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[aspirant185]

[DoingItForMe]

The reason why I mention my wealth is because I wanted to explain that even if the tibia surgery was free, I wouldn't do it. I have the money to do tibia LL right now, but I rather burn the money than go through LL surgery again. It is just not worth it to do LL if you're going to end up in debt or if you're already average height. And I'm writing this because not only am I still in pain, but I just wasted a year of my life for this surgery, and I missed out on a lot of things because of it. If I could go back in time, I'd have told myself to not do it. I wish I had a great recovery like some of the other LL veterans. But I guess I drew the short straw. Too late now for me to undo my mistake. But it's not too late for some of you to reconsider forgetting LL and moving on with your life. I guess that's the reason why I'm still on this forum. To give you guys a real look at what recovery is like when you're not one of the lucky ones. And also to give you a real look at what your life could be like without LL even though you're short like me. It ain't actually that bad to be honest. I mean I had the life that even tall guys dreamed of. Life is a bit harder as a short guy. I will not deny that. But LL is way more painful than the occasional short jokes/discrimination/rejections thrown at you. Be stronger than me and don't succumb to your height neurosis.

[applesandoranges]

The reason why I mention my wealth is because I wanted to explain that even if the tibia surgery was free, I wouldn't do it. I have the money to do tibia LL right now, but I rather burn the money than go through LL surgery again. It is just not worth it to do LL if you're going to end up in debt or if you're already average height. And I'm writing this because not only am I still in pain, but I just wasted a year of my life for this surgery, and I missed out on a lot of things because of it. If I could go back in time, I'd have told myself to not do it. I wish I had a great recovery like some of the other LL veterans. But I guess I drew the short straw. Too late now for me to undo my mistake. But it's not too late for some of you to reconsider forgetting LL and moving on with your life. I guess that's the reason why I'm still on this forum. To give you guys a real look at what recovery is like when you're not one of the lucky ones. And also to give you a real look at what your life could be like without LL even though you're short like me. It ain't actually that bad to be honest. I mean I had the life that even tall guys dreamed of. Life is a bit harder as a short guy. I will not deny that. But LL is way more painful than the occasional short jokes/discrimination/rejections thrown at you. Be stronger than me and don't succumb to your height neurosis.

I appreciate your comment. But what if I can go from 169cm to 173cm, just a 4cm safe gain. I can also work from my laptop throughout the whole recovery, so it's not that much of a waste of time. I think the advantages of being average height at 173cm is worth it compared to being 169cm. Also, the $30-50,000 isn't too much money compared to a car, or a college degree. I'd say it would have more positive impact than those. If you're still in pain, then I agree it's not worth it. I would never do this if I had pain in my legs forever. But, most people who have done LL at a safe length at 5cm or under, say they do not experience permanent pain, only decreased athletic ability. So for me, I think it's worth it.

[DoingItForMe]

I appreciate your comment. But what if I can go from 169cm to 173cm, just a 4cm safe gain. I can also work from my laptop throughout the whole recovery, so it's not that much of a waste of time. I think the advantages of being average height at 173cm is worth it compared to being 169cm. Also, the $30-50,000 isn't too much money compared to a car, or a college degree. I'd say it would have more positive impact than those. If you're still in pain, then I agree it's not worth it. I would never do this if I had pain in my legs forever. But, most people who have done LL at a safe length at 5cm or under, say they do not experience permanent pain, only decreased athletic ability. So for me, I think it's worth it.

Yea, it ain't that bad. I probably would have had a safe recovery if I stopped at 5 cm. But who knows? Only thing I would say is that you will not get much work done during lengthening. I spoke with the other LL patients and they all had trouble getting work done including myself. It's possible, but it isn't easy. Your mood would be much better if you just focused on the recovery.

[chineseguy]

DIFM

Do you think it is because you lengthen too much that cause you trouble?   I believe that everyone who stop at 5 cm can have a good recovery

[TIBIKE200]

The reason why I mention my wealth is because I wanted to explain that even if the tibia surgery was free, I wouldn't do it. I have the money to do tibia LL right now, but I rather burn the money than go through LL surgery again. It is just not worth it to do LL if you're going to end up in debt or if you're already average height. And I'm writing this because not only am I still in pain, but I just wasted a year of my life for this surgery, and I missed out on a lot of things because of it. If I could go back in time, I'd have told myself to not do it. I wish I had a great recovery like some of the other LL veterans. But I guess I drew the short straw. Too late now for me to undo my mistake. But it's not too late for some of you to reconsider forgetting LL and moving on with your life. I guess that's the reason why I'm still on this forum. To give you guys a real look at what recovery is like when you're not one of the lucky ones. And also to give you a real look at what your life could be like without LL even though you're short like me. It ain't actually that bad to be honest. I mean I had the life that even tall guys dreamed of. Life is a bit harder as a short guy. I will not deny that. But LL is way more painful than the occasional short jokes/discrimination/rejections thrown at you. Be stronger than me and don't succumb to your height neurosis.

You said in your comments on my post that they height discrimination is real  and not just in our heads... I think that you just need more patience... It takes time...

[aspirant185]

I appreciate your comment. But what if I can go from 169cm to 173cm, just a 4cm safe gain. I can also work from my laptop throughout the whole recovery, so it's not that much of a waste of time. I think the advantages of being average height at 173cm is worth it compared to being 169cm. Also, the $30-50,000 isn't too much money compared to a car, or a college degree. I'd say it would have more positive impact than those. If you're still in pain, then I agree it's not worth it. I would never do this if I had pain in my legs forever. But, most people who have done LL at a safe length at 5cm or under, say they do not experience permanent pain, only decreased athletic ability. So for me, I think it's worth it.

I don't think that it is worth to spend 30-50 000 to go from 169 to 173. The difference will be negligible, even the statistical change will be very low, like you would go from sth like bottom 25% to bottom 35-40%, is it really worth it, to break both your legs and spend 30-50 k for that ?

[applesandoranges]

I don't think that it is worth to spend 30-50 000 to go from 169 to 173. The difference will be negligible, even the statistical change will be very low, like you would go from sth like bottom 25% to bottom 35-40%, is it really worth it, to break both your legs and spend 30-50 k for that ?

I think it's worth it because at my height of 169cm, every centimeter is noticeable. Once you're 5'9 (175cm) in the USA/Canada, height becomes a non-factor. Right now, I'm noticeably short, which really bothers me. After getting LL I can walk around at 177cm with taller shoes and I'll be good.

Also, I don't think LL is overpriced at this point. I think it's worth $30-50k because it's a very specialized surgery and the doctor is usually top-tier and experienced. Also, I would rather invest in myself instead of blowing money on a new car, or even a down payment on a house.

I have fractured my ankle a few times, and have broken my arm before. They for the most part return to normal. I hope my legs return to normal if I do LL, but the good news is that they do return to normal from what I've read from credible sources.

[TIBIKE200]

I think it's worth it because at my height of 169cm, every centimeter is noticeable. Once you're 5'9 (175cm) in the USA/Canada, height becomes a non-factor. Right now, I'm noticeably short, which really bothers me. After getting LL I can walk around at 177cm with taller shoes and I'll be good.

Also, I don't think LL is overpriced at this point. I think it's worth $30-50k because it's a very specialized surgery and the doctor is usually top-tier and experienced. Also, I would rather invest in myself instead of blowing money on a new car, or even a down payment on a house.

I have fractured my ankle a few times, and have broken my arm before. They for the most part return to normal. I hope my legs return to normal if I do LL, but the good news is that they do return to normal from what I've read from credible sources.

You want to do tibia or femur?

[applesandoranges]

You want to do tibia or femur?

More interested in tibias at the moment for several reasons. Was recommended by Dr. Donghoon to do 6cm tibia.

[Penguinn]

The f*ck is wrong with you?

[Tiger5]

Hello DIFM\
I will be doing Femurs soon, I asked about the old forum discount, they said they haven't done that in many years, I mentioned that one of the patients in summer of 2015 received the discount, which is referring to you. 
The financial guy said he would need more info to apply this discount.
Anything you can add to help point out how, and who got you this discount for you?
Thanks much
T

[alps]

I really think DoingItForMe will recover better and things will look more optimistic for him.

[crimsontide]

I don;t think it will be that much better for him

applesandoranges... you are not taking this surgery seriously enough

many people never fully recover

[Alu]

I don't think that it is worth to spend 30-50 000 to go from 169 to 173. The difference will be negligible, even the statistical change will be very low, like you would go from sth like bottom 25% to bottom 35-40%, is it really worth it, to break both your legs and spend 30-50 k for that ?

I legit can never take you seriously lol

Also let's stop talking about others money, even though OP was certainly joking.

[aspirant185]

I legit can never take you seriously lol

Also let's stop talking about others money, even though OP was certainly joking.

When statistics speak, even God is silent You might think whatever you want but the truth is no gain is more significant than going from 175.5 to 181-3 .

[LLuser1]

Krp1 you'd be surprised to know where the real money is... Your friends Cooper and Musicmaker and Glenn are millionaires. You can borrow money from them. Cooper did femurs with Paley and then has been quoted more than 150k to fix the mess Monegal caused. Musicmaker hasn't visited other doctors (she should) but has in Barcelona since 2014. The guesthouse is 1500 per month (meals not included). Do the math. Glenn did quads!! and traveled from Canad to Europe three times at least. Ask them to pay for your tibiae.

[Alu]

When statistics speak, even God is silent You might think whatever you want but the truth is no gain is more significant than going from 175.5 to 181-3 .

That's not the point. That's never been the point for certain people. Stop shoving your reasoning to others; especially when it's discouraging bases solely on your own crazed reasoning (the fact that you would even consider ll:this applies really to everyone).

[Alu]

Krp1 you'd be surprised to know where the real money is... Your friends Cooper and Musicmaker and Glenn are millionaires. You can borrow money from them. Cooper did femurs with Paley and then has been quoted more than 150k to fix the mess Monegal caused. Musicmaker hasn't visited other doctors (she should) but has in Barcelona since 2014. The guesthouse is 1500 per month (meals not included). Do the math. Glenn did quads!! and traveled from Canad to Europe three times at least. Ask them to pay for your tibiae.

Lol....I can't stop laughing at this

[LLuser1]

  LOL I'm not joking. Some people think Monegal is a cheap option for people with no means. Prices aren't that cheap. If you get complications... you'd have to file for personal bankruptcy unless you're fking rich like Cooper Music and Glenn

[aspirant185]

That's not the point. That's never been the point for certain people. Stop shoving your reasoning to others; especially when it's discouraging bases solely on your own crazed reasoning (the fact that you would even consider ll:this applies really to everyone).

I am not discouraging anybody. In fact, I am encouraging everybody ! I am currently communicating via PMs with a guy who is 184cm and wants to do 190 because he is an aspiring model and he was rejected from some model agencies because they say the average for them is like 187-8. I am supportive of this. In the end of the day everybody does LL to accomplish a personal goal.

You are telling me I am crazy to do LL at 175.5, and I am telling you that at 175.5 I am among the shortest 20% of people and just slightly above average height for women (172-3 should be the average) I am below average when all these girls put on heels.

In the case of the person above, he is 169 and wants to go to 173. I am encouraging him to go to 176 because if he breaks his legs, sacrifices months and 30-50k, then 4 cm is simply not worth it. And 7cm is still within what is considered safe for femural lengthening and what is recommended by doctors.

[goldenegg]

Cooper did femurs with Paley and then has been quoted more than 150k to fix the mess Monegal caused.

do you know what kind of complications Cooper had?  how do you know and can you provide some proof or get him to give us an update on his diary?  I can't tell if you're making it up and genuinely curious to know what happened to him

[TIBIKE200]

I am not discouraging anybody. In fact, I am encouraging everybody ! I am currently communicating via PMs with a guy who is 184cm and wants to do 190 because he is an aspiring model and he was rejected from some model agencies because they say the average for them is like 187-8. I am supportive of this. In the end of the day everybody does LL to accomplish a personal goal.

You are telling me I am crazy to do LL at 175.5, and I am telling you that at 175.5 I am among the shortest 20% of people and just slightly above average height for women (172-3 should be the average) I am below average when all these girls put on heels.

In the case of the person above, he is 169 and wants to go to 173. I am encouraging him to go to 176 because if he breaks his legs, sacrifices months and 30-50k, then 4 cm is simply not worth it. And 7cm is still within what is considered safe for femural lengthening and what is recommended by doctors.

 I really dont get it... 172-173 average of girls? I have seen many german girls coming to Erasmus here in Italy and I have never seen a girl taller than me....
  Thank god I am from Israel where heels are considered ugly so some brainless women dont put them into calculation about what height the man is supposed to be.

[DoingItForMe]

Hello DIFM\
I will be doing Femurs soon, I asked about the old forum discount, they said they haven't done that in many years, I mentioned that one of the patients in summer of 2015 received the discount, which is referring to you. 
The financial guy said he would need more info to apply this discount.
Anything you can add to help point out how, and who got you this discount for you?
Thanks much
T

Dr. Paley has not been very generous when it comes to money. I have examples of this with his other patients, but I cannot disclose it yet, because they're still being treated by him. I wouldn't recommend going to him, if you plan on saving money. You might paying more than what you expect. I am not surprised that you didn't get a discount.

btw doingitforme, how is your walking? Pain appart, is your gait normal?

I still walk like a penguin when I get tired. But I can force myself to have a normal gait in the beginning when I'm not. I suspect that the penguin gait is because the muscles near my butt are weak. And they're weak because it hurts when I do side leg raises so I haven't done a lot of them until recently. For the past two weeks, I've been doing a lot of side leg raises, and my right leg is recovering very well. There isn't much pain or weakness on my right leg. But my left leg still continues to hurt near the top of my femur. I suspect that something bad happened to my leg there, because the pain doesn't seem to be going away even after working out that muscle. I fear that that pain will be permanent. Which means that every time I walk, I will experience pain on that spot. And if I sleep on my left side and weight is put on that area, it will hurt. When I poke it, it hurts. When I move my left leg sideways, it hurts there. And even right now, after I've walked for a while and rested, that area is hurting as I'm typing this. So, I think it is a permanent pain. Perhaps when they remove the rod, it might be better. But I doubt it. I think something really bad happened there. My left leg might be screwed up forever.

[TIBIKE200]

Dr. Paley has not been very generous when it comes to money. I have examples of this with his other patients, but I cannot disclose it yet, because they're still being treated by him. I wouldn't recommend going to him, if you plan on saving money. You might paying more than what you expect. I am not surprised that you didn't get a discount.
I still walk like a penguin when I get tired. But I can force myself to have a normal gait in the beginning when I'm not. I suspect that the penguin gait is because the muscles near my butt are weak. And they're weak because it hurts when I do side leg raises so I haven't done a lot of them until recently. For the past two weeks, I've been doing a lot of side leg raises, and my right leg is recovering very well. There isn't much pain or weakness on my right leg. But my left leg still continues to hurt near the top of my femur. I suspect that something bad happened to my leg there, because the pain doesn't seem to be going away even after working out that muscle. I fear that that pain will be permanent. Which means that every time I walk, I will experience pain on that spot. And if I sleep on my left side and weight is put on that area, it will hurt. When I poke it, it hurts. When I move my left leg sideways, it hurts there. And even right now, after I've walked for a while and rested, that area is hurting as I'm typing this. So, I think it is a permanent pain. Perhaps when they remove the rod, it might be better. But I doubt it. I think something really bad happened there. My left leg might be screwed up forever.

  Upper thigh might also be the ileopsoas. I suggest your to try the thomas stretch for the ileopsoas along the pigeon pose. It it's the rectus femoralis just try and do as many from thigh stretched (stand up, grab your feet and curl your calve until the feet touches your butt and afterwards pull the feet up as much as you can while your feet always touches your butt). The pain might be because of a constant stretch.

[DoingItForMe]

aspirant185, do you think that being your height is the reason why you're not getting laid with gorgeous girls? Is that why you're doing LL?

[TIBIKE200]

I just looked on the web what are exactly 3 inch heels and up.
  I have to confess. I have never, ever, ever, ever ,ever seen a girl with a 4 inch heel, rarely seen 3 inch heels and only sometimes 2-1 inch heels... Even here in Italy.
  Always when there is a girl with high heels she walks like a complete tard and everyone thinks it's a joke... I have also never met a quality girl that wear high heels (It is considered an absolute sign of empty brained not educated "insert the W word here" in Israel but also here in Italy... Nothing "elegant" about it... We are not in the 20th century anymore)

[DoingItForMe]

No, it's not. The pain is on the side of my leg, and not in front of it. Thomas stretch for stretching the front of my thigh. Anyway, you got me looking up on Google what the pain is. And it's this: http://www.newhealthguide.org/Tensor-Fasciae-Latae-Pain.html

The TFL is responsible for pelvis stabilization, so that might explain why I still walk like a penguin. Seems like runners get TFL injuries. I'm looking up exercises to try to stretch and work it out. I'll report back after a few weeks of it whether I fixed it or not.

[Thatdude950]

Dr. Paley has not been very generous when it comes to money. I have examples of this with his other patients, but I cannot disclose it yet, because they're still being treated by him. I wouldn't recommend going to him, if you plan on saving money. You might paying more than what you expect. I am not surprised that you didn't get a discount.
I still walk like a penguin when I get tired. But I can force myself to have a normal gait in the beginning when I'm not. I suspect that the penguin gait is because the muscles near my butt are weak. And they're weak because it hurts when I do side leg raises so I haven't done a lot of them until recently. For the past two weeks, I've been doing a lot of side leg raises, and my right leg is recovering very well. There isn't much pain or weakness on my right leg. But my left leg still continues to hurt near the top of my femur. I suspect that something bad happened to my leg there, because the pain doesn't seem to be going away even after working out that muscle. I fear that that pain will be permanent. Which means that every time I walk, I will experience pain on that spot. And if I sleep on my left side and weight is put on that area, it will hurt. When I poke it, it hurts. When I move my left leg sideways, it hurts there. And even right now, after I've walked for a while and rested, that area is hurting as I'm typing this. So, I think it is a permanent pain. Perhaps when they remove the rod, it might be better. But I doubt it. I think something really bad happened there. My left leg might be screwed up forever.

A lot of inactivity will definitely weaken your glutes significantly. In addition to the trauma that LL causes in itself (broken bones, stretched muscle) I think that the extreme inactivity probably makes patients susceptible to a number of injuries/niggles too. I had extremely weak glutes and hamstrings just from too much sitting at the computer let alone LL - it took me about a year to fix them up and have what I'd consider decent mobility.

Anyway, my point is that you have a lot of weak areas now. Hopefully if you strengthen your glutes, hamstrings and quads you'll feel better. Hip thrusts are one of the greatest posterior chain/glute exercises imo. If you can try do something close to them, I think it will help your recovery.

[aspirant185]

aspirant185, do you think that being your height is the reason why you're not getting laid with gorgeous girls? Is that why you're doing LL?

I am getting average to above average girls. Girls are the least of my concerns right now with the ridiculous amount of workload in uni and the job apps etc..

[TIBIKE200]

Never ever? In Spain all girls wear 4 inch heels (and even more) when they go partying, even the tall ones. In my case, as I wanted to feel tall all day, I wore them even for work (3-4 inches), but I was the exception. By the way, I'm the opposite of an 'empty brained not educated W'. I'm an elegant 'millionaire' in a position of power, man!!! A 'quality girl'!!!   Heels empower women.

P.S. When I visited the UK, I saw girls wearing 7 inches heels... That was extreme. I have never used those shoes (6 inches maximum, and only for special occasions).

  Maybe this is why always those girls with the heels and and clown's makeup almost never dance in parties... In Israel girls go to parties with flat shoes since you can't dance like a normal person in heels... Was never attracted to the girls that in parties just stand and barely move... This what happens when looks come before anything else it seems... And the western world is plagued by it