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[AnotherLLer]

This is what I think is the most realistic classification of male height ranges and looks level. All heights are barefoot afternoon heights measured under stadiometer without socks and with buzz cut (i.e. real heights) so keep that in mind:

1. 5'5-5'8. This is the lowest height range where a male can fall. Below strong 5'5 is no longer considered normal male height and is not salvageable with any looks level one can imagine. At this height range one is capped at so-called "chadlet" looks level, i.e. if one is very good looking and hot, he is limited by his short height and can never become proper "chad" unless he does LL. Optimal chadlet height is average of 5'5 and 5'8 so it's about 5'6.5.

2. 5'9-6'0. This is the height range where a so called proper "chad" can be. Basically, at this point, you're no longer limited to your short height and you can get any women interested in you unless they're very tall and / or have strict height requirements of above 6 feet. While at chadlet height tier one is very limited due to his height, at proper chad height tier one escapes the height limitation and is no longer defined by his height. This is the most realistic height range where chadlets can end up with double LL. Basically, 5'5 chadlet is capped at 5'10.5 with 5.5 inch double LL whilst 5'8 chadlet can end up 6'1.5 if he maxes out at 5.5 inches with double LL. So, 5'5 guys have a hard limit of never going above 6 feet (unless they lengthen 8 inches which is unrealistic) whilst 5'8 guys can break that 6 feet barrier and become legit tall. Optimal chad height is average of 5'9 and 6'0 which is 5'10.5 (This is the height 5'5 guys can get with 5.5 inch double LL which is a decent height for a male).

3. 6'1-6'4. This is the so-called "gigachad" height range. Proper gigachad should be at least 6'1 which is tall. Above 6'4 is too tall and has no benefits socially. Optimal gigachad height is average of 6'1 and 6'4 which is 6'2.5. This is the height range where proper chad height males of 5'9-6'0 can and up with double LL. Basically, at this height range you're no longer limited by your height which means that you can get those height fetishist women who think that 5'9-6'0 is too short for them.

Now, getting double LL makes the most sense when you're in 5'5-5'8 range to escape the short height stigma and unlock your full potential by going from chadlet to chad status. While at chadlet height range the majority of women despise the idea of dating you (ONS and FWB doesn't count), at chad height range about 80-85% of women are okay dating you. This is the huge ROI you get with double LL and is the most beneficial of all starting heights. Basically, the lower chadlet height you have, the more you gain with double LL of at least 4.5 inches. It means that starting at lowest chadlet height of 5'5 you can end up at 5'9.5 with 4.5 inches of double LL (very realistic goal with 2 LL surgeries). It's literally the most beneficial jump out of any starting height.

Now, at 5'9 getting LL still makes sense to break that 6 feet barrier and enter in gigiachad tier height range but ROI is not as strong compared to someone who goes from chadlet height range to chad height range. While at chad height range you're capped at 85% of women who would date you, at gigachad height range you get access to those 15% of height fetishist women who strictly date men above 6 feet tall. It's still beneficial to do LL at 5'9-6'0 height range but the life quality improvement won't be as drastic as someone who goes from 5'5-5'8 range to 5'9-6'0 range.

This means that getting LL for strictly height boosting when one is above 6 feet tall is nonsense and the ROI is negligible.

As you can see, there's 11 inches of height between the 5'5 and 6'4 (lowest and upper height ranges of normal male heights). The ROI of getting LL is the strongest at 5'5 and gets lowest at 6 feet, where you're just an inch away of proper gigachad height.

Now, at 5'5, when you stand besides 6'4 guy, you're literally 11 inches shorter than him (brutal height difference). It's about 27-28 cm which is more than an average male head. If you do 5.5 inches of LL at 5'5, you're basically halving that height difference and now you're just 5.5 inches shorter than a 6'4 guy. To imagine the height difference of 11 and 5.5 inches, at 11 inches shorter, your head is about 3-4 cm lower of 6'4 guy's chin and at 5'5 inches shorter, your head is now just about an inch lower of 6'4 guy's eyeline, which is a huge difference. Basically, at 5'10.5 you're no longer a manlet by any definition of this word. It's a solid height and that's why it's the most beneficial in terms of ROI to go from 5'5 to 5'10.5 with 8 cm on femur and 5 or 6 cm on tibia.

To recap, at 5'5-5'8 range, you're limited to about 10-20% of women who would date you (10% at 5'5 and 20% at 5'.

At 5'9-6'0 range, you're dating pool is about 70-85% (70% at 5'9 and 85% at 6 feet).

At 6'1-6'4 range, you're dating pool is practically at 90-100% (90% at 6'1 and 100% at 6'4).

Basically, a 5'5 guy's dating pool goes from 10% to 70% if he does 4 inches of double LL which is the highest gain of any starting height.

But, at 6 feet, your dating pool goes from 90% to 100% if you become 6'4, so just 10% increase, which is the lowest ROI you get from doing LL at 6 feet.

That's why they say it's a life changing surgery for 5'5-5'8 range guys. Anyone starting at 5'9 should rethink of getting this surgery done and once you're about 5'10.5, it approaches to the lowest ROI of getting it done.

Basically breaking that 6 feet barrier with double LL when you're 5'9, your dating pool goes from 70% to 90% which is still a worthwhile and boost and QoL improvement.

But, in terms of getting the most ROI, going from 5'5 to 5'9 or 5'10.5 where your dating pool goes from 10% to 70-75% is the most dramatic QoL you get from double LL.

[financialadvisor]

I like the term chadled and gigachad haha, I think you missed one big variable here which is average height in the area you live

[AnotherLLer]

I like the term chadled and gigachad haha, I think you missed one big variable here which is average height in the area you live

To be honest, these terms are cringe-worthy, but the guys use them on a daily basis on Looksmax forum.

I've used those terms for a rough classification and what to expect when you stand at a certain height range as a male.

As you can see, there's 3 inch height ranges in those 3 categories of short, average and tall heights. Every 3 inch is a big jump in height and can take you to another category, i.e. from short to average and from average to tall.

With theoretical double LL of 6 inches which is considered the upper safe limit of this procedure, one can go from short to tall.

Although, for 5'5 guys like me, the most realistic option is to go to average height after 4.5-5.5 inch double LL and stand at 5'9.5-5'10.5 height range, which is dead average. At that height range, you're no longer seen as short and that's the most important aspect of getting LL, in order no longer to be seen as a short guy and escape the height limitations. ROI of getting double LL of 11-13 cm at 165 cm tall is insane.

[jbfjbj4]

It's country dependent.

In Vietnam, less than 5% of men are taller than me at 180cm. The women are also shorter so 180cm is certainly 'gigachad' height here. Latin America, pretty much same deal...when the average girl is like 158cm you look very tall to her at 180, and when the average man is 170, being 180 there is more like being 188 in Europe (i.e. 10cm above the average).

Back in Europe though, it's nothing special, just solidly average, and no girl is ever gonna call you tall.

Going from short to average is a much better ROI than going from average to tall however. And I don't mean a cope average like someone claiming 5ft 7 is 'in the average range', I mean actually getting to the average height in your country, which in most of Europe/America is gonna be between 5ft 10 and 5ft 11.

[Pax Augusta]

That post is seriously underrated! I completely agree with your points because I also came up with those numbers in my head to create some quantification when it comes to dating and figuring out how much I should lengthen.

However, I have a slightly more pessimistic outlook on the dating pool. This could be because I’m from Germany, where the average German woman in my age group is around 5'7" to 5'9". Native Germans tend to be tall as fk. Especially in college. An older friend of mine who is a lawyers said he tends to be in the shorter range with 5,11 among his colleagues. In general if you want to date women from the upper social class I guess you need to add an extra inch on average in your calculation because they tend to be taller at least where I live. Immigrants are notably shorter and their numbers are increasing though. They tend be more common in lower social classes. The height difference is very noticeable.

Where are you from? The references you gave seem to depend a lot on your country and a bit on your social class.

I also think no one should lengthen 4-5 inches even in two segments. Complication rates rise a lot by doing more than 5-6cm on femurs and 3-4cm on tibias.

[AnotherLLer]

Well, the ranges I quoted applies to most western countries excluding Germany and nordic ones. But, IMO, it still applies to that countries because being way above average looking with striking features (i.e. hot male) trumps height past 5'7 even in those countries too (status will help immensely in that case).

I agree that 10 cm is the benchmark for double LL (5.5 cm femurs and 4.5 cm tibia). Anything more is too much and unnecessary because 165 cm man will get to 175 cm which is enough height to then fraud 3-4 cm and be perceived average.

I myself am very limited at 165 cm purely by height alone. I always say that at that height even if you mount Brad Pitt's head it still won't cut it for the majority of women and the dating pool will be too low regardless. This applies to dating only (LTR) and without status / money. For ONS it won't be that bad if coupled with nice body. With decent status and / or money, even average looking man can get 180 cm tall model at that height though.

So, in terms of increasing the dating pool and ONS success as a hot 165 cm guy with way above average and striking face and body, 10 cm LL will prove life changing. I think that this is the only scenario where getting LL for that 10 cm boost will make the most ROI in terms of dating life and getting women in general. This is without status and money as those two trumps height and looks unless one looks way too ugly and is way too short like below 165 cm.

The bottom line is the more good looking and hot a man is at 165 cm (which is the lowest normal height for a male in the west) the more he will benefit from this surgery and gaining solid 10 cm in order to stand at 175 cm because that height will be enough to not get towered by even 180 cm women without heels (with heels you can wear 3 inch shoes too to lessen the height advantage of women).

Coupled with status 175 cm will be enough for any woman in the world if one looks very good which is not the case for average looking 175 cm guys as some women still won't date the man with high status if she's not attracted to him.