Limb Lengthening Forum
Limb Lengthening Surgery => Limb Lengthening Discussions => Topic started by: Polycrates. on September 27, 2014, 09:56:15 PM
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A small vid I had taken showing my current walking condition. Ankles are still tight as hell and I feel that there may be some bowing in the left leg. Just putting it up for a little evaluation, but it won't be up long. Sorry about the angle and brevity, it's the best I can do for now. 10 Months Post-op, 6 Months Post-Frame Removal... Running, squatting, jumping, all still out of the question.
http://<iframe width="420" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/m6gjDfGWdi0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
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Looks pretty good man, but can you jog at all? 10 months post op i would have thought running was possible, although you did 6 cm so maybe not.
Btw is the reason you feel you cant run, because you are afraid you might hurt yourself, or does it simply not work when you try to do it?
Btw with the nails inside i dont think the legs should be able to get bowed, have you done any x-rays recently to see how the consolidation is going?
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Because I'm out of my country I cannot have an x-ray done. Not being able to run is a combination of trepidation, no ankle flex, and the changed bio mechanics. Tried it once and stumbled over myself.
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Also to add, my wingspan is 183-184cm, but when I walk I do feel that they are short for the height I now have. Any input on this?
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I think your arm-span looks completely normal and proportional, btw has your doctor told you anything as to what you are allowed to do or if there still are restrictions?
if you could confirm if the bone is fully healed maybe you would dare to push yourself more which might improve the speed of your recovery.
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My work contract expires November 7th, so I won't have one until then. The last one I had was early August, and he said that the callus has progressed very well (had an injection in May on one leg to induce growth), but still wasn't strong enough in his view to perform strenuous movements.
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Wow, you look amazingly tall in this video, I must say!
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Doesnt look so good after 10 months, but it will get better with time. Sweden's disciple lol.
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I know it's bad, and I hope it does improve with time. Been stretching my ankles a lot lately but they don't seem to get better. If this is the way my gait stays I guess I'm fked for life in every measure....
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Do you blame it on the doctor or is it just a bad case?
I guess good care and physio could have helped. But yeah your doc certainly messed up alignment.
India man :/
Anyway what are you finances like, now? Can you worst case go to Paley now?
Keep strong. You'll get better!
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Who is your doctor? Your walk doesnt look good for 6 months post frame removal
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Dr was Sringari. I can get free examination in Canada, but the issue is finding a doctor that is knowledgeable in LL. The doctor I saw briefly was a general ortho. He told me the alignment seemed fine in the legs, but he never had a standing x-ray performed. I am praying the gait is a result of stiffness and not malalignment.
I need to find a doctor in my hometown that might be able to fully help me when I return back from work. I know smallguy found a good one in Vancouver, but there doesn't seem to be any in the Toronto area... They aren't as willing to fly in specialists from far away towns to dote on you personally in Canada as they are in Sweden. And yes, I do have a tendency to get worried and depressed when things go astray, so I will indeed try to keep strong.
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I know it's bad, and I hope it does improve with time. Been stretching my ankles a lot lately but they don't seem to get better. If this is the way my gait stays I guess I'm f**ked for life in every measure....
Don't worry man it will improve with time, now its hard for you but later everything will be ok because there is always a solution.
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Judging from the clip, I reckon you have very good proportions and the second femur surgery will be unnecessary. You're already 6 ft but in fact you look 6'1 in the video because of your longer tibias. The extra height from femurs will make you disproportionate, especially with shoes on.
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If you could do HGH treatment i think your recovery could be faster
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Here's another vid that's hopefully a bit clearer. The guy I got to help me film doesn't speak the greatest English, so I couldn't get him to track it better. I asked another guy what he though about my alignment and he said it looks fine. He thinks the awkward gait is due to the stiffness in the knee and ankle and thinks the right side looks worse than the left. When I walk the left feels unstable. When I put my legs together they line up as they should in a normal stance shown in the image attached. I know it's noticeable to others because people still regard me as a cripple and treat me sympathetically when I go out and I lead the life of a cripple.
<iframe width="420" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/MBo4vTAuFV0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
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Your alignment looks fine to me too.
How much walking are you doing at this point in your recovery? I was walking at least 2 hours a day, powering through the stiffness.
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You walk like having ballerina foot
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I've probably walked at least an hour a day since early August, but much of that walking was with severe ballerina. I was advised by the doctor I saw upon my return home to not weight bear until he felt I could do so, so in effect a good 3.5 months out of the 6 since frame removal were spent sitting and walking with a walker where 80% of my weight was being alleviated. I didn't immediately start walking since frame removal. I too hope that it is just this stiffness that I must power through now.
The reason I felt there was some bowleg was because whenever I viewed the walking from behind in the videos it seemed the ankles were bent inward from the knee during toe-off. However, I've watched videos of other people walking and it seems they too have the same effect in their gaits, like in this video:
(http://s30.postimg.org/6aysl42ul/gait.jpg) (http://postimg.org/image/6aysl42ul/)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VYVyoFdJHdU
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You walk like having ballerina foot
That's probably because I still have it. The alignment looks fine to you?
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why does your walking look like you're walking tip toes?
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Because I have ballerina still.
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Because I have ballerina still.
hope u get back to normal asap
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That's probably because I still have it. The alignment looks fine to you?
Yes it looks normal for me
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Do you have knee pain from your IM nails?
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No, I can fall onto cold hard concrete and pray to Allah with the most devoted if I were so inclined and the knees would not be an issue. I am very fortunate in that regard. I am hoping that my ankles will follow suite.
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I'm sorry you are struggling polycrates, I don't know much of post-surgery recovery but what I can say is that your proportions and ar lenght look absolutely normal to me, hope that is some consolation. I am unaware of what happened during your surgery, was there some sort of major complication that left you worse of than other patients or is this generally to be expected of such a drastic operation?
Again I really hope you will improve and I'm sure that eventually you will.
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Other than the toe paralysis I had there were no major complications, but I still do not know the complete ramifications of that paralysis. The toe moves up a bit, but not near as much as the right toe. For instance, I cannot touch the top of a shoe when I wear it with my left toe like I can with my right. All other movement in the ankle and everything appears fine, but I haven't had it officially evaluated for damage. I haven't seen enough of other people who did this to know what the average progression of recovery is at 10 months.
I am actually satisfied with my recovery thus far. The things that frustrate me are my worry that this might be as good as it gets, since I've done pretty much everything I can to try to improve the ankle flexibility, and even worse is that I am clearly debilitated in the eyes of others, as they always offer me assistance or ask what is wrong with me. That is definitely the most frustrating aspect of it all, knowing that to others there is something clearly off.
All this coupled with the fact that I've unequivocally accepted how s**tty this world is on the whole that I couldn't honestly care less about my body and its dimensions at this point. Before surgery, my opinion on that matter was vacillating, but now it is definitive and final. If I had that mentality as concrete beforehand I would never have ventured to undergo this procedure.
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I'm getting cautious of this surgery again after a period of optimism I would never trade my physical health for a few extra centimeters and -without meaning to offend- your level of ability is far from an acceptable end result in my opinion. I've also searched for successful examples of people recovering after the operation and moving on with their height issues solved but so far I have found mostly discouraging news.
The only real bother I have with lenghtening is my recovery afterwards unfortunately that is not only impossible to guarantee but it seems almost unlikely based on the evidence that I would ever be the same again. Hope I'm not coming of as a frightened kid but can anyone help me settle this:
Is leg lenghtening basically giving up your ability to use your legs properly to gain extra height or is it a painful and long procedure that one has to go trough in order to be taller but something that eventually will be just a memory?
-Polycrates, sorry to say this but your walk does not look normal. I'm sure it will improve if not by itself then surely there is some medical help to get.
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What in particular is it about the walk that makes it far from normal? This is what upsets me is that even in person, people say the same thing. They say the alignment is fine, but there is just something wrong but never identify it, lol. It's scary to me, because when I walk I feel like I'm walking normally, so...
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make a high definition video and have the camera sitting on a bench as you walk from right to left, and front to back and vice versa. and then I will be able to view it properly. wear a mask, and make sure your whole body is in the camera, make the video several minutes long and don't rush it. walk on hard surface. no hills.
im good at recognizing patterns.
or you could just try to guess it yourself.
my guess would be stride has changed because tibia might be longer than femur. don't know.
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I won't guess since there is no point to it, but I will hope that it is simply a stiffness issue that will resolve over time. I didn't think it would be that difficult to find a competent specialist in Canada, but i guess my estimation of the medical system was too great. I'll try to make a video like the one you've suggested tomorrow. Thanks for the input, it's greatly appreciated.
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I could be completely wrong and I was only able to watch 5 good seconds from the second video.
but what I noticed is that your left leg hits the ground in more of a flat angle, which has less spring, your right leg uses more tibia power to push up,
this means that your stride for your left leg looks more like it is not walking but rather being lifted moved forward and then placed down.
also when you turn direction your left foot does not twist with your body but rather stays in the same direction as you twist and it changes direction in more of a being dragged with the body type fashion.
ps maybe its normal but you have a lot of arm motion going on when you walk also.
am I the only 1 seeing this??? more video would be helpful.
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What you view is exactly the way it feels, as if the left leg is being dragged. This makes me fear that there is significant nerve damage to the leg that is causing it. This was the leg with the paralysed toe. I agree the arm motion is excessive. The guy recording said I should move my arms more as I walk, so I probably over compensated, lol.... But even so, I don't know exactly what to do with them now. I've literally forgotten how to walk.
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make sure you eat the full 90 vitamins and minerals, and eat several raw eggs every day in order to help rebuild myelin sheath. it might work.
i know how to cure neuronal diseases that are "incurable" in the brain, never even thought about this issue for other areas of the body before.
but the biology should be the same as it is the same tissue type more a less.
cooking the eggs will denature the spatial arrangement of the proteins and change the molecular structure. so it has to be eaten raw. make sure it is organic.
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Is leg lenghtening basically giving up your ability to use your legs properly to gain extra height or is it a painful and long procedure that one has to go trough in order to be taller but something that eventually will be just a memory?
LL is never just a memory. I had it 7 years ago and a wobble here, some stiffness there; there's always something to remind me my legs got broken and stretched out.
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It's really an individual matter. ShyShy claims to feel exactly as capable as before the surgery, just taller. He did say that his biomechanics changed, but he simply adapted to it. I think that femur lengthening might allow for better recovery than tibia lengthening. Femurs have more muscle and blood flow after all.
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LL is never just a memory. I had it 7 years ago and a wobble here, some stiffness there; there's always something to remind me my legs got broken and stretched out.
Does it bother you when you wake up or when your sitting randomly or is it when you start running or do sports etc...? Also how is your climbing and jumping down from height more than 2metres? Thanks!
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Does it bother you when you wake up or when your sitting randomly or is it when you start running or do sports etc...? Also how is your climbing and jumping down from height more than 2metres? Thanks!
Nothing's wrong when I first wake up, that's actually when I feel the best. And I don't have any random problems. My center of gravity is higher now so I wobble sometimes, especially in off-balance situations like getting into and out of a car. When I run or play sports, my endurance is worse than it was before, although my strength and top speed haven't suffered much. Climbing isn't a problem, and I haven't tried jumping down from that high.
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Medium, where abouts were you in your recovery 10 months post-op? Were you running and all those things by then?
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Medium, where abouts were you in your recovery 10 months post-op? Were you running and all those things by then?
10 months post-op I was still a little stiff and tight. I could almost walk normally. I could run although I avoided it except for one time when I almost missed a bus. It felt really weird the first time I tried it, like I was on stilts.
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Nothing's wrong when I first wake up, that's actually when I feel the best. And I don't have any random problems. My center of gravity is higher now so I wobble sometimes, especially in off-balance situations like getting into and out of a car. When I run or play sports, my endurance is worse than it was before, although my strength and top speed haven't suffered much. Climbing isn't a problem, and I haven't tried jumping down from that high.
Ok thank you. Sorry to bother you but I have 1 more question, how is your acceleration?
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Acceleration is as good as it was before.
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This study demonstrates that those whom underwent lengthening using the Ilizarov method regained all of there muscular strength and power within 3% only two years after the end of the surgery (amount of lengthening was shown to be irrelevant):
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20298828
You may still improve with time Polycrates. Are your tibiae longer than your femurs? Even a 1:1 ratio is probably pretty disadvantageous biomechanically, as your body weight is too far forward during strides, so that may explain your lack of balance MDOW.
Longer femurs are critical to keeping the center of gravity ideal for walking. I saw this in some paper on human evolution I read a while back (sorry no citation, disbelieve if you want to, no hard feelings). However longer femurs can be disadvantageous in some rare situations, which is why squatting with longer femurs is harder and also why it's easier for anyone to squat with blocks under their feet.
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I wonder how much of the walking issue is due to a changed femur-tibia ratio and to what extent it is an issue of never quite healing properly.
@Medium Drink of Water Can you work out like you could before? That is build muscle and running, you mentioned your endurance is worse than before but would you say it can still be improved if trained or will you never be able to run as far as you used to?
I guess the most imortant question is: was it all worth it?
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@Medium Drink of Water Can you work out like you could before? That is build muscle and running, you mentioned your endurance is worse than before but would you say it can still be improved if trained or will you never be able to run as far as you used to?
I guess the most imortant question is: was it all worth it?
Yes, I can work out like I did before. The endurance thing only applies to running. I can do the leg press machine as well as I ever could.
And yes, it's worth it. Being short is way worse than occasional wobbliness and loss of endurance when running.
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Yes, I can work out like I did before. The endurance thing only applies to running. I can do the leg press machine as well as I ever could.
And yes, it's worth it. Being short is way worse than occasional wobbliness and loss of endurance when running.
Can I ask just one more question: Do you feel weaker than before?
Like if you are living an illusion at 5'10 and you are not as strong as people naturally that tall.
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Yeah, everything from the knees up is the same as before.
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It's really an individual matter. ShyShy claims to feel exactly as capable as before the surgery, just taller. He did say that his biomechanics changed, but he simply adapted to it. I think that femur lengthening might allow for better recovery than tibia lengthening. Femurs have more muscle and blood flow after all.
I think its the opposite actually, i think tibia lengthening allows for better recovery than femur lengthening. My argument is that while the muscle is stretched regardless which segment you chose, the muscles in the calfs and thighs are used for very different things.
The calf muscles are seemingly used mainly to move toes and feet as well as working as a damper for your legs whenever your feet lands on the ground. In other words, these muscles are not primarily used for movement of the whole body. The thigh/upper leg muscles however, are the primary muscles which you use to move your legs around, its from them you generate force/acceleration to move your body forward.
This means that if you weaken your thigh muscles through LL it will likely have a bigger effect on your ability to run/walk/move compared to if your calf muscles where weakened through LL.
Also with femur lengthening there is the added issue with the mechanical/anatomical axis being changed.
Having more muscle and thus more blood flow only means the healing will go faster, so the difference in blood and muscle should not have an effect on the end result in terms of recovery.
Thats what i think at least.
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Well, I appreciate the feedback everyone has provided. I'm going to put to use the insight from the forum as well as people who've viewed me in person to try to improved my gait. It will be the focus of my life for the next two weeks. I'm going to take these vids down and I'll post a new one in approximately 2 weeks. I hope there will be substantial improvement.
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look forward to your next video Polycrates. gd luck with the recovery