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[hand_sanitizer]

Stop downloading Ashoka1. It's clogging the connection. >:[

[Machine]

Machine, I know you're an Indian, bro. Do you live near Gurgaon. If so, you should drop by the guest house. It'd be sweet to meet in person. Let me know if you can. I'll pm the address.

thanks for the offer but i can't since my place is like 6 hours through bus from gurgoan ,i actually live in a different state . And there are other reasons too
anyway , i was there at delhi a week ago and i met Shorty and Disobedient , they were staying at a hotel .

That was common in Beijing too.  What people "turned" always got more and more inaccurate until they stopped bothering to keep track about 2 months into it.  Trust the doctor's x-ray measurements.

i would believe in trusting the doctor's x-ray measurements too , but i the measurement here is taken as said by Russianblues

The only line of defense stopping any of us from leaving with a discrepancy is a $4 shrunken x-ray done by random faceless "technicians". I'm thankful I've got this far with my only complication being debilitating knee pain that hasn't subsided in 3 months.

During my lengthening , my roommate came out with a easy method to get accurate measurement . and i believe i got 90% idea how
much length i was at..!! the method was as follow
take x-ray with the wrench or any other metal beside your bone gap . ie in the image below.


now the calculation
accurate measurement of the wrench or any other metal in real          = x
accurate measurement of the wrench or any other metal in the x-ray   = y
accurate measurement of bone gap in x-ray                                     = z
*(make sure the bone gap is very accurate from the edge of the bone cut , since some have good callus formation )

x divided by y ratio is multiplied by z = your accurate distraction length .

* make sure every measurement is accurate since even 1 mm could make difference in calculation .

through this measurement you will get a accurate idea of how much length you have gained so you can keep track of your length .

During frame removal the doctor will measure accurately on the table with some device , so no need to worry for final length or discrepancy.

[Polycrates.]

Point your sanitized fingers somewhere else, hand_sanitizer. My room-mate and I have been lying in bed without internet for 5 days!!!!

[Polycrates.]

Why does every other doc's xrays come out grey, but ours are some dark blue hue? Anyway, Harry said he's finding an alternative hospital to xray at. Hopefully, they are more accurate.

[Polycrates.]

Is your physio Harry? It's nice of him to offer you some comforting words.

Sorry to hear about your plight. I guess some of us have been through the same period. But somehow, everything works out in the end. I planned to take 3 months off of work for this procedure in early 2013 but ended up staying there for 6 months. Luckily, when I came back, my company tried to hire 5 people but no one could do my job. So I got my job back. Beside reaching 8cm in the end, that was the only good thing that happened to me in 2013.

I didn't follow your story. How much cm do you have now? And how long have you stayed there?

You were with Sarin? How has your recovery been?

[Polycrates.]

Machine,

That spanner ratio calculation looks like a good idea. Thanks.

[Medium Drink Of Water]

Why does every other doc's xrays come out grey, but ours are some dark blue hue? Anyway, Harry said he's finding an alternative hospital to xray at. Hopefully, they are more accurate.

I think the gray ones are straight to digital.  The ones in Beijing had a green tint if I remember correctly.

[Medium Drink Of Water]

Machine,

That spanner ratio calculation looks like a good idea. Thanks.

It would be even better to ask the doctor for the length of the nail.  It's inside your bone, right in the middle, instead of lying directly on the x-ray table a few cm farther away from the camera than most of your leg.

[Smallguy]

You were with Sarin? How has your recovery been?

Hey. Yeah, I had LL with Dr. Sarin on Jan.7. I had a lot of complications and drama while I was there. I even cried while Harry was my physiotherapist. The first month, the pin was hitting the nerve on the side of my knee, so I couldn't bend my knee for a whole month no matter what kind of stretching Harry did. Then finally, they gave me an operation to cut the nerve. Then I had a knee infection, which made me become incapacitated for whole month of Feb. After that was gone, I realized my left leg wasn't lengthening even though I turn 1.25-1.5mm per day. Then again, they took me to hospital for some tweaking of the frame. I thought the issue was resolved, unfortunately, it didn't. By April, the 4th month, there was a 3cm discrepancy between both of my legs. My right leg was at 6.7cm and my left was only at 3cm. At that point, they finally admit that my bone has consolidated on my left. So no matter how much I turn or how the metal frame bent, my left leg wasn't lengthening. So I finally have to be taken to the hospital to have my lower left leg tibia re-broken.

At that point, my ex gf also dumped me and I felt suicidal (but I'm fine now). So for the next 40 days, I turn my left leg at 2mm per day. Yes, it was crazy. But by the end of May when the frame was removed, my left was at 8.1cm (from 3cm) and my right was at 7.8cm. I asked Dr. Sarin to make it 8cm at the operation room and he agreed.

When I returned home at the end of June, I had a massive 6cm of ballerina. I wheeled myself to the airport and they weren't about to let me onbroad due to my condition. But I begged them. So they let me onboard and I flew back home in a wheel-chair. My aunt didn't recognize me at the airport. She was thinking of some dark-skinned begger from a third-world country was waving at her.. But it was me.

I hit the gym every single day. First I cycle. Then I try the steps, from 5mins to now 60mins per day. I also lift heavy weight standing. My only advice to any future LL patient is, don't depend on your physio for your recovery. Your PT can't do the work for you that is needed for recovery.

Now I can lift 90lb (how much is that in kg?), walk up and down the stairs without requiring to hold on the rail, and can stand up taking a shower. Have no ballerina and don't feel any pain. Machine's roommate was here in Vancouver a few weeks ago. He attributed my recovery due to my dedication of going to the gym!

Anyway, that is my story :-)

[BilateralDamage]

Are you overall pleased Smallguy?  How's life treating you differently now that you're over 3 inches taller?

[Smallguy]

Are you overall pleased Smallguy?  How's life treating you differently now that you're over 3 inches taller?

Not really pleased. I had more friends, more laughter and had more dates before LL. Before I was cooperative, sociable and everyone at my company liked me. But when I came back, I became a dckk. Made fun of people's weight and become critical of everyone and everything. Had arguments with management several times. So I recently changed department. Now I have no friends and spent all of my free time lifting weights at the gym.

Kidding on the side, actually, I feel that there are more opportunities open up to me now than I had before. Being 5'9 is of course better than 5'6, but I'm only slightly less than average in height for male in my area. But life feels a lot better than before.

I recently went to a family's dinner at my uncle's house this weekend. I haven't met him for a several years due to some grudges I had with his wife. But he jokingly mentioned that if I was lucky, I would still have my growth spurt at my age. That was 2 years ago. But this weekend when I went to his christmas party, I think he was shocked to see that I looked taller out of no where. Anyway, it was a good feeling like revenge

[Machine]

i know this feeling very well when my left tibia deviated from the Alignment at 7cm i guess , I went into some kind of depression that i will be crippled for life and stuff  but you need to be strong and decisive right now .
my foot turned inward and i was really scared , i consulted a real LL doctor in Delhi since Dr Sarin was not even looking at my complication , and the other doctor advised me not to do that (turn one rod more than another) since there was internal nail inside the bone which could break the pin or some other stuff can happen .
but after so many complaints about my issue to Dr Sarin , he finally said he will take care of it during frame removal in one sentence.
and at the time of removal he did exactly the same which the other doctor advised me not to , and i felt slightly pain on my upper left tibia at that moment . he did it before giving me general anesthesia WTF which means i was watching everything.
by looking at the latest x-ray i still feel that my left tibia is slightly deviated , may be i will have to do correction after recovery.

this is about another patient from Australia who's tibia was straight but deviated from lateral view , he complained alot to Dr Sarin and atlast Dr Sarin exchanged the rods with other rods (2 small rods attached with some screws that could bend 360%) i do not know how to explain it . Atlast his tibia was straight i guess , i can't recall the procedure but he was happy .

I can't really comment or give any advise cause i don't have any knowledge about these things .
But i thought sharing my experience could help you a little..!!

remember my condition and that Australian guy's condition were different .
my condition is like no.2 in the pic and his was number 1 in the pic

hey Asoka1
i guess whatever Dr Sarin did was wrong . cause i did my research about it for sometime cause of my issue and i don't think it is advisable to (turn one rod more than another).
As said by the real LL doctor that it is not advisable to (turn one rod more than another) since there is internal nail inside your bone  and its dangerous .

[Carter]

Ashoka1 recent updates.

On my latest x-ray, I had concerns over the alignment of my fibula. The alignment looks so bad to me that I was worried that callus would not be able to form between the fibula ends. I asked the doctor about this and he said that to him the fibula doesn't exist. He said that if it does not consolidate it would be fine and he would not do anything about it. He said that bone is often extracted from the fibula to use as bone transplant, and that it would be okay if my fibula remained disconnected after. Excellent.

Yes, I still have a lot of pain in the right leg. I haven't bent the knee at all since that pin starting cutting near my joint. That was almost 4 weeks ago now. The doctor said he wants the physios to give me a pain killer and then force it to bend. He said if that doesn't work, he'll finally change the pin. I just pray that my fibula's develop some callus so they'll consolidate. The back up plan I guess is to get treatment back home; I'm Canadian. I feel some throbbing and pulsing right under the cut of the tibia break scar and he said he doesn't know what that means. And my right ankle is starting to turn inward. The physios say it's okay (surprise?), but I don't think it is.

 I'm trying to angle my sandal so that it keeps straight. I can feel all the pressure on the outside of the foot when I do this. I was measured to be 2.5cm on the latest x-ray, but I don't really trust the measurement. The places he chose to measure from look suspicious to me. Myself as well as another patient, on completely separate occasions, were told by our physio at the hospital that we had to wait 30min after our x-rays because the x-ray technician was on his first day. To me, that is quite the coincidence that two guys are brand new on different days. Makes me think the hospital doesn't have an actual qualified person to make the measurement. Absolutely lovely. I just want 2.5cm more then I'm out. I contemplated frames off right now and calling it a day, but everyone says I'll regret it and they're probably right.

Another issue I'm worried about are the screws he's using to lock the nails on the patients here. I've been reading the nail's documentation, and all the screws suggested have flush ends on them. You're supposed to drill out the hole in the bone under radiography  then screw in the screw by hand. The nails on the x-ray have pointed ends and look like a common self-tapping screw metal screw you'd buy at a hardware store. I don't even think they're medical screws..... Every time I sleep I dream of my life before this-- just working and making money, but being completely fit and healthy-- then I wake up to this and it's really kind of depressing. I really just hope I come out okay. FML

I can't offer you counsel on such a serious and life changing manner. All I can suggest to you is that you go to an established doctor who you can see has actually operated on a few people and has them recovered and walking again. This is not something I've seen from the particular doctor I chose. If you cut corners or forego asking questions at the beginning to keep your mind committed, it just ends up coming to bite you when the concerns have to actually be confronted because they're happening to you. When you're in it, you want someone who'll know what to do, not someone who will blow it off.

The shilling campaign for Indian doctors on this site has pulled in a lot of desperate 20-something year olds. The medical system here is insufficient to make it a credible place for LL. If the site had any sense, as it did when old forum A was here, who heavily advised against India, then it would warn against India on the whole. Everyday I hear things from the staff that contradict the tellings of the day prior. I fear for this outcome every moment of my life now...

Everyone is doing okay on the whole here. I don't want to incite sedition against the doctor. The thing that scares everyone here is the feeling of dread, knowing that if something does fuc* up, there is really no means of rectification. The physios say what you want to hear, not what is obvious reality. Knowing that this is the same staff that Sarin employed when all these people got fked up is a constant strain on my mind. They're good guys, but it seems that everything is always positive in their minds. I can't pass final judgement until 5 or 6 months from now, when I'm out and walking. Right now, I'm worried about leg length discrepancies and preserving the appropriate leg function and alignment after frame removal.

The doctor has been purported to be using some sort of measuring device before frame removal now that has very accurate measuring ability. The x-rays being taken aren't being measured by a trained x-ray technician. The measurements have been proven to be up to 2cm away from the actual distraction length. Our physio measures, and before that it was the manager doing the measurement. The datum he chooses to make his measurement is always different from the x-ray prior. I haven't heard this from him myself yet. I'll ask next time I see him.

I am grateful for having the latest patient here, who is Indian as well as a trained doctor. He's whipped the staff into order here and there are sweeping changes in the food and hygiene now. We get our legs cleaned by the nurse now, with a separate basin from the one we spit in when teeth brushing. He uses cotton pads rather than the ragged old towel the caretaker used near our open wounds before. I am certain the use of the teeth cleaning basin contributed to the contraction of my pin infection that put me out for weeks. The doctor visits frequently now as well. It's unfortunate that our complaints were needed to induce the care that should have been established in the first place.
 

[Polycrates.]

Just had a series of posts obliterated from Sweden's diary on old forum . It was a dialogue between myself and a new member who was inquiring about the HLN nail. Only managed to salvage my first post since Sysop acted so furtively in his modifications:

"India does not possess a legitimate regulatory body to keep doctors and industry in check, and thus, I highly doubt the nail has any legal bearing or official testing and certification. If there were a law in existence concerning such matters, I'm sure Sarin would have long ago been guilty of transgressing said law. I say this based on the stories I've heard in the past. Crazy6 himself said that a doctor told him he removed the cheapest nail he's ever witnessed in his career upon witnessing it at extraction. With enough effort, you yourself could probably feign being a doctor here and operate on whom and on what you so desire. It wouldn't surprise me if Sarin, on a whim, conceived and fabricated a batch of the wonder-nails in his Dehli garage in a one night drunken delirium. He's also been purported to be offering tibial HLN now, again with no testing or investigation into its function and design. But don't worry, Indian docs, like all other Indians, are super-human. They have the intrinsic power to be able to flout the training and regulation the rest of the world abides and still reign supreme as the best everything in the world. The superpower strikes again."

To avoid the nuisance of having my writing removed without any prior warning or my consent, I will be updating only on this OPEN forum. I know it's not as popular, but at least I can exercise the ability to express everything here without pandering to that sad man's will. I requested to have my account deleted before, and that request was pending for over 5 days and nothing happened. Sysop, you can delete my account for all I care.

To update those at all interested:

My last two x-rays were taken on the 7th and 25th of January. On the 7th I was measured at 2.5cm and on the 25th, where I was expecting AT LEAST 3.5cm, I supposedly only gained 0.5cm. I was turning the 0.77mm/day during this time period. Ever since the 25th I've been turning 1.25mm/day with two days at 1.5mm/day for two days. I need to get to at least 5cm before the 23rd of February. My currency took an unexpected dip in the USD exchange rate and I'll barely be able to afford one month now. The doctor said he thinks the x-ray is inaccurate, but didn't know what to say with regards to where all that turning went. He said I don't have bent pins so... The top pins look heavily bent to me, but he says they are not.

[Polycrates.]

I hope that guy took my imploring against undergoing HLN with Sarin to height. I don't know if he knows about LL Forum and I obviously can't PM him to inform him.

[Polycrates.]

The posts were moved to a new thread regarding the legality of the HLN in India. Can be found in general lengthening zone.

[KiloKAHN]

Good to know your posts aren't getting randomly deleted. Would dtill be good for more people to know about this forum. I thinm we're dong pretty well in site growth. 276 members in this short of time is great.

[Smallguy]

I also find it a bit annoying that our currency drops by so much and our wages stays the same.

Yeah, remember the plan. Get your length, wheel yourself to the airport, if ask, answer them you can walk yourself to the washroom if you try (otherwise they won't allow you on the plane), and come back home for recovery. Home is the best place for recovery. Visit your family doctor or find a new one, and he'll refer you to an orthopaedic at your city general hospital.

If your goal is 5cm, then you're already half-way there. If I were you, I wouldn't lengthen so slowly due to pin-loss or compression due to standing.

[Polycrates.]

That's the reasoning behind the accelerated rate now. If I'm only going to be receiving 40% of my turn amount for whatever idiopathic cause, then I have no qualms in turning in excess of 1mm/day. I really regret only turning 0.75mm for so long, but I was trying to play it safe.

I got told by an Indian patient on old forum  that it's my own fault for travelling to India, and that I should not speak poorly of his beloved country. Typical Indian mentality: boast to westerners about how conducive and welcoming their country is to international prospective patients then turn around and point the finger at you when what you are sold is not close to what you receive. This guy tried to make me amenable to the absurd social ills rampant in India. I attempted having a rational and objective conversation with him, but his emotion got the best of him and he launched a huge affront against the whole western world, blaming it principally for all ills and injustices occurring in India. Keep in mind this guy lives and prospers in the west..... I had no intent in making this a known issue, but if he's going to challenge me directly then I'm obligated to give my side. Needless to say, I have given up on arguing a lost cause with him. To each their own.

[Smallguy]

That's the reasoning behind the accelerated rate now. If I'm only going to be receiving 40% of my turn amount for whatever idiopathic cause, then I have no qualms in turning in excess of 1mm/day. I really regret only turning 0.75mm for so long, but I was trying to play it safe.

I got told by an Indian patient on old forum  that it's my own fault for travelling to India, and that I should not speak poorly of his beloved country. Typical Indian mentality: boast to westerners about how conducive and welcoming their country is to international prospective patients then turn around and point the finger at you when what you are sold is not close to what you receive. This guy tried to make me amenable to the absurd social ills rampant in India. I attempted having a rational and objective conversation with him, but his emotion got the best of him and he launched a huge affront against the whole western world, blaming it principally for all ills and injustices occurring in India. Keep in mind this guy lives and prospers in the west..... I had no intent in making this a known issue, but if he's going to challenge me directly then I'm obligated to give my side. Needless to say, I have given up on arguing a lost cause with him. To each their own.

I guess it's all about learning and experience. My opinion is it's more safe to have the frames removed than living and having them on. As you know, you are living with open wounds and being in constant pain due to the pin either hitting your nerve or tearing through your muscle. You never know. If your situation is bad enough, you may also have to stop lengthening immediately and go home. One of the guy from my city had a bone infection. We were sleeping through several nights in the Indian scotchingly hot summer heat of 50 degrees because there was a power outage. His infection became so severe he has to stop lengthening and had to go home with a 2cm discrepancy. He hasn't answer my email ever since so I don't know how he will do about this.

I agree. When you're in India, it's no longer safe. So you should get what you as quickly as possible and go home. I know.. maybe your doctors and the staffs may have excellence intention. But their standard can never be like what it is here at home.

[Polycrates.]

Hey small,

How was his bone infection identified? Was it due to pain or can the infection be seen on the x-ray? I was worried about contracting a bone infection when I had a pin site infection but they just said I didn't without doing anything in particular...

[kinglee]

hi. Ashoka 1 i read your whole story here and old forum  . .why did you choose dr. Sringari?

[Polycrates.]

For the price. I have no qualms with the doc, really. He says some odd things from time to time that make me worry, and we had a talk today about that. He reassured me on a lot of the pertinent medical issues, ie. he's is now going forward ensuring he takes a final measurement at frame removal and will make the appropriate adjustments. He offered up his personal cell number for direct contact concerning medical issues. It's all the other bureaucratic bull  one has to deal with here that gets tedious over the long haul. If I end up taller and healthy I will be content with the decision.

[Smallguy]

Hey small,

How was his bone infection identified? Was it due to pain or can the infection be seen on the x-ray? I was worried about contracting a bone infection when I had a pin site infection but they just said I didn't without doing anything in particular...

Yes, they can be identified in the x-ray. You can google it. And you would have a period of traumatic fever. Unluckily, I didn't have a bone infection so I wouldn't know what to look for.

Regarding the pin site, there won't be much you can do about it. I just leave the scab on and hope for the best. That's why I also find having the frames on is the hardest part of LL. Also, I took a lot of vitamin C to bolster my body immune system.

[hand_sanitizer]

Ah king Ashoka, it's always a pleasure to read ur positive glowing review. u're such an optimist

[Polycrates.]

Check your PM, please.

[Muse]

A quick note, the patient requested change of profile name to Polycrates.

[Polycrates.]

[Medium Drink Of Water]

On the plus side, that's some nice knee flexibility you have.

[Polycrates.]

Yeah, I guess so...

[Polycrates.]

Anyone with any inkling to come to this place steer clear. So much nonsense has come to light that is totally absurd and I can't believe I'm stuck in this situation. I'll explain in a more detailed post tomorrow after we all meet with the doctor to explain various issues.

I'll just let you know for now that one patient has been threatened with actions involving the police being taken against him if he does not leave the guest house by a certain date. This after him being assured the issues leading to it were going to be resolved months ago.