent femur bone since it came from Dr. Betz.

[Metanoia]

Hi Oldie,

Your left nail is bent as can be see in the front view .However it is only a few degrees, therefore you shouldn't be too much impacted. The bone consolidation looks good, but of course the 3rd screw in your right leg is a typical example of Betz tinkering. He is always tinkering with his patients. Anyway, you are one of the lucky Betz patients.

Handy, i think you are comparing the front view x-rays with the side view. It is indeed normal for the legs in the side view to have a more rounded shape.

[OldieButGoldie]

Sorry handy, but what you are writing is absolute bull  and I kindly ask you to stop spreading this nonsense and confusing people.
You are comparing x-rays from a front view with x- rays from a lateral view.
The natural -and normal curvature- of the bone can be seen on the x-ray with lateral view.
Let me put this clear again, although I am repeating myself: femurs bones are naturally bent!!
Yours, too, handy!!!
Everybody who has read my diary knows that I am not promoting any doctor, but this conspiracy thing -this time directed towards all the "bad" vets- really drives me crazy...

And one last time: nails can bend during lengthening, but not the bone!

[Medium Drink Of Water]

Handy, i think you are comparing the front view x-rays with the side view. It is indeed normal for the legs in the side view to have a more rounded shape.

Indeed.  Look at the angle of the screws handy, you are comparing two completely different aspects.

[OldieButGoldie]

Hi Oldie,

Your left nail is bent as can be see in the front view .However it is only a few degrees, therefore you shouldn't be too much impacted. The bone consolidation looks good, but of course the 3rd screw in your right leg is a typical example of Betz tinkering. He is always tinkering with his patients. Anyway, you are one of the lucky Betz patients.

Handy, i think you are comparing the front view x-rays with the side view. It is indeed normal for the legs in the side view to have a more rounded shape.

Hey Mime,
hope you are doing fine.
With all respect, I just stared for two minutes at the left front x-ray (visible on old forum ) and imo
it is really difficult to see this nail "bending" with the human eye. Even if it is bent for - let's say- 0,5 degree, it won't affect me at all. It has been like this for 5 months now.
I have been doing squats with 70kg in the gym for weeks and the nail is not bending one more millimeter because the bone has "taken over".

[Sweden]

I didn't mean anything was wrong, your walking looks good and everything.
It's just that your callus is a bit blurred/uneven and I can see you've put a lot of force on your legs. It doesn't matter I think, your callus will heal properly I guess.

Apo's callus looked much thicker. I guess it doesn't disturb the muscles being in that way.

Go to The Alps, there is snow right now 

[OldieButGoldie]

It's just that your callus is a bit blurred/uneven and I can see you've put a lot of force on your legs.

How can you see that a lot of force has been put on legs by looking at x-rays??