Limb Lengthening Forum
Limb Lengthening Surgery => Limb Lengthening Patients Experiences => Topic started by: motoboarder on January 20, 2022, 09:51:28 PM
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Hello LL friends,
Just another case of limb lengthening here. I'm doing tibias + femurs at the Paley institutes. Dr. Robbins & Paley will perform on me. My tibia surgery already happened on the 01/18/2022. I've been super busy setting up the logistics for this journey. Therefore I wasn't able to post this diary earlier. I'll go back in the correct timeline to share with you guys what I've done to prepare for this. As also, any feedback/suggestion is much appreciated.
A little about me:
- Asian male, not married
- Age: 30 - 36
- Night height: 163cm, weight ~135 lbs
Background: I work in IT industry. Covid & working from home made this procedure an easy possibility.
Logistics: I reside in the west coast. I made a move to West Palm Beach (WPB) just for this journey. Yep you heard it right. I signed a 1-year lease for a 2d2ba apartment. My apartment is very close to their recommended extended hotels. I also work with 2 wheelchair taxi companies to assist with my commute. My reasoning for the move: I've spent hours reading previous patients' experiences, read the Paley's paper thoroughly, pretty much did my homework. I think the environmental support is also important for recovery. So I moved my whole life package here to ensure that. I had what I need every day to maintain an uplifting life: Sonos speakers, 55" TV, sofa, dining table, well setup living room, standup desk, work laptop + 2 monitors, etc you get the point.
Help: I was very very very lucky to have my older sister here with me. She flew here from Asia on a B2 visa and will be staying with me for about 3mo. She cooks plenty delicious food and is very caring - a great emotional support for me.
That's about it for intro. Let me know if I miss any info that could be useful for other LL patients or anyone wondering about this sophisticated adventure.
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testing..
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OK, here is the timeline of how my journey started.
Several years ago, I got to know about LL. At that point it was just a vague idea in my head and I wasn't sure I want to do it. I did a lot of readings about different doctors in the world. I concluded the top 3 in my researches: Dr Rozbruch NY, Shahab Mahboubian in CA, and the Paley Institutes.
End of summer 2021, I decided to have consultancy with Dr. R & Paley. I called both places to setup appt. The thing standing out with Paley's is that the process seemed well organized. They even sent potential patient a couple of research papers. Being an engineer myself, a process with thorough documentation stood out to me.
10/20/2021: I flew to NY to talk to Dr. R. My appt was at 1pm but I waited until 5pm to get to meet him. I was hungry and tired. I was glad to meet him in person and asked him the story about Sam (a pretty famous patient of R who did 8cm femur lengthening at the age of 25). Sam was recovering fine according to R. I think he is over 30yo now. Here I had my x-ray taken.
10/26/2021: Consultancy with Dr. Robbins at the Paley's institutes. I was given a tour of the area where all LL patients were being treated. I also got to talk to a guy who was lengthening his tibias. He did femurs a year before, and came back to do tibias. The institutes look nice and people seemed caring here. I felt that LL procedure has been engineered to be a mature program here. So I made the decision to go to Paley's.
--------------- IMPORTANT : STRETCHING PREPARATION FOR THE BIG SURGERY -------------------------
In my 1st consultant day with Dr. Robbins, he said I'm quite tight, that everybody's tight. He suggested me to do running stretches before surgery. I was doing it at least 30min every day from then until my surgery.
This is an example of my exercise: https://www.purewow.com/wellness/best-hamstring-stretches. But in each move, I pushed myself to the limit. At the end of the 2mo, I was able to perform these:
1. STANDING TOE TOUCH: my whole palm touched the ground and elbow almost touched the ground also. I.e. I can sniff my knee
6. SEATED HAMSTRING STRETCH: back straight, I can sniff my knee
8. SEATED WIDE-LEG HAMSTRING STRETCH: leaned a lot forward with my elbow touching the ground. I can sniff the floor.
10. LYING HAMSTRING STRETCH WITH BAND: leg on the ground is straight, raising leg formed a >90 degree angle with the other leg.
Just so you get the idea, just push more than the limit visualized in those pictures. My personal story, 2-3 weeks into stretching, my legs hurt a lot especially the hamstrings. I even developed drop-foot symptoms on my left leg, i.e. when I walk, the left foot drops more and even makes noticeable sound with my shoe lace. That went away later as it seemed the foot got used to the new looseness. 1+ mo into stretching, I got a feeling that I torn my left hamstring (like a sound you could hear/feel when you tear a piece of meat). This went together with a dark blue bruise at the back of my left thigh. Was a bit worried so I went to zoomcare to checkup, but it was OK. They advice me to go easy on myself (lol). Then fast forward 2mo into stretching, I was able to perform all those moves at ease. I could even hold each position for 45s instead of 30s. Then I knew that my hamstrings were much loosen.
01/10/2022 when I had pre-surgery talk with Dr. Robbins, he examined me and said that I'm very loose compared to other people.
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I was scheduled to have tibias surgery on 01/11/2022 and femurs on 02/01/2022 (3 weeks apart)
12/27/2021: Me & my sister flew to WPB. We had to stay in a temp airbnb place for 2 weeks before our apartment is ready for move-in.
01/07/2022: Moved in the new apt, rushing to setup things.
01/10/2022: Pre-surgery administration & PCR covid test
01/11/2022: Came in for surgery at 6am to find out my covid test was positive. They called me few hours later asked that I need to be quarantined for 7 day. My tibias surgery would be delayed to 01/18/2022. But my femur's stay the same. So it's only 2 week apart now.
01/18/2022: Came in at 6am. They prepped me for a pretty long time. MAKE SURE you revise everything you read before signing. My 1st surgery is tibias, but somehow the prepped paper was saying femurs which is wrong. I spotted it & alerted the nurses, explaining to them how my procedure works: tibias first, then 2-3 weeks later femurs. The nurse who composed the paper was called in to print another paper for me to sign. Things are good then at this point. Just a bit of confusion, no big deal. They also drew my blood again because the one done a week ago was no longer valid (they said those are only valid for 72h)
The anesthesia doctor came in to give me a consent before pumping the drug. I remember saying goodbye to my sister around 9-10am. Then they rolled me to a room with lots of bright white lights when I lost consciousness soon after. When I woke up it's already 3-4pm. They let my sister come in seeing me, and I knew the surgery was done. They rolled me to my care room.
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What is your lengthening goal?
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I'm aiming for 4cm tibia & 5.5cm femur
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I'm aiming for 4cm tibia & 5.5cm femur
Seems reasonable for quad lengthening. Good luck.
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Wow you waited 4 hours to see Dr R? That's a long wait. I have heard even patients end up waiting for hours before meeting him during follow-ups. He is also extremely expensive and I don't know if it's worth paying the extra price.
I think you made a great choice going to Paley institute. It's very well organised.
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Thanks Highest & yin. I'm discharged today. I'll post details of my 1st hospital stay when I get home.
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Hey man, I was really shocked to see your diary. Don't know you are an exact copy of me or my diary. I am doing quadilateral, original surgery date was 11th and on that day of surgery I was told I had covid then they asked me to quarantine for a week, And on 17th I went for a pre-op then paley's management told the nurses that no need for a covid test for me again and just finish the pre-op testing formalities. I was given a tag on my right hand and the surgery was morning 8 AM on 18th. My tibia surgery was done by 1 PM in the afternoon and I was rolled over the patient resting room where my wife was waiting to see me. OMG!! pretty much the same date, same covid confusion and same surgery model. I also moved to WPB to have this surgery done and not staying in paley's recommended hotes.....LOL!!!!
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My original tibial surgery date was 01/17/2022 but was pushed to 01/18/2022.
Expected femoral surgery date still remains the same 02/01/2022 (Feb 1st).I have only 2 weeks in between Hopefully everything goes good for me. Despite the first surgery date was pushed a week after my second surgery date remains the same as Paley is travelling and out of country for few weeks after the 2d Feb. That's what they told me.
I have a feeling that I saw on that day of surgery where they were doing a pre-op formalities including setting up the IV tubes. I believe I saw 4 guys but not sure which one are you and whether you saw me or not. Interesting!!!
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Hey buddy, I know who you are :-). PM me when you get a chance!
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Hey buddy, I know who you are :-). PM me when you get a chance!
Hey just PM you :). But not sure if it went through. It's been a while since I used any forum like this.
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Responded to your PM.
My legs are super swollen up until now and the femur surgery is in another 8 days. Hopefully the knee to toe swelling lessens well before the next surgery. If not then we will be super f**ked. At that time the swelling will be from hip to toe. Fingers crossed.
You weigh 135 lbs and I weigh 170 lbs so it's going to be more tougher for me than you. God speed.
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Hey motoboarder, one more tip while using the ice pack machine. You may already know this. When you keep it on for a longer period of times make sure to increase the room temperature. The first day when I kept for more than 20 hours I got chills and fever at least twice and I had to take more tylenol only for that. Then I asked the nurse could you increase the room temperature to 80 oh boy that helped a lot. The whole night night and day I was sweaty and ice packs on the legs do not bother at all and it felt really nice. I am doing the same thing at home as well. Hope that helps!!
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Hey buddy, your first outpatient PT is today at 7 AM right? How did it go?
Also, forgot to ask you, did you get your braces already? Have you been using them already? If yes can you share your experience with that?
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Hey buddy, your first outpatient PT is today at 7 AM right? How did it go?
Also, forgot to ask you, did you get your braces already? Have you been using them already? If yes can you share your experience with that?
1st world of advice: if you're out for early AM PT, wear warm. I wasn't prepared & wear a short. The morning cold worsened my pain.
Thanks man for the tips using the ice pack.
Yes I got my braces from Falk Prosthetics looks like they partnered with Paley. The boosts are customized for each patient now. They were heated to expand a bit to anticipate the swollen leg size when I came pick them up, so they weren't too bad to me. Experiences: wearing a long socks will probably help. When I didn't wear socks, the area close to my toes pushed against the base, so it hurts and woke me up at night. A long socks should help your legs "breath" better. I wear short socks so the back of my tibias kinda "sticky" against the boosts, but wasn't too bothering me.
1st PT was OK with basic stretches of the calf & hamstring. My left leg is fine but the right one has a weird annoying pain: a tiny twist of my foot would radiate a sharp lev-8 pain to my tibia bone (I think) where the breakage is. So it's annoyingly sensitive if someone/something collides with my ankle or foot front even just softly. Do you have any similar symptom? I'll ask for an x-ray taken tomorrow if they let me.
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1st world of advice: if you're out for early AM PT, wear warm. I wasn't prepared & wear a short. The morning cold worsened my pain.
Thanks man for the tips using the ice pack.
Yes I got my braces from Falk Prosthetics looks like they partnered with Paley. The boosts are customized for each patient now. They were heated to expand a bit to anticipate the swollen leg size when I came pick them up, so they weren't too bad to me. Experiences: wearing a long socks will probably help. When I didn't wear socks, the area close to my toes pushed against the base, so it hurts and woke me up at night. A long socks should help your legs "breath" better. I wear short socks so the back of my tibias kinda "sticky" against the boosts, but wasn't too bothering me.
1st PT was OK with basic stretches of the calf & hamstring. My left leg is fine but the right one has a weird annoying pain: a tiny twist of my foot would radiate a sharp lev-8 pain to my tibia bone (I think) where the breakage is. So it's annoyingly sensitive if someone/something collides with my ankle or foot front even just softly. Do you have any similar symptom? I'll ask for an x-ray taken tomorrow if they let me.
You can ask your PT to give you pairs of compression socks. They are free and I probably got 6 pairs.
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You can ask your PT to give you pairs of compression socks. They are free and I probably got 6 pairs.
Thanks SuchLL, I'll ask the PT.
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Hey man, thanks for the update on your first PT experience. I thought mine is today but it actually starts tomorrow at 4 PM. By the way when is your appointment to get the lengthening device? Have you already started lengthening?
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How's your experience been? How are things moto?
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Hey, I've had similar pain when twisting leg (femur though). In my case it was new bone growth rubbing against soft tissues. Your doctor should be able to assess that on your x-ray.
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I think I'm in an OK state now. I've been focusing on PT, surviving pain period, logging my pain meds etc. My pain is currently manageable >2w after femur surgery. I'll add details soon.
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I know I'm embarrassingly behind my own diary. I think I left off from my 1st surgery on Jan 18th. So here you go, as much as I remembered + what I had in my notebook. A lot of tiny details happen when you're hospitalized. Here I only cover what I think matter. During my hospital stay, my sister came in every day to bring extra food, help me with chords, and a great emotional support. Things would be much harder without her.
01/18/2022:
* Tibia surgery early AM, finished around 2-3pm. My poor sister was so worried why it took so long. Eventually she could meet me in my recovery room.
* Right after tibias surgery, I felt fine. My sister also said my skin color looks normal (Note to compare to later femurs surgery)
* My feet are wrapped with a "pumping" machine which stimulate blood flow. Also, my tibias are covered with the ice-cube machine to help reduce swollen
* When being hospitalized, nurses visited you every 4h. I think many other LL patients already covered this. They occasionally give you pain meds, muscle relax meds, etc.
* ~21:00: After like 30min stimulating my peepee with youtube videos playing sound of waterfall (lol), I could pee a good 1000 ml. Somehow managed not to wet the bed. Feeling much better & lighter after letting go of that toxic fluid.
* 23:05: started to have roller coaster pain, pain level 4-7
* 23:55: Shooting pain wave from midnight to 2am. I tried to sleep through it without pressing the "Pain" button to call nurses. Eventually it passed after 2am. Some background here: I used to dislocate my right shoulder due to snowboarding. That day, I waited 45min for rescue team, 15min for them to roll me downhill (in lots of pain), drove myself to the hospital in 45min, waited 3h for doc to come to fix my shoulder. The last hour before I meet the doc, I almost passed out that I couldn't standup by myself for x-ray, so that a male nurse had to hold me. No pain meds whatsoever during this whole period. Anyway, I think this pain experience prepared me a lot for my LL surgery in general.
01/19/2022:
* 04:40: A nurse came in to draw 2 tubes of my blood
* 11:50: 2 PTs came in to teach me basic PT, how to use wheelchair
01/20/2022:
* 14:30: With my sister help, I was able to wheel to the toilet, transfer & make a bowel movement. Feel even much better than after peeing.
* 15:00: Finished PT. They taught me how to use the walker on this day. It was very jerky as it was my ever 1st time with a walker.
01/21/2022:
* 08:00: Some constant pain level 2-5 had bothered me since the night before. I asked for 2 pills of Tylenol 325mg. After breakfast & meds, the pain was more comfortable.
* 10:15: Dr. Robbins & nurses came in to check on me. I might have wiggled my feet too much that right after they left, I had shooting pain level 7-8 in my right tiba. For the 1st time I pressed "Pain" button & asked for 1 oxycodone 5mg. My nurse this day Alex was very nice & thorough. I got a high relaxing feeling after oxy, then the pain was also gone. Alex carefully went through the discharge document w/ me. 1 important point she mentioned was to stop taking Xarelto (prevent blood clot) at least 4 days before my femurs surgery.
* 15:00: Discharged. Then nothing eventful at home this day if I remembered correctly. Lower legs were still very swollen. They gave me the ice-cube machine for this.
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Hey, I've had similar pain when twisting leg (femur though). In my case it was new bone growth rubbing against soft tissues. Your doctor should be able to assess that on your x-ray.
Then did they do anything about your case i.e. new bone rubbing soft tissues? Do you still have this pain?
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In my case also that new bone growth is there on the side rubbing the soft tissues and it pains a lot as well for me. Dr. Robbins showed me in my X-rays but he said it will get dissolved in few days until then you will feel some discomfort. Definitely that's a lot of discomfort for me and when I press them I feel like 2 big rocks attached to the side of my legs. Now I feel like that discomfort is slowly fading away. The physician assistant Dayna mentioned me that you can take ibuprofen for a short duration that will stop the new bone growth on the side. But I asked her isn't ibuprofen interfere with bone growth at later stage. She explained me that you are not advised to take ibuprofen only at the time of bone consolidation after the lengthening period is over. Now you are at the very early stage and you can take the ibuprofen to suppress the extra bone growth on the side. I bought the ibuprofen but still I haven't started taking it.
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I took ibuprofen and the pain disappeared in about 1-2 weeks
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In my case also that new bone growth is there on the side rubbing the soft tissues and it pains a lot as well for me. Dr. Robbins showed me in my X-rays but he said it will get dissolved in few days until then you will feel some discomfort. Definitely that's a lot of discomfort for me and when I press them I feel like 2 big rocks attached to the side of my legs. Now I feel like that discomfort is slowly fading away. The physician assistant Dayna mentioned me that you can take ibuprofen for a short duration that will stop the new bone growth on the side. But I asked her isn't ibuprofen interfere with bone growth at later stage. She explained me that you are not advised to take ibuprofen only at the time of bone consolidation after the lengthening period is over. Now you are at the very early stage and you can take the ibuprofen to suppress the extra bone growth on the side. I bought the ibuprofen but still I haven't started taking it.
Not sure if I've experienced the same just lat night (early 02/17/2022): Around 2AM while sleeping my left tibia felt noticeable pain in the exact spot where new bone is growing. I woke up to check and saw a bump. I slowly massaged & pushed it inward so that my skin area became flat as normal. As soon as this was done, the pain disappeared immediately. Well they said our body/bone heal while we sleep. If this was truly the case I think I was "lucky" to observe new grown bone & shaped it back myself! Nonetheless, this is just my guess. I'll wait until next Monday x-ray to see how it looks. The bump felt like a hard clay.
GodsGrace, were you referring to your femur or tibia?
My left & right femurs both showed new bones on the side according to 1st visit x-ray which was 1-2 weeks ago or something. During that time sleeping on either side was definitely uncomfortable. However I didn't notice any pain, maybe because they were dissolved now by this point, idk..
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Not sure if I've experienced the same just lat night (early 02/17/2022): Around 2AM while sleeping my left tibia felt noticeable pain in the exact spot where new bone is growing. I woke up to check and saw a bump. I slowly massaged & pushed it inward so that my skin area became flat as normal. As soon as this was done, the pain disappeared immediately. Well they said our body/bone heal while we sleep. If this was truly the case I think I was "lucky" to observe new grown bone & shaped it back myself! Nonetheless, this is just my guess. I'll wait until next Monday x-ray to see how it looks. The bump felt like a hard clay.
GodsGrace, were you referring to your femur or tibia?
My left & right femurs both showed new bones on the side according to 1st visit x-ray which was 1-2 weeks ago or something. During that time sleeping on either side was definitely uncomfortable. However I didn't notice any pain, maybe because they were dissolved now by this point, idk..
I was absolutely referring to Femurs for the side bone growth.
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Hi guys,
Feel strange to come back here after not writing my diary at all (lol). I was truly busy with rest & exercise during my lengthening phase. Before surgery, I collected a lot of useful tips from this forum. Hope I can give back something to help future people who consider this procedure.
Long story shorted, as a quad patient, I stopped lengthening tibias on 4/5 and femurs on 4/24/2022. I lengthened 4cm for tibias, 5.6cm for femurs (5.7 for my right femur cuz it was naturally a bit shorter). Now I'm in consolidation.
I didn't have a full diary. I figured people would come here looking for concise info. So feel free to ask me anything.
Full x-ray taken on 4/22/2022 (few days before stop lengthening altogether) https://imgur.com/jMpFnWZ
And 1st monthly x-ray (they forgot to order my femurs x-ray, so only tibias)
https://imgur.com/Kf1NdFX
https://imgur.com/miy8fVE
https://imgur.com/zk5FJqD
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Amazing almost 10cm gain! First of all I wish you a good a speedy recovery. Two questions
1) Why did you stop at the amount you did?
2) are you happy about the results as in height gained and proportionally? Is the neurosis gone?
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Thanks informationispower
1) Why did you stop at the amount you did?
2) are you happy about the results as in height gained and proportionally? Is the neurosis gone?
1. I reached my goal, and I wanted a healthy recovery & life after LL. Motorcycle & snowboard are the things I'll love to get back to. Genetically I'm from Asia. The culture where I'm from, my new height is considered tall.
2. Honestly I started to feel content at +8.5cm mark. Proportion is a bit stretch theoretically, because my wingspan is 167cm. However if I pull my pants 3-4cm below the belly button, I think I look fine (while walking with the walker).
Height neurosis is looooong gone! To elaborate.. I used to have days that I laid down hours on the sofa doing nothing. Somehow at the back of my head, I knew I was unhappy with my own statue. Now, I'm productive throughout the day and that I'm still on wheelchair. I'm introvert type, lived alone for several years (alone - but not lonely, if you listen to Alan Walker's haha). I believe I had inner peace. Now after LL, feel like my inner peace expands even further.
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I am also curious, having done both segments, which one in your opinion has a bigger inflyence proportionally? As in which one can accomodate more length before looking odd? Femur or Tibia?
Sorry if the question sounds studpid or weird
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..which one can accomodate more length before looking odd? Femur or Tibia?
All good, think I understand your question. Subjectively I'd say femur. Observing my own image (standing/walking with walker), with pants on I sometimes feel the tibia is longer than femur (in a good proportional way), even though I lengthened it less. I guess this's because our thighs are concealed by pants, giving the impression that they only run from crotch to knee. Whereas the lower legs are fully exposed, plus the vertical height of our feet which is not even part of tibias length. Statistically this makes sense because most LLers lengthened their femurs. And at +6/+7cm mark, their proportion still looks fine with casual clothes.
From a medical standpoint, bone length: tibia/femur = 0.8 +/-0.02. If you have consultancy for LL, the doctor will assess your ratio and advise whether you're a candidate for tibia or femur lengthening. Mine was 0.81 before surgery.
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Hi Motoboarder, how did you find the quality of care with Dr. Paley and his team overall? I'm seeing him for a consultation in 2 weeks and hoping to schedule the procedure within the next few months, and I'm wondering if in the end you found it worth the $$$ he charges. I'm willing to pay it since everyone seems to have pretty glowing reviews of the guy and his practice, but always nice to get a more recent patient's perspective.
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hi Oswego. Yeah at ~2mo into consolidation now, I still think it worth the price. 2 surgeons will operate on your legs, Dr. Paley & Dr. Robbins each does 1 leg. During lengthening, you'll meet an amazing PT team who are very good at their job and provide awesome emotional support. Overall convenient logistics for patients. If I'd to pick the best feature, it's the PT team.
You're in good hand. Good luck with your journey ahead. Ask to speak to a patient during your consultancy if possible.
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Did you start walking? If so how long did it take you to walk? I mean bear weight.
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Nope I'm not allowed yet, still walking with the walker. Legs felt more sturdy each day, feel like I'm 80% weight bearing. I started walking with the walker on the day I stopped lengthening April 20th-ish.
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Hi, I did LL by my parents! Now I am already 181.5cm barefoot from 165cm! How about the current physical pains?
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Hi, I did LL by my parents! Now I am already 181.5cm barefoot from 165cm! How about the current physical pains?
lol I think I could barely understand you. Did you already lengthen or are you planning to go from 165 to 181? Right now I have no pain whatsoever. Legs feel like a pair of normal legs. Some people reported having knee pain after starting to walk. I'll keep you guys posted.
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Hello lads. Here's my monthly x-ray update.
https://imgur.com/a/YHbAFS3
My right femur bone is skewed toward inside of the thigh. Does anyone know if the bone would shape more normal as it heals further? I'm waiting on Dr. Robbins for his comments.
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And the response I got from Dr. Robbins
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hello
your xrays from --/--/22 show very nice interval healing of all bones
i am not concerned about the bone healing
you can stop crutches/walker
you can start walking without support if you have good balance and strength
you can stop xeralto
you can WALK only for the next month
no jumping,, running, sports
please send new xrays in one month
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Hi motoboarder thank you so much for this informative diary, glad to see you're recovering well! I am also in the IT industry and work remotely, I was wondering how many months do you recommend taking off work for this procedure? Or can I continue to work while going through the process?
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Hey motorboarder! Thank you. It’s really informative diary and I m hoping to see your walking videos! Good luck on your journey!
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Hey man, Can you tell if femur is more difficult or tibia? I got early consolidation in my femurs at 6cm and now I have 2 options. Either to rebreak or go for tibia after a year. What do you think I should do?
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Hey man, Can you tell if femur is more difficult or tibia? I got early consolidation in my femurs at 6cm and now I have 2 options. Either to rebreak or go for tibia after a year. What do you think I should do?
Definitely rebreak femurs with nail in place. The amount of money and time for a whole new tibia surgery is immense.
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Yes , that will be very interesting to know that
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how is your gait now? i want to do quad with similar length (total 10~11cm), i wonder how many months needed to look unnoticable while walkin?
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I think my gait is quite good now and the feeling when walking is getting closer to normal. My gait was definitely NOT normal the first month or so of walking unaided. Elaborated: I felt a weakness spot on my right femur, causing right leg to feel weak/discomfort to put force on. As a result, my posture slightly tilted to the right when walking & putting weight on that side. Within the last month or so, this issue visibly lessened each week.
I think someone asked about proportion post lengthening. Here's my standing take at the end of July. Walking pic with long pants taken around mid-August.
https://imgur.com/a/6p1Uyge
Timeline summary, for my case I'd say, I'll be very comfortable with my walking at 5mo after stop lengthening. Long distance walking (i.e. hiking) is a different story though as I'll need to work on my cardio.
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About weight: you'll gain weight fast after starting to walk partially with crutches and unaided. My weight has been 148 to 152lbs since around last month, measured with minimum at-home clothes on.
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About weight: you'll gain weight fast after starting to walk partially with crutches and unaided. My weight has been 148 to 152lbs since around last month, measured with minimum at-home clothes on.
Do you think you would be able to walk normally sooner if you were allowed to weightbear sooner?
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Do you think you would be able to walk normally sooner if you were allowed to weightbear sooner?
Personally, I don't think so. Rushing to walk may cause bones to not heal/shape appropriately and once it hardens, becomes a permanent issue worse than delaying a few months of not walking. I strictly followed my doctor's advices during recovery so I guess it takes as long as it takes. The bones have to heal sufficient enough to provide a foundation for the muscles to regain their strength.
Unrelated, there's a friend whose father suffered a car incident & injured his right tibia. He rushed to walk. Now his 2 legs are permanently unequal. And you can guess, the right leg is shorter.
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Personally, I don't think so. Rushing to walk may cause bones to not heal/shape appropriately and once it hardens, becomes a permanent issue worse than delaying a few months of not walking. I strictly followed my doctor's advices during recovery so I guess it takes as long as it takes. The bones have to heal sufficient enough to provide a foundation for the muscles to regain their strength.
Unrelated, there's a friend whose father suffered a car incident & injured his right tibia. He rushed to walk. Now his 2 legs are permanently unequal. And you can guess, the right leg is shorter.
Would you recommend me to do quadrilateral for 13cm? Im 159-160 cm currently.
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Would you recommend me to do quadrilateral for 13cm? Im 159-160 cm currently.
No, likely too much. I'd say between 8-10cm, 2 segments. Lookup user "GodsGrace" he posted in my diary too. He was your height and he did well with 9.6 or 9.7cm. We met in-person at Paley's during lengthening.
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No, likely too much. I'd say between 8-10cm, 2 segments. Lookup user "GodsGrace" he posted in my diary too. He was your height and he did well with 9.6 or 9.7cm. We met in-person at Paley's during lengthening.
I see. Do you think you could have done 13cm? Would have it been too difficult?
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No, neither. I had numbness at the front of my right tibia at about 2week left of lengthening (to hit my goal). So I think pushing to 10cm would be difficult, let alone 13cm.
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No, neither. I had numbness at the front of my right tibia at about 2week left of lengthening (to hit my goal). So I think pushing to 10cm would be difficult, let alone 13cm.
so, what will be the total time until you have unnoticable gait?
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so, what will be the total time until you have unnoticable gait?
"unnoticable" could be judged by anyone. If by me, I'd say I'm unnoticeable now. So, with the amount of lengthening I did, about 4-5mo after stop lengthening. +3mo of lengthening without slow-down since the date they broke my legs. You're looking at 7-8mo in total.
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"unnoticable" could be judged by anyone. If by me, I'd say I'm unnoticeable now. So, with the amount of lengthening I did, about 4-5mo after stop lengthening. +3mo of lengthening without slow-down since the date they broke my legs. You're looking at 7-8mo in total.
that's wonderful, congrats bro.
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Finally find someone who did the surgery that I am intended to take. Hi, I am also an Asian at 168cm. I am having a hard time choosing whether to do the 4 cm increase or the 4+4 type. Do you think you could obtain 90% athletic abilities when fully recovered? I still want to go climbing and the gym to keep a healthy body. What did you doctor talk about athletic abilities recovery. Will that be your concern?
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Finally find someone who did the surgery that I am intended to take. Hi, I am also an Asian at 168cm. I am having a hard time choosing whether to do the 4 cm increase or the 4+4 type. Do you think you could obtain 90% athletic abilities when fully recovered? I still want to go climbing and the gym to keep a healthy body. What did you doctor talk about athletic abilities recovery. Will that be your concern?
I think you should be fine to retain 90% fitness ability. I haven't asked my doctor specifically but I feel feasible to get to 90% of mine, given that I'm still in recovery. You'll do fine with either 4cm any segment or 4+4, as long as you don't slack on stretching.
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that's wonderful, congrats bro.
Thanks balme
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Well done, dude. At consolidation + 6 months I'm doing pretty well. I walk more or less normally, although if I do a lot of walking I will still feel sore afterwards. I'm far from being as flexible as pre-op but then again I don't stretch :-p I still feel funny because of the rods though, and I think that won't go away until removal.
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So in how many days you reached your goal?
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motoboarder, do you know what were your tibia&femur length before surgery?
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So in how many days you reached your goal?
Precisely about 3mo & 5 days, from the day I had my 1st surgery on tibias to the last day of lengthening.
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Well done, dude. At consolidation + 6 months I'm doing pretty well. I walk more or less normally, although if I do a lot of walking I will still feel sore afterwards. I'm far from being as flexible as pre-op but then again I don't stretch :-p I still feel funny because of the rods though, and I think that won't go away until removal.
Thanks dude. Well done on your progress as well. Yeah, a lot of walking also bothered me. I think it takes exercises to get better each day/week. And same here about the funning feeling in legs especially around the knee areas. I'm sure removal will help. I heard prior LLers said that they felt like 1k% better after the nails were out.
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@motoboarder Did you have concerns about your arm length? after lengthening both legs
and cost? I heard it was increased
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@motoboarder Did you have concerns about your arm length? after lengthening both legs
and cost? I heard it was increased
Not much. I mean it is what it is now. My arm span now is ~5cm shorter than my height. And I don't want any arm lengthening. Costs differ by doctors. My cost was $195k I think at the beginning of this year. It covered 2 surgeries + 70 hour of PT (14 weeks, M-F 1h/day).
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Not much. I mean it is what it is now. My arm span now is ~5cm shorter than my height. And I don't want any arm lengthening. Costs differ by doctors. My cost was $195k I think at the beginning of this year. It covered 2 surgeries + 70 hour of PT (14 weeks, M-F 1h/day).
oh ok my hand goes like perfectly in my pocket now. So if i lengthen by 10cm, i should still have the same hand position in my pocket?
I found out that my wingspan is negative because i have narrow shoulders and a small hand. My arms are actually just slightly below average.
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How much do you think your pre-surgery stretching helped? Paley said in his recent interview with Cyborg4Life that he doesn't think it helps/needed and stretching only have short term effect (was kinda surprised hearing that).
And how was the process of lengthening both segments? Did it make it harder to do stretches or anything like that?
Did you do PT in your apartment as well? Or you drove to their place from the beginning?
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I'm thinking of doing precise 2.2 tibias with Dr. Giotikas someday. What are some of the biggest differences you noticed between femur and tibia lengthening?
I'm doing gnail internal femurs now
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How much do you think your pre-surgery stretching helped? Paley said in his recent interview with Cyborg4Life that he doesn't think it helps/needed and stretching only have short term effect (was kinda surprised hearing that).
And how was the process of lengthening both segments? Did it make it harder to do stretches or anything like that?
Did you do PT in your apartment as well? Or you drove to their place from the beginning?
Pre-stretching helped a lot, I'll still recommend it. I pre-stretched for 2 months every day.
Lengthening both segments require harder work and better preparation. IMO I think a refreshing nutritious non-depressing living environment is a HUG factor. Apparently more stretches. I stretched 3-5 times a day every day during lengthening - including the 1h PT M-F they provided.
I did therapy 1h/day M-F at Paley's PT center. I signed contract with a wheelchair van service paying them weekly to have them transport me back and forth. Then more PTs in my apartment.
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Pre-stretching helped a lot, I'll still recommend it. I pre-stretched for 2 months every day.
Lengthening both segments require harder work and better preparation. IMO I think a refreshing nutritious non-depressing living environment is a HUG factor. Apparently more stretches. I stretched 3-5 times a day every day during lengthening - including the 1h PT M-F they provided.
I did therapy 1h/day M-F at Paley's PT center. I signed contract with a wheelchair van service paying them weekly to have them transport me back and forth. Then more PTs in my apartment.
Yeah I read that you stretched so much - that's impressive!
Can you share a little bit about your lengthening process? Did you have any issues / numbness / tightness etc? Don't think you wrote much about it :-[
What do you mean by "refreshing nutritious non-depressing living environment"? Are you referring to their PT center or just in general?
How's the experience in a wheelchair van? Wondering about it as well. Do you also mind sharing how much you paid?
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Yeah I read that you stretched so much - that's impressive!
Can you share a little bit about your lengthening process? Did you have any issues / numbness / tightness etc? Don't think you wrote much about it :-[
What do you mean by "refreshing nutritious non-depressing living environment"? Are you referring to their PT center or just in general?
How's the experience in a wheelchair van? Wondering about it as well. Do you also mind sharing how much you paid?
Yeah, thanks!
Little about my process:
- My 1 issue was the 1 week delay of tibias (1st) surgery due to me catching covid lol. As a result my 2 surgeries were 2w apart instead of 3. However it was manageable for me in my 30s.
- 1-2 weeks after each surgery is pretty hard: prolonging painful in legs, very hard to sleep, sweat almost all night due to pain. I drank oxycodone almost every night during these initial periods.
- Disturbing night sleep pattern - all LLers mentioned this. Once I was in the process, I felt like it became the norm and I no longer noticed it as an issue. To aid night sleep, I usually waited several days to couple weeks to drink a 10mg oxycodone. This thing could cause addition but at my rate of consumption it didn't for me. I took naps during the day whenever the body demanded to compensate.
- According to comments form PTs at Paley's I didn't have tightness at all during the process. I think this is thank to my pre-stretch + frequent stretching + my super well living condition during the time + my lengthening goal was moderate.
- I had numbness at the front area of my right tibia toward the last 2w of lengthening. I was only lengthening femurs at this point as tibias were already done. So this was interesting. I knew another femur-only patient here who also had the same pattern of numbness. Though he almost maxed out the 8cm.
"refreshing nutritious non-depressing living environment" - I referred to my living space. Paley's care center is super awesome too. The center is super clean and smells nice. All the PTs are helpful & personable. My living space:
- Spacious 2b2ba apt for me & my sister as my caretaker. I literally relocated to FL just for this procedure. I signed a year lease so I didn't have to stress about moving out after lengthening completion.
- Took 3mo off work
- Plenty nutritious food cooked everyday by my sister
- Surrounded speakers, huge TV, xbox one, PS4, etc for entertainment. As said, I literally relocated here.
This thing by itself is critical I think:
- Single-minded mentality for LL: no pokes from nosy friends (I don't have any nosy ones), no work, no sxx, no going out (just Paley's & my home), etc you get the point. I lived as a comfortable peaceful disabled person who appreciated life during this time. By having no distraction from normal life aspects, I think it helped my mind+body take the LL process as a new norm instead of a burden. While many LLers despite the lengthening+recovery process, I myself enjoyed it (knowing that it had an ending). It gave me some new interesting perspectives of life.
Wheelchair van was good, very secure. I recommended the service I used in my sig. In fact I became good friend with the driver who ran this as his home business. Because it was his business, I'll give you a range: it's $80-$120 daily round trip. The price depends on distance, as my apt was only 4-5 miles from St. Mary hospital. Ask for discount if doing 5-day a week contract.
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Wow that's super helpful, thanks!
"Disturbing night sleep pattern" - You mean you'd wake up throughout the night but you just see it as "part of the process"? At this point you were in pain or was it more of an "inconvenience"?
I read about your relocation - I think that's super smart and can definitely be a game changer. That's personally a strong incentive for me to do it locally. And totally agree with you on the mentality, hopefully I'll be in a similar mindset 8)
$80-$120 (let's call it $100 ;)) per day isn't cheap. Uber/Lyft weren't significantly cheaper? Even with your sister with you, you were worried about it?
Care yo share about "It gave me some new interesting perspectives of life"? Appearing the ability to walk and take care of yourself a lot more? :)
One last thing, any equipment you recommend purchasing pre surgery?
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Congrats, Motoboarder, and thank you for sharing!
As you mentioned, you took three months off from work. Do you think it is manageable if I still work 8 hours/day, for example, starting from the third week post-op? Thank you!
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Precisely about 3mo & 5 days, from the day I had my 1st surgery on tibias to the last day of lengthening.
It's a bit longer than normal I think. How many mm did you lengthen per day? and how is your bone healing so far?
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It's a bit longer than normal I think. How many mm did you lengthen per day? and how is your bone healing so far?
Total 1.25mm/day. Bone is healing fine.
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Congrats, Motoboarder, and thank you for sharing!
As you mentioned, you took three months off from work. Do you think it is manageable if I still work 8 hours/day, for example, starting from the third week post-op? Thank you!
Thanks!
I wouldn't recommend it. For me, I know 100% I wouldn't be able to manage that even from the 3rd week. The mind is constantly bothered by stretched muscles you really could only afford to lengthen & rest. Lengthening is the new full-time job if you will. After lengthening was done I went back to full 8h/day work. However I had to take breaks throughout the day lying on the bed because sitting long hour felt tired. The condition improved significantly within 1-2 mo of consolidation.
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Wow that's super helpful, thanks!
"Disturbing night sleep pattern" - You mean you'd wake up throughout the night but you just see it as "part of the process"? At this point you were in pain or was it more of an "inconvenience"?
I read about your relocation - I think that's super smart and can definitely be a game changer. That's personally a strong incentive for me to do it locally. And totally agree with you on the mentality, hopefully I'll be in a similar mindset 8)
$80-$120 (let's call it $100 ;)) per day isn't cheap. Uber/Lyft weren't significantly cheaper? Even with your sister with you, you were worried about it?
Care yo share about "It gave me some new interesting perspectives of life"? Appearing the ability to walk and take care of yourself a lot more? :)
One last thing, any equipment you recommend purchasing pre surgery?
"Disturbing night sleep pattern" - it's more painful & occasional waking up in the first 1-2 weeks only. After that it's shorter than avg night sleep (<8h). I'd say it's not pain, just discomfort you have to bear as part of the process. For me it's femur lengthening hardship + the very uncomfortable ankle boots (sorry it's been so long I forget what it's called. It's the thing you wear to keep your ankle muscles from getting tight. I wear them ALL THE TIME except when taking shower). Trust me, it pays off handsomely if you work hard during this period!
I just didn't want to deal with the cumbersome process of loading me on wheelchair to a lyft/uber. It's not common. Wheelchair vans is a service so you can rest assure that nothing would go wrong.
"It gave me some new interesting perspectives of life" - more like I lived as a disable person temp and came to realize I appreciated life more during that period. It just felt peaceful during consolidation when I couldn't walk yet and stayed indoor 100%. So now that I'm fully recovered, I won't take things for granted. Facts, research also shows people with disability on avg are more happy than people without.
I'd recommend installing the bidet to cleanup when you go #2. You can only do that before breaking your legs lol. Other things you can order from Amazon as the lengthening process goes. Having a helper is still recommended. I think I have link to the bidet in my 1st post.
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I'd recommend installing the bidet to cleanup when you go #2. You can only do that before breaking your legs lol. Other things you can order from Amazon as the lengthening process goes. Having a helper is still recommended. I think I have link to the bidet in my 1st post.
That's such a great idea - just ordered one! I was worried about that part being tougher ::)
What about shower bench / cold packs / small exercise bike? Did you need any of that?
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That's such a great idea - just ordered one! I was worried about that part being tougher ::)
What about shower bench / cold packs / small exercise bike? Did you need any of that?
Yeah I bought a shower chair. Cold packs were given by the hospital - I only need them for the 1st month or so though. I didn't buy any exercise bike. Paley's PT center has that. We have 1h PT each day 5 days a week.
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Yeah I bought a shower chair. Cold packs were given by the hospital - I only need them for the 1st month or so though. I didn't buy any exercise bike. Paley's PT center has that. We have 1h PT each day 5 days a week.
Got it! ;)
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Total 1.25mm/day. Bone is healing fine.
Do you have any recent x-ray?
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Do you have any recent x-ray?
They're in my diary. Last ones were taken in July/Aug I think. I haven't had one after my doctors approve me for unaided walking.
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Were femurs or Tibias more painful? What do you rate the pain levels for each segment 1-10?
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I heard that the tibias are more painful than femur but also I remember one of the patient said that from their experience femurs are harder than the tibia.I think it changes from person to person
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Yep pretty much that. For me tibias had more sharp pain during the first few weeks, but easing out throughout lengthening. Femurs structure was simpler but heavier, so the pain felt more like an exhaustive pain throughout. They're different kinds of pain, not apple to apple.
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Hi! Any updates?
How about your walking and athletic ability now?
All pains go away?
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I think the most difficult part is achilles tendon and it is my worst nightmare about doing tibias...... I think long tibias are more attractive but the ballerina syndrome and the recovery process is scaring me actually. How is your Achilles right now?
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If you have recent imaging data please put it at this thread. Redact any information that could be used to dox you.